Independent Leyton Orient Forum

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Judd gets done for the first on a simple give and go; Marv gets done for the second and the disallowed goal. No real Orient highlights amongst the stream.

No way can you single out Judd for the first. That goal shows exactly the problem we have all been talking about. There is no midfield protection of the back line.

No way you can single Marv out for the second either. He scuffs the interception but there's still plenty of time after that for the back 3 to sort.

There's no way that shot should be sneaking in under Deano like that.

No singling out individuals. Collective poo poo defending

Plymouth had a goal disallowed?

Howling Mad Murdock wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:45 pm Plymouth had a goal disallowed?

Bloke was offside when they were already 2-0 up.

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:22 pm No singling out individuals. Collective poo poo defending

So , the same thing that happened at Macclesfield .

Notice that their left winger was two footed - something Brophy isnt.

Also, their forwards broke with speed just like Macclesfield - we look slow by comparison.

Ten games in and we will know where we are but after these three games (the first two I was there for), I admit to being slightly worried.

Defence was meant to be our strong point. I'd expect a lot of 1-0s, 0-0s, etc...but the same players who were here last year seem to have forgotten the basics. Or they aren't good enough for this level.

3 games though and they looked comfortable in one of them so we'll see what happens saturday.

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:14 pm Defence was meant to be our strong point. I'd expect a lot of 1-0s, 0-0s, etc...but the same players who were here last year seem to have forgotten the basics. Or they aren't good enough for this level.

3 games though and they looked comfortable in one of them so we'll see what happens saturday.

Our attackers - Bonne and Koroma - were also our strong point.

Really trying hard to stay positive and remind myself its early days but it's horrible seeing what I was afraid of before a ball was kicked, starting to come to fruition.

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:09 pm No way can you single out Judd for the first. That goal shows exactly the problem we have all been talking about. There is no midfield protection of the back line.

Plays a give and go; cuts inside his marker and gets to the ball - loads of blame there.

Ross thinks there's culpability: " Juddy couldnt keep up with his man which lead to the 1st goal"

Brill seems to be getting beaten too easily. Shots seem to be going thru him.
Think it's time to give Sarge a go.

It wasn't that he couldn't keep up, Judd was caught ball watching, by the time he realised he was too far away to get a block in. That said, the shot wasn't that hard, it seemed to bobble under Brill.

Was also frustrating for the second goal, Marv not really under any pressure yet miscues a header straight to the opponent. I got a feeling that Coulson and to a lesser extent Happe are going to be a bit vulnerable against pace.

Personally I think we need to reset expectations, with people hoping we might be a Tranmere. It seems to me we have more in common with Macclesfield, won a tight National League division, lost a manager and the best players in the summer.

Just watched the full 8 mins with a heavy heart - we made so little impact on Argyle (as with Macclesfield). ML has a lot of thinking to do; last season he had a brilliant, mercurial and hugely experienced manager - who got players to perform at the very top of their ability. This made everyone look good. This season we have moved to a higher level and have:-

Lost x2 best players - and replaced with as yet to convince forwards

Replaced JE (RIP) with an interim / inexperienced, reluctant but loyal RE. Is he going to be able to get the players firing on all cylinders and switch the tactics as needed? Even if so - that might only be enough for lower, mid-table?

Still not filled capability gaps in midfield (unbelievable!!!) - that were covered over by JE going 5 3 2

On top of this we have the Board aiming for reduced annual loss - admirable but we need to consolidate in L2. Relegation would simply kill the club!

Lots of thinking needed by ML, T&T plus action and relatively soon!!

COYO's - see you all on Saturday

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:14 pm Defence was meant to be our strong point. I'd expect a lot of 1-0s, 0-0s, etc...but the same players who were here last year seem to have forgotten the basics. Or they aren't good enough for this level.

3 games though and they looked comfortable in one of them so we'll see what happens saturday.

For the first 25 I don’t think they looked comfortable against Cheltenham either. Few iffy moments after that too. Coulson looks solid but Happe and Ekpiteta on a steep learning curve against better quality, faster players. We look easy to score against right now and that’s not been the case for a lonnnnnng time.

Added to that we don’t look like scoring either.

But as we keep saying, early days, so it could all come together. Starting Saturday I hope. Don’t really fancy a season long battle against relegation. And I will never watch another NL game in my life.

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:09 pm No way can you single out Judd for the first. That goal shows exactly the problem we have all been talking about. There is no midfield protection of the back line.

