Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Did not see i but will watch on Youtube. What was said?

We have the 15th highest budget in the league.
So we're just below where you'd expect.
Bit depressing innit ?

Nigel mentioned that recruitment needs to improve.

The budget has been blown and ended up being increased by 20% on last year.

One of the loanees may be signed permanently (my money is on Kelman).

Nigel has put in £10 million of his own money and will continue to fund the club.

Still hopeful of finding more investment, but (unsurprisingly) some that have expressed an interest have been shocked by the amounts Football clubs lose.

Was mentioned that there was a plan for the January window, when questioned what that was considering there is no budget, they got out of answering by saying it was best for Martin (Ling) to explain - who wasn't there.

Noticeable that only 200 odd were watching on You Tube. No doubt there are various reasons why there wasn't more, but do wonder if fans have become abit dis-engaged for one reason or another.

The lack of engagement on both forums when I looked last night is pretty telling. A 15/24 budget isn't bad but looking at what we've brought in that's a very poor return for money spent.

Nothing changes in that department staff wise so expect more of the same, which then circles back round to fan apathy.

Fellowo wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 6:51 am Nigel mentioned that recruitment needs to improve.

The budget has been blown and ended up being increased by 20% on last year.

One of the loanees may be signed permanently (my money is on Kelman).

Nigel has put in £10 million of his own money and will continue to fund the club.

Still hopeful of finding more investment, but (unsurprisingly) some that have expressed an interest have been shocked by the amounts Football clubs lose.

Was mentioned that there was a plan for the January window, when questioned what that was considering there is no budget, they got out of answering by saying it was best for Martin (Ling) to explain - who wasn't there.

Noticeable that only 200 odd were watching on You Tube. No doubt there are various reasons why there wasn't more, but do wonder if fans have become abit dis-engaged for one reason or another.

I forgot all about it TBH and by pure chance turned on Utube about 7.30 and watched the second half.
They usually Email me about loads of things but there was no reminder yesterday morning about this.

Yes it was not well advertised. It would be nice if someone came on here and asked for questions

Wouldn't have watched anyway but had no idea it was on. Considering the amount they push a 10% discount on bobble hats, you'd think they could have plugged it a bit better, otherwise - surely not - this is just token engagement.

Of course they don’t want to advertise this with how things are at the moment.

Couple of follow up questions for the next forum:

How have we got access to the payroll records of the other 23 clubs in the division?

How many more chances does Lingy have to get the recruitment right?

Supporters club is still independent & will continue as such, puts to bed the false story by whoever it was

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 8:00 am Yes it was not well advertised. It would be nice if someone came on here and asked for questions

was on website & Facebook, twitter . What more can the club do? Advertise on ITV?

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 7:47 am The lack of engagement on both forums when I looked last night is pretty telling. A 15/24 budget isn't bad but looking at what we've brought in that's a very poor return for money spent.

Nothing changes in that department staff wise so expect more of the same, which then circles back round to fan apathy.

The issue is that we are still paying a sizeable chunk of wages for Moncur and Piggott - Graham is on a sizeable salary and we haven't had good value for money on that deal either. Add Theo and now Howes to the list and you can see that a lot of money is being spent on players who cannot contribute anything to the club.

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 8:00 am Yes it was not well advertised. It would be nice if someone came on here and asked for questions

It was advertised on the club website three or four times in the last few weeks.

I sent in a question but it wasn't asked, I have sent in the same question to the last three forums.

What was your question?

15/24 budget is standard for us and silly to think it will be more.

Problem is not only do we not utilise it well, we actively waste it. With a manager like Richie if you give him a top ten squad by thinking outside the box he gets us in the playoffs minimuma

KenleyO wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:09 am

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 7:47 am The lack of engagement on both forums when I looked last night is pretty telling. A 15/24 budget isn't bad but looking at what we've brought in that's a very poor return for money spent.

Nothing changes in that department staff wise so expect more of the same, which then circles back round to fan apathy.

The issue is that we are still paying a sizeable chunk of wages for Moncur and Piggott - Graham is on a sizeable salary and we haven't had good value for money on that deal either. Add Theo and now Howes to the list and you can see that a lot of money is being spent on players who cannot contribute anything to the club.

Summed it up nicely here. Until these expensive turkeys & sicknotes are off the books we’re going to continue relying on freebies and loans.

Consistent message was that they aren't happy with the recruitment. As HA says above, I don't know how many chances Ling needs to show whether he's capable of doing better with the money we have. The personal relationship they have with him and the debt they obviously they feel they owe him for the past 6 years can't help with being objective on his performance.

No meaningful update on the new investment or ground site - as you were on the council being supportive, having to show we can't stay where we are, 2-3 sites being identified as good locations etc.

As much as there is (justified) grumbling about ticket prices, we are nearing or getting to sell ours for Saturday kick offs, so they will take the view that they've gotten this right.

Interesting point made about the number of Tuesday night kick offs almost certainly going to be the same as last season, we've just had them front loaded due to international breaks.

Interesting point made about the number of Tuesday night kick offs almost certainly going to be the same as last season, we've just had them front loaded due to international breaks.

The only thing is that they can't count - I make it 6 Tuesday night kick offs - the games against Exeter, Rotherham and Bristol Rovers were already scheduled for a Tuesday night. Then add the rearranged games of Peterborough, Huddersfield and Mansfield.

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:21 am 15/24 budget is standard for us and silly to think it will be more.

Problem is not only do we not utilise it well, we actively waste it. With a manager like Richie if you give him a top ten squad by thinking outside the box he gets us in the playoffs minimum

Nailed it, spot on

Nothing says waste like 5 keepers on the books, two loanees and one taking a significant wage to not even make the squad. Seems like groundhog day for the last two transfer windows saying the same thing and no signs of anything being done to change it.

