Independent Leyton Orient Forum

It's being reported that plastics in supermarkets is at an all time high despite consumers not wanting it.

I've always said that government needs to implement some kind of control over packaging as I don't want all the plastic, cellophane, cardboard or whatever with the products I buy. When I was younger you'd purchase your spuds and they would go in a brown paper bag. Now it's in plastic wrapping, I as a consumer never asked for that nor do I want it.

Until the government steps up and says enough of this plastic rubbish it will not reduce nor stop. We are damaging our oceans, land etc. And I personally don't see it as a convenience.

Yesterday I saw video footage of people chasing a seal, catching it so that could cut the plastic that had become entangled around its upper body area. We can't go on like this and think it's acceptable.

Thor wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:19 am It's being reported that plastics in supermarkets is at an all time high despite consumers not wanting it.

I've always said that government needs to implement some kind of control over packaging as I don't want all the plastic, cellophane, cardboard or whatever with the products I buy. When I was younger you'd purchase your spuds and they would go in a brown paper bag. Now it's in plastic wrapping, I as a consumer never asked for that nor do I want it.

Until the government steps up and says enough of this plastic rubbish it will not reduce nor stop. We are damaging our oceans, land etc. And I personally don't see it as a convenience.

Yesterday I saw video footage of people chasing a seal, catching it so that could cut the plastic that had become entangled around its upper body area. We can't go on like this and think it's acceptable.

Yesterday I too saw video footage of...….Actually on 2nd thought's I think I shouldn't say any more about what I saw on video yesterday

From memory Thor, well 12 years ago when I did this sort of thing, I think legislation did exist, “packaging essential requirements” if memory serves which requires minimum packaging and I think covered recyclability. The brain cells covering this have long been exercise free. Could well be wrong.

But like all these things, what does minimum mean and pretty much everything can be recycled, though the cost and energy waste doing so makes it a nonsense in many cases. Compliance was never an issue. We used to ship our waste plastic to China. I was never convinced this made environmental sense but commercially it looked good when reporting our recycling statistics. And we made money.

Though some improvements did happen, drinks cans for example and plastic recycle codes.

As the person responsible for ensuring compliance to our legal and British Standards obligations in this area and spending hours studying the stuff as it applied to our business it the interpretation of this stuff which has a great deal of flexibility. Thereby is the problem. Businesses can comply yet we still have the problem.

Problem is the issue is not that simple. Switching from plastic to paper would mean massive deforestation, paper comes from trees.

You guys reckon the Tories will sort it out?

I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

Redcard wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:44 am …. paper comes from trees.

There you go folks, I bet you didn't know that

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

Redcard wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:44 am Problem is the issue is not that simple. Switching from plastic to paper would mean massive deforestation, paper comes from trees.

Huh? So what about cellulose that’s derived from plants and trees to make plastics

spen666 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:48 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

Can’t speak for today but when I went shopping with mum easy weigh provided scoops etc no human handling needed and Freddie the fruit and veg man always wore what looked like surgical gloves

Actually Spen I agree with you these days I won’t go near a ready to eat salad bar or buffet

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

Same as in the old days that you would take bottles back to the Off Licence and get a few pence back.
Its funny how some things change and then go back to how they were 50 years ago.

Anyway what else would they 'tax' if they did away with all plastic bags?

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:52 am

spen666 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:48 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

Can’t speak for today but when I went shopping with mum easy weigh provided scoops etc no human handling needed and Freddie the fruit and veg man always wore what looked like surgical gloves

Go past a fruit and veg shop now where all the fruit is already in plastic bowls and they are generally sitting there smoking before or as they serve you.

Ornchurch wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:56 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

Same as in the old days that you would take bottles back to the Off Licence and get a few pence back.
Its funny how some things change and then go back to how they were 50 years ago.

Anyway what else would they 'tax' if they did away with all plastic bags?

