Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am**

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:16 am We don’t know the conversations behind closed doors but I’m sure, in the current climate, that this sort of stuff gets signed off by the man who ‘is responsible for the football side throughout the whole club’. I would guess that it’s not a coincidence he wasn’t on the Q&A.

If you are a director in any company you are held accountable for your decisions, good and bad, and I don’t think this would be any different.

Martin Ling is a director in name only at the club. As such he is not accountable in the way you suggest.

Has any accuser stopped for one single moment to think that ML may be one of the victims. He does not look the healthiest of individuals these days (he's like a mini fatty Evans) and could even be hit hard by the virus.

Nobody gets a harder time on here than ML - I'm surprised he hasn't been blamed for the ticket office fiasco yet........give it time, I suppose.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:13 am**

I suppose the only people who need to worry about the job ling is doing or anyone else are owners.they obviously aren't worried.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:14 am**

This is an operational issue and falls at the door of Macklin. I can see why Ross is involved too, being with the squad on a day to day basis.

I don’t see how Lingy has any responsibility for this.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:32 am**

RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:14 am This is an operational issue and falls at the door of Macklin. I can see why Boss is involved too, being with the squad on a day to day basis.

I don’t see how Lingy has any responsibility for this.

Interesting one - obvs I don't agree that this is an operational issue, the football side (including the medical staff) all ultimately report up to Ling. It's the playing staff who were affected, so there's no way he can escape at least some degree of responsibility.

Personally, I don't make Macklin responsible, but others have pointed out he would have doubtless been aware too - with £120k at stake for the cup game you can't imagine he would have said much to challenge the decision. I think it's quite well known that Ling considers himself to be more senior than Macklin too (whether or not that is the case in reality, we might be about to find out)

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:33 am**

Stamford O wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:13 am I suppose the only people who need to worry about the job ling is doing or anyone else are owners.they obviously aren't worried.

They're not letting on to you that they're worried, no.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:36 am**

LittleMate wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:16 am We don’t know the conversations behind closed doors but I’m sure, in the current climate, that this sort of stuff gets signed off by the man who ‘is responsible for the football side throughout the whole club’. I would guess that it’s not a coincidence he wasn’t on the Q&A.

If you are a director in any company you are held accountable for your decisions, good and bad, and I don’t think this would be any different.
Martin Ling is a director in name only at the club. As such he is not accountable in the way you suggest.

Has any accuser stopped for one single moment to think that ML may be one of the victims. He does not look the healthiest of individuals these days (he's like a mini fatty Evans) and could even be hit hard by the virus.

Nobody gets a harder time on here than ML - I'm surprised he hasn't been blamed for the ticket office fiasco yet........give it time, I suppose.

Ticket office is Macklin, obvs. Actually, you could make a case for that part of the business being under-invested because so much of the budget goes on Ling and his chums. There you go

Good point about him being ill though. Would be more likely to believe it if it had been mentioned last night, or if he'd ever showed any degree of public accountability since that gruesome session post-Fletcher. To be fair to all the others, even Embleton, they do always front up.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:40 am**

Disoriented wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 7:27 am Martin Ling’s responsibility is football matters, not epidemiology.

I don't think Disoriented would argue he is one of/if no the biggest Martin Ling critic here, and even he doesn't feel the need to turn this into a thing about Martin Ling.

Maybe something for the OP, Biggsy, AW etc to look at.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:43 am**

Regardless of whom is responsible for keeping an eye on players health with this Covid 19 virus, a wake up call for all football clubs to have a system in place to quickly isolate and test anyone reporting to be feeling even slightly unwell with the smallest of symptoms of this dreadful virus. Same also goes for all sports clubs, regardless of which sport they are involved in.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:52 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:32 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:14 am This is an operational issue and falls at the door of Macklin. I can see why Boss is involved too, being with the squad on a day to day basis.

I don’t see how Lingy has any responsibility for this.
Interesting one - obvs I don't agree that this is an operational issue, the football side (including the medical staff) all ultimately report up to Ling. It's the playing staff who were affected, so there's no way he can escape at least some degree of responsibility.

Personally, I don't make Macklin responsible, but others have pointed out he would have doubtless been aware too - with £120k at stake for the cup game you can't imagine he would have said much to challenge the decision. I think it's quite well known that Ling considers himself to be more senior than Macklin too (whether or not that is the case in reality, we might be about to find out)

Do you honestly think we’re paying Lingy his six figure salary to trawl through the gov.uk websites Covid guidance in the workplace?

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:54 am**

LittleMate wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:16 am We don’t know the conversations behind closed doors but I’m sure, in the current climate, that this sort of stuff gets signed off by the man who ‘is responsible for the football side throughout the whole club’. I would guess that it’s not a coincidence he wasn’t on the Q&A.

If you are a director in any company you are held accountable for your decisions, good and bad, and I don’t think this would be any different.
Martin Ling is a director in name only at the club. As such he is not accountable in the way you suggest.

How do you know he isn't?

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:55 am**

Whoevers fault it was, anyone on here who thinks that someone wont be accountable and possibly in the sh*t for this is a bit deluded imo. Anything like this that happens you conduct a lessons learnt. Especially when lives are at risk and your governing body offers absolutely no guidance or care at all.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:57 am**

FIND A SCAPEGOAT

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am**

RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:52 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:32 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:14 am This is an operational issue and falls at the door of Macklin. I can see why Boss is involved too, being with the squad on a day to day basis.

I don’t see how Lingy has any responsibility for this.
Interesting one - obvs I don't agree that this is an operational issue, the football side (including the medical staff) all ultimately report up to Ling. It's the playing staff who were affected, so there's no way he can escape at least some degree of responsibility.

