Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Jaggsy1979 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:29 am Curious to know others thoughts...on another note if we were NOT after those players, then who the hell are we after?

NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:41 am

Jaggsy1979 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:29 am Curious to know others thoughts...on another note if we were NOT after those players, then who the hell are we after?

Coaches.

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:48 am

NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:41 am

Jaggsy1979 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:29 am Curious to know others thoughts...on another note if we were NOT after those players, then who the hell are we after?

Coaches.

Apparently we are looking at a couple of under 16 coaches from burnley and tottenham to join Ross and the boys.

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 11:40 am McCallum is a NL player tbh, no loss there.

I don't think we're after anyone, wouldn't be surprised if Cissé is the only signing of the summer (and I'm bloody glad we got him).

Club looks to be going into financial survival mode for this season, lumbered with the squad from last season unable to afford any additions. In the current climate seems like batten down the hatches and ride out next season with the view other clubs won't be able to do the same.

Could be seen as prudent business wise but risky on the football front. Blind faith in the NL squad coming good this time round...

As a player coming in the club doesn't really have a footballing identity now, not really somewhere you're going to move up the pyramid via promotions or to work with a strong experienced manager to improve your game.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 12:30 pm Doesn't have a football identity what are you on about you really do spout some nonsense, do you think Cisse is here by accident, he believes in the club obviously a lot more than some of our fans.

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:29 pm Style of football and football identity are different though, are they not?

You were using that example to explain why players won't come here as they won't get promotions (even though we had one a year ago) to move up the ladder (well worded because as you know we've had many move up the ladder lately) or an experienced manager. We don't have an experienced manager though.

If you're talking style of football now, it really is the most overrated aspect of football by an absolute country mile. The top clubs can parachute players in to fit a system, the vast majority have to parachute players in to fit a budget. Also, if our style was 'total football' it would be a constant moan on here of how 'that don't work in League 2!!!!!', if it was ugly hoofball we'd be told he can't get them playing.

I think you've just chosen your horse and running with it regardless.

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:22 pm

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 12:30 pm Doesn't have a football identity what are you on about you really do spout some nonsense, do you think Cisse is here by accident, he believes in the club obviously a lot more than some of our fans.

Let me flip that back on you, based on last season what is our style of football under Embleton?

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:02 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:29 pm Style of football and football identity are different though, are they not?

You were using that example to explain why players won't come here as they won't get promotions (even though we had one a year ago) to move up the ladder (well worded because as you know we've had many move up the ladder lately) or an experienced manager. We don't have an experienced manager though.

If you're talking style of football now, it really is the most overrated aspect of football by an absolute country mile. The top clubs can parachute players in to fit a system, the vast majority have to parachute players in to fit a budget. Also, if our style was 'total football' it would be a constant moan on here of how 'that don't work in League 2!!!!!', if it was ugly hoofball we'd be told he can't get them playing.

I think you've just chosen your horse and running with it regardless.

I say it because one of the things coming out of the Sotiriou saga was that he didn't like the defensive style Embleton plays. How much truth in it is up for debate as the whole thing is one bit rumour mill but if that were correct you could see why certain flair players might think twice about Orient.

The salary cap now adds a twist to this, cost of living in London might work against us now we have the same cap as a club outside the M25. Only time will tell on how that system pans out.

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:02 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:29 pm Style of football and football identity are different though, are they not?

You were using that example to explain why players won't come here as they won't get promotions (even though we had one a year ago) to move up the ladder (well worded because as you know we've had many move up the ladder lately) or an experienced manager. We don't have an experienced manager though.

If you're talking style of football now, it really is the most overrated aspect of football by an absolute country mile. The top clubs can parachute players in to fit a system, the vast majority have to parachute players in to fit a budget. Also, if our style was 'total football' it would be a constant moan on here of how 'that don't work in League 2!!!!!', if it was ugly hoofball we'd be told he can't get them playing.

I think you've just chosen your horse and running with it regardless.

I say it because one of the things coming out of the Sotiriou saga was that he didn't like the defensive style Embleton plays. How much truth in it is up for debate as the whole thing is one bit rumour mill but if that were correct you could see why certain flair players might think twice about Orient.

