Independent Leyton Orient Forum

There is understandably looks of negativity after a run of 3 without a win, but I think we need to look at the margins. 7 of our 9 league games have been draws or one goal either way. Any of those games could have been wins, draws or losses in my opinion. We could have easily been looking at a situation where we were winless at this stage, but by the same token, we could have picked up additional wins over Stevenage, Crawley, Exeter and Crewe. This to me suggests that we are not a bad side, but we are switching off at key moments, getting a bit unlucky, or a combination of the two.

Watching the games I do get the impression that we are not far off, and given that we have played all of the top four now, hopefully a good run is just around the corner. On the flipside, if we don't address these key moments, a bad run could also be on the cards. One big win, especially at home, could give us the kick we need, but I think this needs to happen before a rot sets in.

I did notice that we'd played the top 4 and 5 of the top 7 already.

The problem is that all these extra points that i agree we should have picked up, but we didnt. We aren't clinical enough in either box and have a really weak underbelly - something that was completely the opposite last season.

I'm very worried if we stick with Ross after the next few games (which i cant see us getting much out of). However, we do have a bit of an easier run, on paper, through the middle of october.

Funny how we seem to be unlucky this season, isn’t it.

If the penalty goes in, its a different game.

If the one that clattered off the bar at 1-0 goes in, its a different game, too.

Pretty sure that was at 0-0 wasn't it?

If Gorman is sent off for catching the ball as he should have been, it's a different game too. #finemargins

RicketyCricket wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:06 pm Pretty sure that was at 0-0 wasn't it?

Yes, it was.

They also hit the woodwork at 1-1, didn't they, Brill falling on his arse but still getting his fingertips on it somehow.

If we played the game today it would have been different.

If anyone had bothered to read my original post properly, you would know that it wasn't about the margins of last night's game, but how our results since the first game have hinged on small moments and that our games have on the whole been settled by the odd goal.

At the end of the day teams have been relegated on fine margins . It's the fine margins that sets teams apart and I'm sorry to say that at the moment we're not good enough .

Red I agree with your opening post. We lack leadership to the level that we had under Justin, that's not to slag off RE they are and were at different levels. If Justin had been alive I'm certain we would be in the top 3 no doubt. We could and should have won yesterday, we would not have been so nieve against Swindon and we'd have slaughtered Stevenage.

I'm also convinced that the club is still suffering from his loss and still coming to terms with it. That has impacted us more than us supporters probably understand or give credit to.

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:00 pm If the one that clattered off the bar at 1-0 goes in, its a different game, too.

Why are you so negative?

A penalty is a clear opportunity which people expect to be scored. Different to a shot hitting the bar.

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:31 pm

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:00 pm If the one that clattered off the bar at 1-0 goes in, its a different game, too.

Why are you so negative?

A penalty is a clear opportunity which people expect to be scored. Different to a shot hitting the bar.

My point is that loads of stuff could have happened, but it didn’t. Because we missed a pen didn’t stop us winning or getting a point out of the game. It would have made it easier but the game didn’t end after that was missed

So you admit that we had a clear opportunity to win the game?

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 2:30 pm

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:31 pm

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:00 pm If the one that clattered off the bar at 1-0 goes in, its a different game, too.

Why are you so negative?

A penalty is a clear opportunity which people expect to be scored. Different to a shot hitting the bar.

My point is that loads of stuff could have happened, but it didn’t. Because we missed a pen didn’t stop us winning or getting a point out of the game. It would have made it easier but the game didn’t end after that was missed

Read my op. It's about the fine margins between winning and losing across the season so far, not just one game.

Thor wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:25 pm I'm also convinced that the club is still suffering from his loss and still coming to terms with it. That has impacted us more than us supporters probably understand or give credit to.

I get that feeling too and for certain players this club won't ever be the same for them and we perhaps may not see their 2018-19 form again in an Orient shirt. Those particularly close to JE must've been hit hard. It may well be we have to demolish the promotion squad to move forward, sad as it is.

As for fine margins we also got promoted through fine margins and a bit of luck in places. You could argue we earnt that luck through the fitness to fight to the last second that doesn't seem to be there this season.

Some players have carried injuries over into this season after putting their bodies on the line to get the league win. That's been exacerbated by the recruitment over summer that didn't move us forward, arguably gone backwards in some areas and squad depth issues still not addressed, leaving Ross with minimal options as soon as we pick up an injury.

There's a lot going on that all seems to add up to where we find ourselves right now. Personally I think the way out of it is going to involve appointing a permanent manager and then bringing reinforcements in as soon as we can (January) to refresh the playing side.

It’s certainly true re football being a game of fine margins, that little bit of luck here, a fraction of a second hesitation there. And I think that Thor and gshaw make fair points.

The Ross interim appointment was perfectly understandable, and having done that he needs to be given a fair crack of the whip before a decision is made on whether he or someone else gets the permanent role. I don’t know the answer to that one at the moment, jury still out for me. But after the tragic summer, this season was always going to be one of coming to terms with what happened and re-establishing ourselves in the EFL, and I’ve no doubt that the owners will do what is needed to ensure that happens.

Yeah, all fair stuff.

I think most fans appreciate the situation, there’s only a few numpties calling for Ross to be sacked.

I get that it's small margins, but if we make excuses and don't take responsibility for what's happened so far then we won't make the necessary improvements to push us up the table.

Most games are fine margins. Last season was no different. Strange how well organised teams seem to win most of them when shambolic teams don’t.

Sometimes teams have off days yet still win whilst others get stuffed. I’ve often wondered what make all the difference.

RedO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2019 8:41 am Yeah, all fair stuff.

I think most fans appreciate the situation, there’s only a few numpties calling for Ross to be sacked.

Who ?

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2019 3:32 pm Most games are fine margins. Last season was no different. Strange how well organised teams seem to win most of them when shambolic teams don’t.

Sometimes teams have off days yet still win whilst others get stuffed. I’ve often wondered what make all the difference.

Apart from last season's games where there were not fine margins.

Red_Army wrote: ↑Wed Sep 18, 2019 10:52 am There is understandably looks of negativity after a run of 3 without a win, but I think we need to look at the margins. 7 of our 9 league games have been draws or one goal either way. Any of those games could have been wins, draws or losses in my opinion. We could have easily been looking at a situation where we were winless at this stage, but by the same token, we could have picked up additional wins over Stevenage, Crawley, Exeter and Crewe. This to me suggests that we are not a bad side, but we are switching off at key moments, getting a bit unlucky, or a combination of the two.

Watching the games I do get the impression that we are not far off, and given that we have played all of the top four now, hopefully a good run is just around the corner. On the flipside, if we don't address these key moments, a bad run could also be on the cards. One big win, especially at home, could give us the kick we need, but I think this needs to happen before a rot sets in.

Good, well reasoned comment,

Red_Army wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:16 pm

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2019 3:32 pm Most games are fine margins. Last season was no different. Strange how well organised teams seem to win most of them when shambolic teams don’t.

Sometimes teams have off days yet still win whilst others get stuffed. I’ve often wondered what make all the difference.

Apart from last season's games where there were not fine margins.

Most games last season were fine margins too.