Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Sounds like me tbh.

Dunners wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 6:46 pm

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 4:44 pm Just watched a Garys Economics video and he says Labour will fail because although they're being 'sensible' with the economy they aren't tackling inequality and are making the same mistakes the democrats did. Unless they can halt the slide in living standards they'll lose the next election.

Did he do that thing where he takes 20 minutes to sum up a point that could be made in under 5?

Well i just summed up a 20 minute video in one post, so yes.

GibbO wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 6:25 pm

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 6:08 pm

The Mindsweep wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:13 pm

Can you point me to the growing evidence please

https://www.ft.com/content/7e8b47b3-793 ... d75d057fff

Trader who claimed to be the most profitable trader in the world was actually only extremely profitable.

Many such cases.

But he’s not a “trader”; he’s a person who now has a Patreon income and uses his boasts about his achievements as credentials for his analysis.

If his credentials are bullshit, then what does that say?

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 7:43 pm

GibbO wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 6:25 pm

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 6:08 pm

https://www.ft.com/content/7e8b47b3-793 ... d75d057fff

Trader who claimed to be the most profitable trader in the world was actually only extremely profitable.

Many such cases.

But he’s not a “trader”; he’s a person who now has a Patreon income and uses his boasts about his achievements as credentials for his analysis.

If his credentials are bullshit, then what does that say?

He was a trader though. And as you say, his analysis wasn’t wrong.

I've only recently become aware of this guy. He seems - whilst admittedly being a little long-winded - to have good analysis and well thought-out opinions on economics.

I notice some responses on that twitter to his videos that are calling him a grifter - but none with any evidence of "the grift" - so I'd just assumed them to be the usual bot-farm ad hominem attacks on the messenger rather than any argument to his points. Other than "wealth taxes don't work" or "tax the rich - yeah that won't work", they didn't really respond to his main point - they just called him a grifter.

For clarity - a load of people calling someone a grifter (or an anti-semite, for another example) doesn't really constitute "evidence" of that accusation - does it ?

I'm happy to be put right on any points I'm unsure of.

His economic analysis is good and he's successfully tapping into the left behind generation.

Not sure what his activism is other than to say everyone needs to get together and end the neoliberalism that enabled him to become a millionaire.

StillSpike wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 8:33 pm I've only recently become aware of this guy. He seems - whilst admittedly being a little long-winded - to have good analysis and well thought-out opinions on economics.

I notice some responses on that twitter to his videos that are calling him a grifter - but none with any evidence of "the grift" - so I'd just assumed them to be the usual bot-farm ad hominem attacks on the messenger rather than any argument to his points. Other than "wealth taxes don't work" or "tax the rich - yeah that won't work", they didn't really respond to his main point - they just called him a grifter.

For clarity - a load of people calling someone a grifter (or an anti-semite, for another example) doesn't really constitute "evidence" of that accusation - does it ?

I'm happy to be put right on any points I'm unsure of.

I think the thrust of it is that alongside his analysis there’s a lot of vague allusions to “work behind the scenes” that needs funding, and runs a patreon, which can always get a bit murky.
There’s a lot of money in telling people what they want to hear

Is he a multi millionaire then?

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 9:45 pm Is he a multi millionaire then?

Yes, but he doesn't like to talk about it.

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:04 pm You’re aware that there’s growing evidence that Gary is a bullshitting grifter?

Not that he’s not right here, but I mean that’s hardly sticking the neck out, is it?

Very interested in seeing this evidence please.

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 6:46 am

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:04 pm You’re aware that there’s growing evidence that Gary is a bullshitting grifter?

Not that he’s not right here, but I mean that’s hardly sticking the neck out, is it?

Very interested in seeing this evidence please.

Haven’t you learned by now that I’m right about this stuff?
Seen Jack Monroe on telly lately?

I can honestly say I have never seen Jack Monroe on television, ever.

I’ve been aware of this guy for some time. I obviously fully agree with his messaging and assumed his back story was all true without considering the need to verify. I also thought, if he gained traction, as he now seems to have done, then the usual suspects would come for him.

The only time I was a bit ‘Oof, really?’ was when some tickets to see him ‘on tour’ popped up on my feeds at something stupid like £50 a head.

“I can honestly say I’ve never seen Jack Monroe on television”

Oh, Poover Attack!

Seriously though - the “oooff £50 for a ticket” is the kind of thing I mean.
There’s always money in charging well meaning people with a fair bit of money to make them feel like they’re part of the solution to people having less money. Seeing Gary make simple points drawn out over twenty minutes = Jack Monroe selling tinned food cookbooks to people who will never read them.
Basically, unlike JM, I don’t think there’s anything majorly scandalous here, but he’s just another of those people who carefully places themselves in a specific, lucrative niche

But I don’t care that much about this guy, I just suspect that at best he’ll just be a cultural commentator, changing nothing, at worst the balance will shift towards more iffy stuff

He was confirming my world view so I didn’t feel the need to verify anything he said was actually true

AI's view...