We used to have a pop van come round where you could return your empties for cash this is still the case in the Netherlands
I’m sure they would think of something to tax
In my old dads area you had to recycle everything in separate containers now the council have decided it can go in 1 big wheelie bin emptied every 2 weeks

What if the wood was truly sustainable? It's probably not ideal, but plastic is the bigger scourge especially single use plastic.

When we've done the shopping the side counter is absolutely chocker with plastics etc from the packaging which I then put in the recycling. What a waste as I bet a lot gets buried and or never repurposed.

Ornchurch wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:56 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

Same as in the old days that you would take bottles back to the Off Licence and get a few pence back.
Its funny how some things change and then go back to how they were 50 years ago.

Anyway what else would they 'tax' if they did away with all plastic bags?

I am not sure without legislation that this would happen now.

To encourage people to return glass bottles, the deposits would have to be significant. It was 5p or 10p 40+ years ago. I guess now the equivalent would be say £1.

Firstly, would that work when the contents of the bottle - eg cheap lemonade is only £0.50?
Secondly, as society has become relatively richer, will £1 deposits actually encourage people to return bottles

I suspect if we returned to glass bottles we would find far more smashed glass around our streets as the result.

Plastic is not as bad as is made out https://www.bbc.com/reel/video/p07r72xb ... an-plastic

Trouble is with all this stuff is you need to do whole life analysis. Often a fine line between genuine environmental benefits and feel good benefits. Man driving round to collect bottles, using petrol or diesel creating pollution in the process. Is that process really beneficial or does it just make people feel better. Who knows, I don’t.

The mantra is Reduce, Reuse, Recycle. The best thing is to start on reduce. Instead of taking the glass to a recycling point perhaps the place to start is reducing consumption. Think about that when buying that bottle of Stella in the pub.

spen666 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:48 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

You never heard of a thing called a" TAP" .
its for washing stuff.

Just saw an article (news show) on the state of the oceans on BBC2 and they said that anti biotics was a massive issue on a global scale which is polluting the oceans. It was said to be on a par with micro plastics.

Thor wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:19 am It's being reported that plastics in supermarkets is at an all time high despite consumers not wanting it.

I've always said that government needs to implement some kind of control over packaging as I don't want all the plastic, cellophane, cardboard or whatever with the products I buy. When I was younger you'd purchase your spuds and they would go in a brown paper bag. Now it's in plastic wrapping, I as a consumer never asked for that nor do I want it.

Until the government steps up and says enough of this plastic rubbish it will not reduce nor stop. We are damaging our oceans, land etc. And I personally don't see it as a convenience.

Yesterday I saw video footage of people chasing a seal, catching it so that could cut the plastic that had become entangled around its upper body area. We can't go on like this and think it's acceptable.

The problem is that the less packaging we use, certainly for vegetables the less we buy.

One supermarket did this and there vegetable/fruit sales dropped by half.

The only way to do this is for all the supermarkets/food industry to work together.

Well that's not sure anbad thing is it? We consume and waste far too much, but its the kick we need to cut back?

Thor wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:19 am Yesterday I saw video footage of people chasing a seal, catching it so that could cut the plastic that had become entangled around its upper body area. We can't go on like this and think it's acceptable.

Hopefully they stuck it in their big 4x4 and took it to animal hospital.

spen666 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:48 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am I find it crazy that these shops have popped up where you have to take your own containers in my old mum was doing that years ago at either easy weigh or Walthamstow market
Wouldn’t it be a start instead of hiking the price of a plastic bag up all the time is to just ban plastic bags full stop from supermarkets etc

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

Spen. I struggle to understand how we ever coped in the past. Foods would have been hand picked, soil left on. So likely to have been handled by half a dozen people before it reached you. Then don't forget all the creatures that may have rubbed or bit into it.

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 11:53 am

spen666 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:48 am

Lucky7 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:46 am

I would have serious concerns at the health risks of people handling my food.

In the past, the shops used to do the weighing and handling of food, not as now the customers

You never heard of a thing called a" TAP" .
its for washing stuff.

I have, it's some of the others who would be handling the food that haven't got the same hygiene standards that concern me.