The club changed CEO to go in a different direction but the DoF role seems to be untouchable.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:13 am

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 8:00 am Yes it was not well advertised. It would be nice if someone came on here and asked for questions

It was advertised on the club website three or four times in the last few weeks.

I sent in a question but it wasn't asked, I have sent in the same question to the last three forums.

The last couple of these Q&A's are a waste of time really as any remotely pressing questions are either ignored or changed to take any controversial elements out.

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 12:25 pm

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:21 am 15/24 budget is standard for us and silly to think it will be more.

Problem is not only do we not utilise it well, we actively waste it. With a manager like Richie if you give him a top ten squad by thinking outside the box he gets us in the playoffs minimum

Nailed it, spot on

Nothing says waste like 5 keepers on the books, two loanees and one taking a significant wage to not even make the squad. Seems like groundhog day for the last two transfer windows saying the same thing and no signs of anything being done to change it.

The club changed CEO to go in a different direction but the DoF role seems to be untouchable.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:13 am

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 8:00 am Yes it was not well advertised. It would be nice if someone came on here and asked for questions

It was advertised on the club website three or four times in the last few weeks.

I sent in a question but it wasn't asked, I have sent in the same question to the last three forums.

The last couple of these Q&A's are a waste of time really as any remotely pressing questions are either ignored or changed to take any controversial elements out.

We are paying less than 25% of Keelyes wage, Hemming probably 40-50 % of his wage, Howes is the only 1 of 5 who is being paid a full wage, Byrne is on a pittance & the other kid is still on an u-21 contract.

Bandy Legs wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 12:32 pm We are paying less than 25% of Keelyes wage, Hemming probably 40-50 % of his wage, Howes is the only 1 of 5 who is being paid a full wage, Byrne is on a pittance & the other kid is still on an u-21 contract.

40-50% of a Championship wage is a first choice League 1 starter wage. It's waste of a squad place that we need for other areas. As Richtea says above, actively wasting an already tight budget isn't acceptable.

As for the academy lot if they're not even good enough to act as a reserve keeper get rid.

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 7:57 am

Fellowo wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 6:51 am Nigel mentioned that recruitment needs to improve.

The budget has been blown and ended up being increased by 20% on last year.

One of the loanees may be signed permanently (my money is on Kelman).

Nigel has put in £10 million of his own money and will continue to fund the club.

Still hopeful of finding more investment, but (unsurprisingly) some that have expressed an interest have been shocked by the amounts Football clubs lose.

Was mentioned that there was a plan for the January window, when questioned what that was considering there is no budget, they got out of answering by saying it was best for Martin (Ling) to explain - who wasn't there.

Noticeable that only 200 odd were watching on You Tube. No doubt there are various reasons why there wasn't more, but do wonder if fans have become abit dis-engaged for one reason or another.

I forgot all about it TBH and by pure chance turned on Utube about 7.30 and watched the second half.
They usually Email me about loads of things but there was no reminder yesterday morning about this.

I agree that the loanee who will be offered a permanent contract will be Kelman who is out of contract with QPR in the summer. Nigel also indicated some loanees could return to their clubs in January. Hemming could be one who will return if Keeley is to stay the full season. With Theo not set to return another winger could be on the agenda.

Not even our Goalkeeping board expert saw Hemming being so cr@p & I'd trust his expertise.

gshaw wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 3:40 pm

Bandy Legs wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 12:32 pm We are paying less than 25% of Keelyes wage, Hemming probably 40-50 % of his wage, Howes is the only 1 of 5 who is being paid a full wage, Byrne is on a pittance & the other kid is still on an u-21 contract.

40-50% of a Championship wage is a first choice League 1 starter wage. It's waste of a squad place that we need for other areas. As Richtea says above, actively wasting an already tight budget isn't acceptable.

As for the academy lot if they're not even good enough to act as a reserve keeper get rid.

The Reverend wrote: ↑Tue Jul 23, 2024 6:56 pm To be honest it’s quite a good sign that Middlesbrough are willing to loan us another player for a season. Always good to be known as a club who can look after loanees and develop them. Looking at the likes of El Miz, Brynn and Forde they all got decent game time and developed as players at Orient. Even those two kids at the end of last season both got decent stints. It’s a good reputation to have as a club in league 1. Means that Championship and even Premiership clubs are willing to lend us their talent.

As it happens a Championship keeper probably earns 3-4 times what league 1 does. Just ask Vigs

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 9:16 am What was your question?

I asked why a club of our stature needs a CEO and COO and all the added expense that goes with it. I doubt if many outside the Prem have both, looking at the Q&A last night the COO added very little and it was stuff the CEO could and should be doing.

Bandy Legs wrote: ↑Fri Nov 22, 2024 4:17 pm Not even our Goalkeeping board expert saw Hemming being so cr@p & I'd trust his expertise.

Post-Vigs the GK recruitment reads

Howes - enough has been said about him, never L1 standard
Brynn - a barely average keeper, I'd say poor based on the stats that the other forum posted (very few saves, lots of goals against)
Hemming - a 4th choice keeper and has played like one

Meanwhile Byrne who at one point looked a decent talent ready to be #2 keeper appears to have gone backwards and we've trained Hemming to let in almost every shot that goes on target. Another area along with the recruitment that needs seriously looking at.

While I generally agree re the keepers, Brynn was better than you make out and Byrne obviously isn’t rated by Wellens in the way Jacket did.

We need a permanent number One next season (spending the budget sensibly would help) But we need to develop Philips who is a very promising keeper