British left-leaning fans of Gary Stevenson often describe him as a compelling and authentic voice for economic justice, blending insider credibility with a relatable, working-class edge. They tend to praise him as a "truth-teller" who exposes the rigged nature of capitalism, with many on platforms like X and Reddit calling him a "genius" or "hero" for his clear breakdowns of inequality and his push for wealth taxes—often framing him as a rare figure who’s "been in the belly of the beast" at Citibank and emerged to fight for the little guy.

"Describe Gary Stevenson's attitude to his own wealth viz-a-viz his economic policies"

Gary Stevenson’s out here stanning for wealth taxes to dismantle systemic inequities, but he’s lowkey gatekeeping his own $12 million stack instead of redistributing it to uplift marginalized communities. He’s got the vibes of a class warrior, yet his praxis is sus—talking liberation while clutching privilege kinda dims his whole glow-up.

"Harsher, with expletives"

Gary Stevenson’s a sanctimonious f*cking fraud, banging on about wealth taxes to screw over others while he hoards his $12 million like a greedy b*stard, not tossing a single sh*tty dime to the poor he pretends to give a f*** about. He’s a gutless, hypocritical silly sausage who’d rather guilt-trip the rich than dip into his own goddamn stash—total bullshit masquerading as righteousness.

Heads up faldO - AI tells you what you want to hear.

Just hope this guy doesn't turn out to be the left's next Russel Brand.

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 9:42 am Heads up faldO - AI tells you what you want to hear.

It's certainly put me right on a few points I was unsure about with this bloke.

This is so f*cking predictable.

Every single time someone even the teensiest little bit slightly left of centre, not towing the Established line, picks up a little bit of support, then boom. In they come.

Based on what you’ve written here faldO, it simply gave you answers tailored to what you might find interesting based on your phrasing.

It doesn’t assess evidence for or against, it doesn’t look at what’s reliable. It just generates text based on the probability that it will function as a relevant coherent response

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 9:52 am This is so f*cking predictable.

Every single time someone even the teensiest little bit slightly left of centre, not towing the Established line, picks up a little bit of support, then boom. In they come.

Maybe the problem is with immediately adopting people who are “a teensy bit left of centre” who grow a conscience then quickly monetise it?

I mean, come on… “Gary’s Economics” - it’s a brand, isn’t it?

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 9:42 am Heads up faldO - AI tells you what you want to hear.

Gary Stevenson of Gary's Economics has earned a positive reputation for his clear, approachable teaching style. His ability to break down complex economic concepts and make them understandable to a wide audience is one of his standout qualities. Whether it's simplifying macroeconomic theories or diving into current economic events, his content is well-suited for students, educators, and anyone interested in economics.

What makes him particularly effective is his focus on accessibility—he often uses relatable examples and clear visuals to help viewers grasp abstract ideas. This makes learning about economics less intimidating for beginners, while still offering valuable insights for more advanced learners.

From an educational perspective, his videos can be a great resource for anyone looking to understand economics in a more practical, down-to-earth way. If you’re someone who enjoys learning through video content, Gary’s Economics can definitely be a helpful tool.

I hope Chat has me down as one of the more advanced learners....

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 9:52 am This is so f*cking predictable.

Every single time someone even the teensiest little bit slightly left of centre, not towing the Established line, picks up a little bit of support, then boom. In they come.

Well... yeah. If you want attention, then you have to accept it when it comes. That means being prepared for scrutiny and challenge. At a minimum, do not embellish your story, as you'll only be found out and it will undermine your credibility.

As for this bloke, my view is that he has introduced a much needed alternative discourse into the wider economic debate. His economic analysis is simplistic, but that's fine if the intention is just to widen the debate.

However, I'm yet to see any evidence that he's reaching new parts of the population with this message, and isn't just singing (selling) to the choir. I'm happy to be wrong on this, and I do note that he mentioned in a recent video that Labour have ben in touch to come onto his channel and discuss his ideas with him. He hasn't agreed to this yet but, if he really thinks he has a compelling argument, then he should debate it with the likes of Torsten Bell and be prepared for his arguments to be stress-tested.

Dunners wrote: ↑Mon Mar 24, 2025 10:05 am scrutiny and challenge

Damn those righties with all their scrutinising and challenging.

I mean, not to keep banging that drum but there was a time when criticising Jack Monroe had one marker out as a far right troll.