Independent Leyton Orient Forum

fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:05 am fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Always have been unfortunately

We also have far to many coaches and staff at the expense of decent players.

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:05 am fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Somebody could argue it's been the same at Orient for decades now . Going back in time look at all the ex - Spurs , West Ham , QPR etc , etc players we've had over years . The real question is how good are they now .

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:05 am fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Ridiculous. Barring Pratley, I think Beckles is next oldest at 33 (?), and Ball at 29. The rest of the squad has so much potential. Absolutely ridiculous post.

This is the most braindead take yet.

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:38 am

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:05 am fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Ridiculous. Barring Pratley, I think Beckles is next oldest at 33 (?), and Ball at 29. The rest of the squad has so much potential. Absolutely ridiculous post.

When I stated a retirement home I wasn’t
necessary meaning the ageing of the squad
more along the lines of last hope of making
it in the professional game..
I now see my wording of “retirement home”
wasn’t necessarily the correct word more
“ last chance saloon” I hope that has cleared
up the matter I was trying to put across ..

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:54 am

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:38 am

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:05 am fast becoming a retirement home for
underachieving footballers many of who
are unfortunately hitting the last chance
saloon ..

And if so can/are we entitled to a grant
from the government??

Ridiculous. Barring Pratley, I think Beckles is next oldest at 33 (?), and Ball at 29. The rest of the squad has so much potential. Absolutely ridiculous post.

When I stated a retirement home I wasn’t
necessary meaning the ageing of the squad
more along the lines of last hope of making
it in the professional game..
I now see my wording of “retirement home”
wasn’t necessarily the correct word more
“ last chance saloon” I hope that has cleared
up the matter I was trying to put across ..

Who would you regard as last chance saloon?

Happe, TJ, Simpson, Currie, Clare, Galbraith, Agyei, Ball. I honestly don’t think they are. I can’t think of many that you would define as you have.

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 11:16 am

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:54 am

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:38 am

Ridiculous. Barring Pratley, I think Beckles is next oldest at 33 (?), and Ball at 29. The rest of the squad has so much potential. Absolutely ridiculous post.

When I stated a retirement home I wasn’t
necessary meaning the ageing of the squad
more along the lines of last hope of making
it in the professional game..
I now see my wording of “retirement home”
wasn’t necessarily the correct word more
“ last chance saloon” I hope that has cleared
up the matter I was trying to put across ..

Who would you regard as last chance saloon?

Happe, TJ, Simpson, Currie, Clare, Galbraith, Agyei, Ball. I honestly don’t think they are. I can’t think of many that you would define as you have.

DJ .. probably the new Phil Hadland
Graham .. with his injury record ..
Perkins .. you’d hope Leeds are paying his wages
TJ .. wouldn’t have got a new deal
Howes .. not league standard ..
Archibald.. out til the new year wouldn’t
have got a new deal ..

So out of a squad of say 25, you have named 6. Howes has gone, Perkins is on loan. Theo and Graham are coming back from long term injuries. TJ has just signed a new contract. You wouldn’t have given him one?

DJ, yes I agree. So one.

Can we not name loan players as you’ve
named Curre ???
Due diligence has obviously not been done
on Perkins and what he can offer the side ..
Theo was out of contract and yet we still
took up some of the budget to secure his services
even thou we probably won’t see him on the
pitch this season ..
I reiterate due diligence wasn’t done on graham
and injury history..
Tj 2 lacklustre seasons at the Os apparently
had offers from elsewhere..

So you wouldn’t have offered TJ another deal?

Most glaring mistake was signing Pratley for another 12 months when he is clearly way past his best. That money could and should have been used elsewhere.

I agree with you theman must be on some wages give the man a coaching roll or release at the end of the season or send out on loan

I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

redintheface wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 12:03 pm Most glaring mistake was signing Pratley for another 12 months when he is clearly way past his best. That money could and should have been used elsewhere.

It seems odd we brought in an ex-player making their first steps as a coach in McCormack when we already had a player at the end of their career who appears ready to make the transition into coaching already here.

