Independent Leyton Orient Forum

I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

But, but...what about freedom of speech?

Admin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:04 am I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

what a terrible post, who wrote this Chris Whitty?

What wokery hell is this?

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:20 am But, but...what about freedom of speech?

Be funny it it turns out the anti-vax/conspiracy lot were right

Jack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:00 am Be funny it it turns out the anti-vax/conspiracy lot were right

Be funnier if the Moon Landing Spiracy theorists.were Righter .

Or the God believers were Right/Wrong !

Admin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:04 am I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

I wish the government would take far stronger measures as well, use vaccine passports to enter pubs, theaters, supermarkets etc and make it compulsory to wear masks, if not head shields when in shops. Lastly make people like Piers Corbyn, the anti-vaxxer, conspiracy theorist, go and see recovering covid patients to convince him the disease is real and not fake.

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:20 am But, but...what about freedom of speech?

BIG fan of freedom of speech but when peoples health is a stake and after nearly two years of this.....

Jack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:00 am Be funny it it turns out the anti-vax/conspiracy lot were right

Right about what? There isn't a consistent fact based argument. It veers from these shots are a front for mind control to support a new world order to nonsense medical quackery like it's destroying our immune systems.

You can skirt the vaccines and take your chances with getting covid unprotected, which is inevitably going to happen at some point. But anyone on the fence just needs to read the accounts of healthy young people on their death beds begging for the vaccine when it's already too late for them.

I was listening to some interviews recently with CEOs of companies in the US, which had begun to mandate vaccination for their employees. They had braced themselves for some resistance and possible walkouts.

What actually happened was that the employees who refused vaccination and subsequently did leave were almost always the same ones that those companies were glad to see the back of. Basically, your usual bunch of toxic influences and troublemakers. And it was never more than about 5% of the company’s workforce, so no bother.

For the life of me I cannot remember where I came across this, so it needs to be taken with a pinch of salt. But I also read somewhere that online scammers and Nigerian Princes are very keen to target anti-whatevers due to their perceived extra gullibility.

On an individual basis, it's hard to ever sympathise with anti vaxxers. The arguments are so poorly informed, deluded and sort of hubristic - like they have cracked some global conspiracy from behind their laptop.

But on a wider scale, the profile of anti vaxxers generally follows a trend - people with bad experiences of interactions with the state or medicine, economically a bit on the fringe, often have mental health issues. Hesitancy is higher in groups where all those things have higher prevalence.

We're lucky that anti vaxx arguments haven't factored into a wider culture war problem like in America or Europe. Hesitancy isn't much of an issue here and your Piers Corbyn types are more an annoyance than a major public health issue.

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:13 am

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:20 am But, but...what about freedom of speech?

BIG fan of freedom of speech but when peoples health is a stake and after nearly two years of this.....

Spoken like a true authoritarian. I expect nothing less from an MB mod. Keep it up.

Unfortunately some genuine questions and concerns these days gets caught up in the ‘conspiracy loon’ bracket. I get why, but there’s also a fine line between shutting down genuine questions and loony theories. There is a difference, but I get that it’s hard to mod that effectively.

Have a look at those that have been banned - they’re the loony types. No fine lines here.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:38 am
But on a wider scale, the profile of anti vaxxers generally follows a trend - people with bad experiences of interactions with the state or medicine, economically a bit on the fringe, often have mental health issues. Hesitancy is higher in groups where all those things have higher prevalence.

Disagree. And the suggestion of mental health issues is not nice.

The main trend I have seen in anti vaxxers is their lack of education.

Basically, they're thickos?

Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:27 pm

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:38 am
But on a wider scale, the profile of anti vaxxers generally follows a trend - people with bad experiences of interactions with the state or medicine, economically a bit on the fringe, often have mental health issues. Hesitancy is higher in groups where all those things have higher prevalence.

Disagree. And the suggestion of mental health issues is not nice.

The main trend I have seen in anti vaxxers is their lack of education.

Poorly phrased, what I mean is people more likely to be on the margins of society. Get a bit uncomfortable with saying thickos or idiots because certain groups are way over represented in being anti vaxx and I don't believe it's cause they are stupid, they often have legitimate reasons not to trust a word the government says to them.