The salary cap now adds a twist to this, cost of living in London might work against us now we have the same cap as a club outside the M25. Only time will tell on how that system pans out.

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:15 pm

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:02 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:29 pm Style of football and football identity are different though, are they not?

You were using that example to explain why players won't come here as they won't get promotions (even though we had one a year ago) to move up the ladder (well worded because as you know we've had many move up the ladder lately) or an experienced manager. We don't have an experienced manager though.

If you're talking style of football now, it really is the most overrated aspect of football by an absolute country mile. The top clubs can parachute players in to fit a system, the vast majority have to parachute players in to fit a budget. Also, if our style was 'total football' it would be a constant moan on here of how 'that don't work in League 2!!!!!', if it was ugly hoofball we'd be told he can't get them playing.

I think you've just chosen your horse and running with it regardless.

I say it because one of the things coming out of the Sotiriou saga was that he didn't like the defensive style Embleton plays. How much truth in it is up for debate as the whole thing is one bit rumour mill but if that were correct you could see why certain flair players might think twice about Orient.

The salary cap now adds a twist to this, cost of living in London might work against us now we have the same cap as a club outside the M25. Only time will tell on how that system pans out.

Yes, but then don't forget the rumour that Sotiriou was offered contracts at 4 Championship clubs Under 23 teams in January (including Huddersfield) but specifically chose to see the season out at least as he personally is known to really rate Embleton's style of football. That's got to be taken into account surely?

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:15 pm

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:02 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:29 pm Style of football and football identity are different though, are they not?

You were using that example to explain why players won't come here as they won't get promotions (even though we had one a year ago) to move up the ladder (well worded because as you know we've had many move up the ladder lately) or an experienced manager. We don't have an experienced manager though.

If you're talking style of football now, it really is the most overrated aspect of football by an absolute country mile. The top clubs can parachute players in to fit a system, the vast majority have to parachute players in to fit a budget. Also, if our style was 'total football' it would be a constant moan on here of how 'that don't work in League 2!!!!!', if it was ugly hoofball we'd be told he can't get them playing.

I think you've just chosen your horse and running with it regardless.

I say it because one of the things coming out of the Sotiriou saga was that he didn't like the defensive style Embleton plays. How much truth in it is up for debate as the whole thing is one bit rumour mill but if that were correct you could see why certain flair players might think twice about Orient.

The salary cap now adds a twist to this, cost of living in London might work against us now we have the same cap as a club outside the M25. Only time will tell on how that system pans out.

Yes, but then don't forget the rumour that Sotiriou was offered contracts at 4 Championship clubs Under 23 teams in January (including Huddersfield) but specifically chose to see the season out at least as he personally is known to really rate Embleton's style of football. That's got to be taken into account surely?

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:04 pm

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 1:22 pm

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Aug 07, 2020 12:30 pm Doesn't have a football identity what are you on about you really do spout some nonsense, do you think Cisse is here by accident, he believes in the club obviously a lot more than some of our fans.

Let me flip that back on you, based on last season what is our style of football under Embleton?

You seen unsure what football identity is, style of play is different from the profile a club has that makes it what is.

Football wise I thought we looked better as the season went on, difficult for Embleton early on because of everything going on around JE we were a club very much in transition, he was managing "JE's team". Being elevated into that position too early in his career didn't help Ross and he was clearly conflicted wanting to do the best thing for the club whilst being uncomfortable and finding the pressure difficult, but I think anyone of Ross's age would be the same. That said his demeanour is much better now he seems more positive and confident and like it or not he is highly regarded by the players and enough to pursuade a very good player in Cisse to sign for us when he had other options.

To be honest we were no better or worse than 60% of league two for most of the season for most of it we looked a very average team in a very average league. But it's a game of fine margins as was proven once Cisse arrived, it galvenised people (fans included) and allowed others in the team to push forward and I thought we looked capable going forward in the last few games and much better than we did for the earlier part of the season.

Profile wise I think we identify as a solid community club and a squad with some very talented players, we have a great fanbase and are very well run by the owners, that alone will help some players decide they want to be here, we clearly have the potential to push on to a top half finish but let's see who we bring in before now and the start of the season.