This. Judd doesn't cover himself in glory, but after the ball goes past him he's trying to get back in position while Wright and Gorman are both ball watching and fail to spot the run. That goal doesn't happen if one of the CMs stays sitting in front of the backline to offer some protection.

Exactly that. When a ball goes into a centre forwards feet like that, all the centre backs can do is hold him up, especially in the box. It needs the covering midfielders to help them out and win the ball back off of them but there was no support. Ours don’t do that.

Tom Chance wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:10 pm Brill seems to be getting beaten too easily. Shots seem to be going thru him.
Think it's time to give Sarge a go.

I don’t think sarge is the answer either, sadly.

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:55 pm

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:09 pm No way can you single out Judd for the first. That goal shows exactly the problem we have all been talking about. There is no midfield protection of the back line.

This. Judd doesn't cover himself in glory, but after the ball goes past him he's trying to get back in position while Wright and Gorman are both ball watching and fail to spot the run. That goal doesn't happen if one of the CMs stays sitting in front of the backline to offer some protection.

What ?

If juddy isnt standing 5 yards off the ball allowing the guy who scored.to play the ball in
Or if he followed the runner instead of the line of the ball
The goal wouldnt have come.

Nothing to do with centre midfielders at all.

Defence was all over the place..............looked like 5 fellas just slung together for the first time. no one knew where they should be. In the 2 mins of highlights, they had men unmarked in the box a number of times. shocking.

Its like the bad old days of 2016/17. just to carry on the same is suicide. change is needed here, as quick as possible, before we find ourselves many points behind at the bottom of the league

Brill will be disappointed with both of those, as above he seems slow getting down to both and they go through / under him. Neither particularly fierce strikes either. Missing pre-season through injury is proving costly. If Sargeant isn't seemed good enough to come in if Brill isn't performing then we should be looking for another keeper to provide a proper challenge for the #1 spot.

The 3 at the back doesn't seem to be helping us, very poor goals to concede and our defence looks slow. Increase in pace and quality of League 2 seems to be biting.

Our lone highlight comes from a long ball and headed knockdown, exactly the way we scored our only goal this season thus far. Doesn't say much for our attacking threat with the current tactics and formation.

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:24 pm

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:55 pm

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:09 pm No way can you single out Judd for the first. That goal shows exactly the problem we have all been talking about. There is no midfield protection of the back line.

This. Judd doesn't cover himself in glory, but after the ball goes past him he's trying to get back in position while Wright and Gorman are both ball watching and fail to spot the run. That goal doesn't happen if one of the CMs stays sitting in front of the backline to offer some protection.

What ?

If juddy isnt standing 5 yards off the ball allowing the guy who scored.to play the ball in
Or if he followed the runner instead of the line of the ball
The goal wouldnt have come.

Nothing to do with centre midfielders at all.

Sorry mate, you’re wrong.

Judd hasn’t covered himself in glory but he’s tracked back and been done by the bloke dropping his shoulder as if to go on the outside. Judd isn’t following the ball, he looks around for his man a couple of times. It happens.

What you need to do is ensure there’s adequate cover inside of him but there isn’t. No way should their centre forward have that much time on the ball unchallenged and the scorer have that much space to run into.

It was the same on Saturday for the first goal. Bloke cut inside Brophy and had acres of space, there’s no cover or support from Cm at all.

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:55 pm

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:24 pm

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:55 pm

This. Judd doesn't cover himself in glory, but after the ball goes past him he's trying to get back in position while Wright and Gorman are both ball watching and fail to spot the run. That goal doesn't happen if one of the CMs stays sitting in front of the backline to offer some protection.

What ?

If juddy isnt standing 5 yards off the ball allowing the guy who scored.to play the ball in
Or if he followed the runner instead of the line of the ball
The goal wouldnt have come.

Nothing to do with centre midfielders at all.

Sorry mate, you’re wrong.

Judd hasn’t covered himself in glory but he’s tracked back and been done by the bloke dropping his shoulder as if to go on the outside. Judd isn’t following the ball, he looks around for his man a couple of times. It happens.

What you need to do is ensure there’s adequate cover inside of him but there isn’t. No way should their centre forward have that much time on the ball unchallenged and the scorer have that much space to run into.

It was the same on Saturday for the first goal. Bloke cut inside Brophy and had acres of space, there’s no cover or support from Cm at all.

He doesn’t cut inside of Brophy at all
Ball comes off Brophys body guy takes one touch bang it’s a goal Brophy didn’t have time to close him down
Take a look at the highlights