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:19 pm Unfortunately some genuine questions and concerns these days gets caught up in the ‘conspiracy loon’ bracket. I get why, but there’s also a fine line between shutting down genuine questions and loony theories. There is a difference, but I get that it’s hard to mod that effectively.

You should have left it at "it's hard to mod effectively"

Ok many Czech protestors demonstrating for their rights to have no vaccinations and not to wear masks. Problem though is that most of those suffering from Covid in hospitals are those who are unvaccinated and by refusing to get a Covid vaccine, they are making many hospitals into purely Covid treatment hospitals, so by their general actions, they are preventing those suffering from other illnesses from getting treatment.

Thousands protest against Czech COVID measures as hospitals fill
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/thousands-pro ... 06541.html

PRAGUE (Reuters) - Several thousand people protested in Prague against anti-coronavirus restrictions on Sunday as many Czech hospitals halted non-urgent procedures in the face of one of the world's fastest rates of new infections.
Gathered in a park overlooking the Czech capital's centre, protesters waved national flags and carried signs with slogans such as: "Get vaccinated? Over your dead bodies".

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:08 am

Admin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:04 am I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

I wish the government would take far stronger measures as well, use vaccine passports to enter pubs, theaters, supermarkets etc and make it compulsory to wear masks, if not head shields when in shops. Lastly make people like Piers Corbyn, the anti-vaxxer, conspiracy theorist, go and see recovering covid patients to convince him the disease is real and not fake.

I am not an anti Vaxxer and have had all the covid shots including the booster. I do wonder if in the next 10 years we will see many people with side effects. At my age I didn't see any risk but for young people I do see why they may not want to be vaccinated.

Simple Man wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:43 pm

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:08 am

Admin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:04 am I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

I wish the government would take far stronger measures as well, use vaccine passports to enter pubs, theaters, supermarkets etc and make it compulsory to wear masks, if not head shields when in shops. Lastly make people like Piers Corbyn, the anti-vaxxer, conspiracy theorist, go and see recovering covid patients to convince him the disease is real and not fake.

I am not an anti Vaxxer and have had all the covid shots including the booster. I do wonder if in the next 10 years we will see many people with side effects. At my age I didn't see any risk but for young people I do see why they may not want to be vaccinated.

That remains to be seen and there are many things that MAY happen in the future that could even destroy all life on this planet, but meanwhile in the present time, the side effects of not having the Covid vaccine is that if you catch the disease you may well die of it or spend a long time recovering in hospital and a year or so suffering ( long Covid ) from the after effects of having caught Covid. The vast majority of those dying of Covid in Uk NHS hospitals, are people who have not been vaccinated against catching this disease. Meanwhile whilst flooding out many hospitals with people suffering from Covid, its preventing those suffering from other critical illnesses from getting treatment.

Simple Man wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:43 pm

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:08 am

Admin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:04 am I see that bans have been handed out, quite rightly, to a couple of posters pushing anti-vax / conspiracy theory nonsense on here.

My support for such action is unequivocal. Anyone else on here heading in the same direction will be banned.

Permanently.

I wish the government would take far stronger measures as well, use vaccine passports to enter pubs, theaters, supermarkets etc and make it compulsory to wear masks, if not head shields when in shops. Lastly make people like Piers Corbyn, the anti-vaxxer, conspiracy theorist, go and see recovering covid patients to convince him the disease is real and not fake.

I am not an anti Vaxxer and have had all the covid shots including the booster. I do wonder if in the next 10 years we will see many people with side effects. At my age I didn't see any risk but for young people I do see why they may not want to be vaccinated.

What about the same people that don’t want to wear a mask either?

It’s weird though, isn’t it? And I’m generalising here, but the same people who are very much I’m alright jack, not so much as a second thought about people less well off or how society is unfair, are now very much interested in the wellbeing of society as a whole. When theres the potential to pay £10 more tax a month to help others, it’s a bloody outrage. But now they are very much all for making sure society can move forward together.

It’s almost like they still only care about their own liberty and opportunities and are putting on a front.

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:07 am

Jack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 29, 2021 11:00 am Be funny it it turns out the anti-vax/conspiracy lot were right

Be funnier if the Moon Landing Spiracy theorists.were Righter .

Or the God believers were Right/Wrong !

Or the flat earth society. Now that would be something.