Personally, I don't make Macklin responsible, but others have pointed out he would have doubtless been aware too - with £120k at stake for the cup game you can't imagine he would have said much to challenge the decision. I think it's quite well known that Ling considers himself to be more senior than Macklin too (whether or not that is the case in reality, we might be about to find out)
Do you honestly think we’re paying Lingy his six figure salary to trawl through the gov.uk websites Covid guidance in the workplace?

No, I'm saying anyone in a leadership position of that significance, with responsibility for as many people as he is, should be able to make better decisions in these circumstances. You'd be rightly cheesed off if your boss had made you turn up for work in this pandemic when half your team was unwell.

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for? It's obviously not to do interviews or turn up to Q&As like last night when even the ball boy showed up.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:08 am**

RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:57 amFIND A SCAPEGOAT

BREAKING NEWS: Danny Webb rehired by the club.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:15 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:52 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:32 am

Interesting one - obvs I don't agree that this is an operational issue, the football side (including the medical staff) all ultimately report up to Ling. It's the playing staff who were affected, so there's no way he can escape at least some degree of responsibility.

Personally, I don't make Macklin responsible, but others have pointed out he would have doubtless been aware too - with £120k at stake for the cup game you can't imagine he would have said much to challenge the decision. I think it's quite well known that Ling considers himself to be more senior than Macklin too (whether or not that is the case in reality, we might be about to find out)
Do you honestly think we’re paying Lingy his six figure salary to trawl through the gov.uk websites Covid guidance in the workplace?
No, I'm saying anyone in a leadership position of that significance, with responsibility for as many people as he is, should be able to make better decisions in these circumstances. You'd be rightly cheesed off if your boss had made you turn up for work in this pandemic when half your team was unwell.

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for? It's obviously not to do interviews or turn up to Q&As like last night when even the ball boy showed up.

Was the club Doctor at the Q&A?

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:20 am**

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:15 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:52 am

Do you honestly think we’re paying Lingy his six figure salary to trawl through the gov.uk websites Covid guidance in the workplace?
No, I'm saying anyone in a leadership position of that significance, with responsibility for as many people as he is, should be able to make better decisions in these circumstances. You'd be rightly cheesed off if your boss had made you turn up for work in this pandemic when half your team was unwell.

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for? It's obviously not to do interviews or turn up to Q&As like last night when even the ball boy showed up.
Was the club Doctor at the Q&A?

No, because they're trying to protect him too. I respect them for that much.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:27 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for?

Separate issue (although I can't answer it).

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:30 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:20 am So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?

So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:32 am**

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:30 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:20 am So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?
So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?

and, I'm sure you noticed, Embleton & Macklin.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:33 am**

RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:27 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for?
Separate issue (although I can't answer it).

Yeah, but I suppose that is the underlying issue here. We are all being asked to dip in to help the club through this period, and I have gladly bought all the replica, two season tickets, not asked for a refund on last years, and bought various bits of merchandise. So, when Travis tells us last night that this is a partnership between the owners and the fans, then I feel I'm entitled to ask what all that money is getting spent on.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:40 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:32 am
PoliticOs wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:30 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:20 am So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?
So it's the tier of leadership that bothers you then, right?

You don't want the Doctor there (me either!) because he has people above him. Fair shout. But Travis was, right? As in the guy at the very top?
and, I'm sure you noticed, Embleton & Macklin.

So we had the guy at the very top, the guy running commercial, the guy running the team itself day to day and you needed one more for accountability?

ML, not to you obviously but to the club, plays an important footballing role of fairly wide scope - but you thought he (who is not even at the top of the pile) had to be there at this particular Q&A or it was lacking accountability?

Give it a rest mate.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:43 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:33 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:27 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for?
Separate issue (although I can't answer it).
Yeah, but I suppose that is the underlying issue here. We are all being asked to dip in to help the club through this period, and I have gladly bought all the replica, two season tickets, not asked for a refund on last years, and bought various bits of merchandise. So, when Travis tells us last night that this is a partnership between the owners and the fans, then I feel I'm entitled to ask what all that money is getting spent on.

No, you're trying to aid the case of getting someone sacked during a pandemic you absolute ghoul. You have the right to an opinion, absolutely, but you're not allowing for an answer. 'Is Martin Ling necessary, really?!?!' you and others scream, the club answers 'yes' for three years and you still say 'Yeah, but IS HE?!'. It's embarrassing.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:43 am**

OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:33 am
RedO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:27 am
OyinbO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:03 am

Also - what are we (well, Travis & Teague) paying him for?
Separate issue (although I can't answer it).
Yeah, but I suppose that is the underlying issue here. We are all being asked to dip in to help the club through this period, and I have gladly bought all the replica, two season tickets, not asked for a refund on last years, and bought various bits of merchandise. So, when Travis tells us last night that this is a partnership between the owners and the fans, then I feel I'm entitled to ask what all that money is getting spent on.

We're going off on a tangent.

You buying a season ticket doesn't entitle you to know what all the money is being spent on. It doesn't work like that.

It sounds as if you have an issue with Lingys role (which I understand) but that hasn't changed. He was still employed at the time you spent all that money so I don't see your gripe here.

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:48 am**

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:54 am
LittleMate wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:16 am If you are a director in any company you are held accountable for your decisions, good and bad, and I don’t think this would be any different.
Martin Ling is a director in name only at the club. As such he is not accountable in the way you suggest.

How do you know he isn't?

Probably by looking up on Companies House: https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... 2/officers

Posted: **Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:50 am**

A Pedant wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:48 am
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:54 am
LittleMate wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:09 am

Martin Ling is a director in name only at the club. As such he is not accountable in the way you suggest.

How do you know he isn't?
Probably by looking up on Companies House: https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... 2/officers

That's irrelevant - he is still acknowledged as a Director, it's in his job title.

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