Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:12 pm**

Stamford O wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:30 pm Like others I knew it was a risk but wanted to help club out.Will do so again next season, if God forbids things aren't better .hope owners never want their money back or we will be up sh1t creek.

Same, S_O

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:42 pm**

This threads gone weird.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:05 pm**

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:05 pm
JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:00 pm
Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:54 am

Very touchy Jimbo, he hadn't insulted anyone it's his opinion and on this occasion one I agree with.
So I can call you a twaghead in future correspondence then as it's not an insult?
I think RedO called you that. If you look at my response it was to Thors post.

Thors post agreed with REDo and you agreed with that, so what conclusion do you expect me to draw?

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:08 pm**

I get what RedO is saying, legally you have no right. But talking of loyalty, which is very much what this is about and what the club should foster, the circumstances have changed - regardless of if you predicted them - and whilst the club don't HAVE to do anything, it feels strange that they would want to charge more to the loyal customers.

Theres not a right or wrong answer, it's a tricky one. Not sure why this has got so nasty though.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:10 pm**

I'm sure theres nothing in the T&C's about ST holders getting priority tickets in a normal yeah, if we drew Man U at home in the FA cup, but you'd expect the club to honour that loyalty with priority tickets.

Its not all black and white.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:14 pm**

The club have dropped a massive bollock by not having another option for the season that meant people could protect their seat. I certainly would have done that and not shelled out £300 for the prospect of on my laptop watching a bloke who doesn’t want to be a manager, leading a team with players playing out of position.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:19 pm**

Thor wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:49 am No he shouldn’t have called you that and I was not commenting on that, but his point is correct in that it was clear what we were signing up for. My wife even said to met you do realise what you’re doing, I said yes please carry on.

Fair enough.

I personally didn't realise that I would be signing up to pay more than people who are watching the games on individual basis. That's part of the reason I signed up for a season ticket is that it's cheaper than on a game by game basis the other being to help the club out. So if the whole season is played behind closed doors (which is not beyond the realms of possibility) and it's a tenner a game the punter whose chose the other option is £100 better off than me. I thought season tickets were supposed to be an incentive to give your cash up front to help the club and be better off because of it and you wouldn't be out of pocket. Silly me.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:29 pm**

jimbo some clubs may not make it unless a significant cash injection is made to support that club. I do believe we won't be one of them and each supporter who has bought a season ticket is once less chance of it being us.

We have heard the owners say what the shortfall will be and it is upto them to cover that. That's cold hard cash out of their pockets for 7 numbers, a lot of cash.

So whilst its not what we want (stream) it's not what they want either as they lose gate money, beers, food etc. All chances of our ability to minimise that loss gone for now. So whilst we as season tickets may be out of pocket we will be the first back in the ground as I don't see full attendance being on the radar for quite sometime yet.

Plus you've helped your club in a period of global concern and helps to keep us going in our 139 / 140 year of existence. Its special and you've helped it, be proud of that.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:31 pm**

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:08 pm I get what RedO is saying, legally you have no right. But talking of loyalty, which is very much what this is about and what the club should foster, the circumstances have changed - regardless of if you predicted them - and whilst the club don't HAVE to do anything, it feels strange that they would want to charge more to the loyal customers.

Theres not a right or wrong answer, it's a tricky one. Not sure why this has got so nasty though.

Sorry mate, you know I love a moan as much as the next fan, if not more, but there’s no case here.

The club owners came out with their begging bowl and asked us to help them out by renewing our season tickets, even though there was no certainty of any of us being allowed in. They made it quite clear that there wouldn’t be any refunds. There was every likelihood that this would be a donation.

The offer of a free stream - as advertised when you bought your ticket - is merely a small compensation for not being allowed in. It is in no way meant to fully cover your loss.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:34 pm**

JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:19 pm
Thor wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:49 am No he shouldn’t have called you that and I was not commenting on that, but his point is correct in that it was clear what we were signing up for. My wife even said to met you do realise what you’re doing, I said yes please carry on.
Fair enough.