Could've put Pratley in the coaching role and registered as a player for emergency use. Instead seems like we'll either lose him from the club at the end of the in year or bloat the coaching budget up by another employee making a role to keep his leadership skills.

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 11:16 am

Hedmans Header wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:54 am

DrWindy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:38 am

Ridiculous. Barring Pratley, I think Beckles is next oldest at 33 (?), and Ball at 29. The rest of the squad has so much potential. Absolutely ridiculous post.

When I stated a retirement home I wasn’t
necessary meaning the ageing of the squad
more along the lines of last hope of making
it in the professional game..
I now see my wording of “retirement home”
wasn’t necessarily the correct word more
“ last chance saloon” I hope that has cleared
up the matter I was trying to put across ..

Who would you regard as last chance saloon?

Happe, TJ, Simpson, Currie, Clare, Galbraith, Agyei, Ball. I honestly don’t think they are. I can’t think of many that you would define as you have.

Simpson had basically been black listed from the professional game after racially abusing a teammate. So yeah…we were only chance saloon with that one.

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

I'M with you on this one . I have always thought that RW is a bang on average manager and not the messiah that fans seemed to regard him as . You only have to look at his track record ,it really isn't very special . Having said that I think he's good enough for Orient and will keep us around that mid table mark eventually .

soloman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 9:29 pm

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

I'M with you on this one . I have always thought that RW is a bang on average manager and not the messiah that fans seemed to regard him as . You only have to look at his track record ,it really isn't very special . Having said that I think he's good enough for Orient and will keep us around that mid table mark eventually .

The youngest manager ever to win 2 divisional titles with 2 different clubs? I believe he's also won the Johnstone's paint, or whatever its called.

Came in and turned a couple of points in 15 games into 24 from the next 12 with the same squad.

Changed the way the club thinks and acts as a result of his ability.

Got a couple of black marks on his record, but who hasn't? There's much more good in the man than there is bad, ability-wise.

LittleMate wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 10:44 pm The youngest manager ever to win 2 divisional titles with 2 different clubs? I believe he's also won the Johnstone's paint, or whatever its called.

Came in and turned a couple of points in 15 games into 24 from the next 12 with the same squad.

Changed the way the club thinks and acts as a result of his ability.

Got a couple of black marks on his record, but who hasn't? There's much more good in the man than there is bad, ability-wise.

Glad to see someone gets it, if anything the club can't keep up with what RW needs to build the side he wants.

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

OK… how about: Vigouroux, Smyth, Agyei, Galbraith, Obeiro, Happe, Kelman, Brown, El Mizouni. They’re all players who are better now/when they left Orient than they were when Wellens/they arrived.

There’s some shittte on here but this thread takes the biscuit.

OyinbO wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 11:16 pm

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

OK… how about: Vigouroux, Smyth, Agyei, Galbraith, Obeiro, Happe, Kelman, Brown, El Mizouni. They’re all players who are better now/when they left Orient than they were when Wellens/they arrived.

Can you pinpoint in which way any of those players have improved in the time they've been/had been with the club?

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

Of the players currently here:

TJ, Sweeney, Happe, Cooper, Brown, Galbraith, Kelman, Obeiro.

Of the players who have been here and gone:

Vigaroux, Paul Smyth, El Mizouni, Ruel, Forde, Turns,

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Thu Oct 03, 2024 2:25 pm

Pagan Orient wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 5:11 pm I think it's more of a coaching issue than a player quality issue.

Remember RW banging on about how tough the first 3 matches were on paper? Brum, fair enough, but Bolton & Charlton are faffing around in mid-table & have already lost 7 league matches between them. Maybe they're, along with Exeter, just better coached teams?

If you think about it, since RW has been at the club, which players have actually improved? And it may not even be a RW issue, but his support staff...

Of the players currently here:

TJ, Sweeney, Happe, Cooper, Brown, Galbraith, Kelman, Obeiro.

Of the players who have been here and gone:

Vigaroux, Paul Smyth, El Mizouni, Ruel, Forde, Turns,

I'm not asking about which players you like or you think are good. That wasn't the question. Of those players you list, pick an example & explain how they improved.
Anyway, Ruel, seriously