Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Yet another child killed by a child yesterday from what we can learn so far. Even so, what makes this stand out from others is that the poor victim , a 15 year old girl , was on her way to school. This is not about lack of youth clubs or bored young people, this is now completely out of control. What went through my mind as an adult is that any of us could be on a bus going about our everyday business and seeing kids with a knife could easily get caught up. What is the answer to this mess with youngster’s complete disregard of the value of life?

Given our track record of debating contentious issues, I have every confidence that this message board will be able to solve this one.

Time for parents to take responsibility for the actions of their children.

When was knife crime under control?

Unfortunately standards have fallen these days,a teacher can’t even look at a pupil without being accused of threatening behaviour. I’m afraid to say todays society has basically broken down in terms of discipline. There are just not enough deterrence nowadays. Criminals get life in prison and that basically now means about 10 years and most of that is chucking Charlie up there nose and watching tv. Personally although I’ve never done it myself I think they should bring back conscription and if the did I wonder how many people would want to cross the channel then

Murder rate in the UK is way down on its early 2000s peak and seems to be back to where we were in the early 90s.

Cut their hands off

Dunners wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 8:48 am Given our track record of debating contentious issues, I have every confidence that this message board will be able to solve this one.

Yup. Plenty of people with deep knowledge of the issues will be only to happy to give us their opinion. And it will all be very civil and constructive too.

essexfootball wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 9:41 am Cut their hands off

Wouldn’t that impact on the glove industry somewhat?

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 9:55 am

essexfootball wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 9:41 am Cut their hands off

Wouldn’t that impact on the glove industry somewhat?

Bots from the powerful Glove Lobby deployed into action

Make life sentences mean life not just a few years

BIGRON wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:09 am Make life sentences mean life not just a few years

And who is going to pay for the upkeep of these people? You?

The victim went to a school for girls that costs their parents £20,000 a year. Some reports says that the alleged attacker was also a student at the school. But as it is a all-girls school, that shows us how accurate the media can be! The person arrested is only 17 and allegedly possessed a foot long knife. Considering the amount of violence amongst youngsters today, one has to question how the alleged attacker could secrete such a weapon from it's parents. Adults have a duty to know what their kids are up to. The arrested person if found to be the murderer will have it's life well & truly screwed also

ChorizO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:10 am

BIGRON wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:09 am Make life sentences mean life not just a few years

And who is going to pay for the upkeep of these people? You?

We are paying for all the others like Hartley, West, terrorists etc?

Loin Cloth Lenny wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:15 am

ChorizO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:10 am

BIGRON wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:09 am Make life sentences mean life not just a few years

And who is going to pay for the upkeep of these people? You?

We are paying for all the others like Hartley, West, terrorists etc?

Yes, but I am talking about all the new ones Ron wants to keep incarcerated.

So I will say again - who is going to pay for all this?

When are humans given the chance to rehabilitate?

ChorizO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:32 am

Loin Cloth Lenny wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:15 am

ChorizO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 10:10 am

And who is going to pay for the upkeep of these people? You?

We are paying for all the others like Hartley, West, terrorists etc?

Yes, but I am talking about all the new ones Ron wants to keep incarcerated.

So I will say again - who is going to pay for all this?

When are humans given the chance to rehabilitate?

You are right about rehabilitation.

The problem as I have read is that often , those who eventually murder with a knife have a string of previous encounters with police, cautions, probation orders etc that have done nothing to deter them from continuing to carry blades. I recall people carrying knives in the 70’s but rarely stabbing people. We all have probably heard of the stabbings between mods and rockers in the 50’s. I don’t know if many were fatal.

This trend these days with kids is frightening.

Using a public health approach is the answer but it is expensive and as our overlords don't mind the proles chopping each other up it won't happen. Because perversely the death of youths fuels their right wing law and order agenda and feeds their authoritarian instincts.

See here for a details of a violence reduction programme that has had positive results:

https://www.svru.co.uk/

The Teddy boys of the 50s often carried cut throat razors and were not afraid to use them. I read a book, a long time ago, called No Mean City, it was a story about the gangs of Glasgow. It was absolutely notorious there.

Chicken Dhansak wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 11:58 am The Teddy boys of the 50s often carried cut throat razors and were not afraid to use them. I read a book, a long time ago, called No Mean City, it was a story about the gangs of Glasgow. It was absolutely notorious there.

In that era Albert Pierrepoint was lurking

Chicken Dhansak wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 11:58 am The Teddy boys of the 50s often carried cut throat razors and were not afraid to use them. I read a book, a long time ago, called No Mean City, it was a story about the gangs of Glasgow. It was absolutely notorious there.

Be interesting to see statistics then and now.

When the alleged offender is found guilty & incarcerated & he is gonna have great time won't he? He is obviously well hard if he he can kill a little girl with a foot long knife. So other offenders will want to keep well away from such an 'ard nut.

DaveDunmore wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 12:32 pm

Chicken Dhansak wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 11:58 am The Teddy boys of the 50s often carried cut throat razors and were not afraid to use them. I read a book, a long time ago, called No Mean City, it was a story about the gangs of Glasgow. It was absolutely notorious there.

In that era Albert Pierrepoint was lurking

And he obviously didn't do much to put them off carrying on as they did, did he?

Friend or faux wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 12:41 pm When the alleged offender is found guilty & incarcerated & he is gonna have great time won't he? He is obviously well hard if he he can kill a little girl with a foot long knife. So other offenders will want to keep well away from such an 'ard nut.

What does this nonsense even mean?

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 1:00 pm

DaveDunmore wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 12:32 pm

Chicken Dhansak wrote: ↑Thu Sep 28, 2023 11:58 am The Teddy boys of the 50s often carried cut throat razors and were not afraid to use them. I read a book, a long time ago, called No Mean City, it was a story about the gangs of Glasgow. It was absolutely notorious there.

In that era Albert Pierrepoint was lurking

And he obviously didn't do much to put them off carrying on as they did, did he?

. Well he executed about 600 so they were put off

They clearly weren't. Jesus Christ.