I personally didn't realise that I would be signing up to pay more than people who are watching the games on individual basis. That's part of the reason I signed up for a season ticket is that it's cheaper than on a game by game basis the other being to help the club out. So if the whole season is played behind closed doors (which is not beyond the realms of possibility) and it's a tenner a game the punter whose chose the other option is £100 better off than me. I thought season tickets were supposed to be an incentive to give your cash up front to help the club and be better off because of it and you wouldn't be out of pocket. Silly me.

Some of us are abroad for match days so only pay £7 per game, not £10. We’re nearer £150 better off.

Sorry about the twaghead thing, it’s just a joke, I didn’t realise anyone would get so upset by such an inoffensive ‘insult’.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:35 pm**

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:14 pm The club have dropped a massive bollock by not having another option for the season that meant people could protect their seat. I certainly would have done that and not shelled out £300 for the prospect of on my laptop watching a bloke who doesn’t want to be a manager, leading a team with players playing out of position.

This was my thinking.

I’m gutted that I’ve - possibly - lost the seats I’ve had for years and would have happily paid a small retainer fee to keep hold of them.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:36 pm**

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:10 pm I'm sure theres nothing in the T&C's about ST holders getting priority tickets in a normal yeah, if we drew Man U at home in the FA cup, but you'd expect the club to honour that loyalty with priority tickets.

Its not all black and white.

That is definitely advertised as the deal, you get priority for home and away games.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:44 pm**

RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:36 pm
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:10 pm I'm sure theres nothing in the T&C's about ST holders getting priority tickets in a normal yeah, if we drew Man U at home in the FA cup, but you'd expect the club to honour that loyalty with priority tickets.

Its not all black and white.
That is definitely advertised as the deal, you get priority for home and away games.

Probably not in the t&c's though right? It's not binding.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:47 pm**

Don’t know if it’s in there or not but they are clearly advertised and sold on that basis. Would need a legal expert to comment further, not sure if there are any on here.

So yes, the club would give ST holders priority for such games, no question.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:02 pm**

RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:31 pm The club owners came out with their begging bowl and asked us to help them out by renewing our season tickets, even though there was no certainty of any of us being allowed in. They made it quite clear that there wouldn’t be any refunds. There was every likelihood that this would be a donation.

The offer of a free stream - as advertised when you bought your ticket - is merely a small compensation for not being allowed in. It is in no way meant to fully cover your loss.

Agreed. It was perfectly clear that buying a season ticket meant a different thing this season than normal, and effectively paying a premium to be able to go to games as and when fans can do so again. I don't care one tiny bit that a non-season ticket holder can watch the streams for less cost per game than me, I handed my money over knowing full way I was paying that premium, as far as I'm concerned the excess is a donation and I'll say "you're welcome" to every "thank you" that Nigel, Kent, Danny et al give out.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if there will be some sort of incentive/reward (financial or otherwise) for 2020/21 season ticket holders when it comes to the 2021/22 season ticket offering

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:25 pm**

Can't see football being attended in 20/21 sadly.
Let's just hope there's a league of some sort of description by September 2021. The footballing landscape will look a whole lot different by then, how much longer can the current situation be sustained, goodwill of supporters or not.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:51 pm**

RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:25 pm
JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:47 am
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:50 am

I take it you aren't 1 of the 60 %+ who voted No Refund then.

Lets get it right , the only people penalizing you is the Government ,
As they are the ones restricting crowds entry by law & understandably so

All those involved at the highest ranks of the club.are doing is
FOLLOWING GOVERNMENTS RULE OF LAW during an ever changing pandemic .

All it will take is 3 or 4 players from say 30% of all clubs to test positive & footy
Will be stopped wuick enough .
Yes i didn't ask for a refund.

I'm not expecting to be in the ground this side of xmas.

However if i'd known I'd be paying more for getting a season ticket with streaming access rather than someone whose just paying for Streaming the games I wouldn't have signed up.
You honestly thought they were going to start charging £15 - £20 to stream the game? Get outta here!

So you're saying you wouldn't pay a bit more to help the club out then?

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:03 pm**

JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:51 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:25 pm
JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:47 am

Yes i didn't ask for a refund.

I'm not expecting to be in the ground this side of xmas.

However if i'd known I'd be paying more for getting a season ticket with streaming access rather than someone whose just paying for Streaming the games I wouldn't have signed up.
You honestly thought they were going to start charging £15 - £20 to stream the game? Get outta here!
So you're saying you wouldn't pay a bit more to help the club out then?

I made my position quite clear when I chose not to renew. I couldn't justify/afford spending £300/£400 on season tickets when there was a real likelihood of receiving no product.

I am still happy to pay £7 to watch the streams on a match by match basis, order merch from the club shop etc.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:12 pm**

Thor wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 2:29 pm jimbo some clubs may not make it unless a significant cash injection is made to support that club. I do believe we won't be one of them and each supporter who has bought a season ticket is once less chance of it being us.

We have heard the owners say what the shortfall will be and it is upto them to cover that. That's cold hard cash out of their pockets for 7 numbers, a lot of cash.

So whilst its not what we want (stream) it's not what they want either as they lose gate money, beers, food etc. All chances of our ability to minimise that loss gone for now. So whilst we as season tickets may be out of pocket we will be the first back in the ground as I don't see full attendance being on the radar for quite sometime yet.

Plus you've helped your club in a period of global concern and helps to keep us going in our 139 / 140 year of existence. Its special and you've helped it, be proud of that.

Thor Fair enough I did it to help the club but surely it's not just season ticket holders who should be asked to help out.

I would've thought that those stream the games would be happy to have a price increase per match to help the club. Then when fans go back in the grounds you can revert back to a tenner.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:13 pm**

I genuinely thought we'd be able to attend perhaps at least half of the games.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:20 pm**

RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:03 pm
JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:51 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:25 pm

You honestly thought they were going to start charging £15 - £20 to stream the game? Get outta here!
So you're saying you wouldn't pay a bit more to help the club out then?
I made my position quite clear when I chose not to renew. I couldn't justify/afford spending £300/£400 on season tickets when there was a real likelihood of receiving no product.

I am still happy to pay £7 to watch the streams on a match by match basis, order merch from the club shop etc.

Huh, a tight-fisted accountant - who would have thunk it

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:22 pm**

BoniO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:20 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:03 pm
JimbO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:51 pm

So you're saying you wouldn't pay a bit more to help the club out then?
I made my position quite clear when I chose not to renew. I couldn't justify/afford spending £300/£400 on season tickets when there was a real likelihood of receiving no product.

I am still happy to pay £7 to watch the streams on a match by match basis, order merch from the club shop etc.
Huh, a tight-fisted accountant - who would have thunk it

And one that lives in France on the weekend and every other Tuesdays.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:26 pm**

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:22 pm
BoniO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:20 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:03 pm

I made my position quite clear when I chose not to renew. I couldn't justify/afford spending £300/£400 on season tickets when there was a real likelihood of receiving no product.

I am still happy to pay £7 to watch the streams on a match by match basis, order merch from the club shop etc.
Huh, a tight-fisted accountant - who would have thunk it
And one that lives in France on the weekend and every other Tuesdays.

Haha - well if he's doing all that travelling it's no wonder he "can't afford" a season ticket

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:32 pm**

possible solution
what about if some fans attend the first half and then leave, and then some fans attend the second half
This might appeal to all the people who leave early week before the end they can go 1st half
And might appeal to all the people who are late every week they can go 2nd half
everyone wins !!
Sound good to me !

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:34 pm**

The players only attend the second half tbf

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