Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Another adjournment looks like their last chance.

...... until their next last chance

Deducted 10 points according to the BBC

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 4:28 pm Deducted 10 points according to the BBC

Feel really sorry for the fans. We all know what they are going through. Ron Martin has agreed with the court another adjournment where he hopes to have sold the club to a load of Aussies. With the position the club are in i cannot understand anybody buying it

Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 5:53 pm Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 5:53 pm Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

If there’s a will there’s a way as far as money bags is concerned Joe

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 5:53 pm Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

As I understand it, Roots Hall has not been sold per se but RM has borrowed heavily against it from the company who 'do' Sainsbury's new builds and expansion. My guess is that the debts are close to the value of the land as viewed by the investor but a long way short of RM's valuation, hence the long-standing stalemate. The future? Who knows.

Milano wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 8:45 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 5:53 pm Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

As I understand it, Roots Hall has not been sold per se but RM has borrowed heavily against it from the company who 'do' Sainsbury's new builds and expansion. My guess is that the debts are close to the value of the land as viewed by the investor but a long way short of RM's valuation, hence the long-standing stalemate. The future? Who knows.

Sainsbury’s are not involved in the site anymore

B.whitehouse+10more wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:49 am

Milano wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 8:45 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

As I understand it, Roots Hall has not been sold per se but RM has borrowed heavily against it from the company who 'do' Sainsbury's new builds and expansion. My guess is that the debts are close to the value of the land as viewed by the investor but a long way short of RM's valuation, hence the long-standing stalemate. The future? Who knows.

Sainsbury’s are not involved in the site anymore

Yeah , they pulled out years ago. Southend Council had given permission for 500 homes & 800 more at Fossets farmm, but thats been shelved now. Sorry state they are in.

Ten point deduction confirmed on the National League website. Puts them bottom with -4 points from their 4 games.

I haven't been following this too much.
I understood they were told they would be docked 10
points of they didn't pay a certain amount of money on August 23rd, which they obviously didn't.
Are there any other threats of more points deducted if they don't pay some more money by a certain date?

Nope, they'll just be liquidated by the Court if Martin hasn't sold up within the next 40 days.

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:11 pm Nope, they'll just be liquidated by the Court if Martin hasn't sold up within the next 40 days.

Which is Shrimper fans biggest fear. Martin has piled all of his old buisness debts into the football club, bar the one that owns Roots Hall according to some of the fans.

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:11 pm Nope, they'll just be liquidated by the Court if Martin hasn't sold up within the next 40 days.

Thank you for stating the obvoius you stupid boy

Neptune's Spear wrote: ↑Fri Aug 25, 2023 11:22 am

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:11 pm Nope, they'll just be liquidated by the Court if Martin hasn't sold up within the next 40 days.

Thank you for stating the obvoius you stupid boy

it wasn't obvious to ComeOnYouO's who had asked about the outcome options and its significant it is liquidation not administration

Neptune's Spear wrote: ↑Fri Aug 25, 2023 11:22 am

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 5:11 pm Nope, they'll just be liquidated by the Court if Martin hasn't sold up within the next 40 days.

Thank you for stating the obvoius you stupid boy

Maybe become more familiar with the concept of "questions and answers" before calling others stupid.

40 days from the court hearing is Mon October 2nd. If they are liquidated on that date, what will happen to their points they have accrued?

Will fans be able to form another club, will they have the necessary funds to be able to do that?

Will Ron Martin suffer any penalties from the court?

Dunno about the points. They're usually expunged, aren't they? (I mean, I say "usually" but I can only think of what happened to Aldershot's results when they went under in the early 90s).

And any phoenix club would presumably have to start waaaaaay down in the local leagues, not a chance they'd be allowed to take Southend's existing place. Just good news for whoever finishes 21st cos they probably wouldn't go down.

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Aug 25, 2023 12:50 pm 40 days from the court hearing is Mon October 2nd. If they are liquidated on that date,

Is that a mistake on the date? The case was adjourned for 42 day ie 6 weeks and is back in court on the Wednesday 4 October?

I am not aware of the significance of the date you refer to

what will happen to their points they have accrued?

Their results and all points from their games are expunged from the table. This applies to any team ceasing to exist until circa 75% of games have been played. Thereafter if not expunged, all remaining fixtures are usually treated as opposition winning - ie gaining the 3 points, but no change to goal record. As ever, the FA claim discretion to do it differently

Will fans be able to form another club, will they have the necessary funds to be able to do that?

Will Ron Martin suffer any penalties from the court?

The matter is before the bankruptcy court, all the court can do is wind up Southend or not. Martin is not before the court. Southend United FC ( or the relevant limited liability company are)

Ron Martin is not liable in costs. He is not before the court. Southend United are. They are a limited liability company

Whether Southend United FC are trading whilst insolvent and have been for some time is a different matter and there would need to be an investigation and prosecution of the directors of Southend United FC. This would usually be initiated by the Insolvency Service

Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Fri Aug 25, 2023 12:52 pm Dunno about the points. They're usually expunged, aren't they? (I mean, I say "usually" but I can only think of what happened to Aldershot's results when they went under in the early 90s).

And any phoenix club would presumably have to start waaaaaay down in the local leagues, not a chance they'd be allowed to take Southend's existing place. Just good news for whoever finishes 21st cos they probably wouldn't go down.

Essex Senior League or the step below - Eastern Counties League Division 1 South are what rules suggest, but FA have discretion. Macclesfield started in the North West Counties League Premier Division which is the equivalent of the Step 5 Essex Senior League

Southend United will be docked another 10 points if the players etc are not paid in time.
Roots Hall is falling apart and parts of it look dangerous.

Ron Martin seems to be up to all sorts.
Some fans have protested very close to his house.
He simply ignores them.......In my opinion things are looking very grim for them and I can sadly see them folding at their next court appearance next month.

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 7:11 pm

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 5:53 pm Surprised money bags Hearn hasn’t bought it and built an housing estate on it

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

If there’s a will there’s a way as far as money bags is concerned Joe

ffs Give it a rest will ya, Barry will not dive into this particular mud pile or any other, he kept us going, unlike Ron Martin. Barry has withdrawn away from the rough and tumble

Type high wrote: ↑Sat Aug 26, 2023 8:13 am

Monkey Boy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 7:11 pm

Joe315 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2023 6:10 pm

Roots Hall is supposed to have been sold already. No money for Hearn to make.

If there’s a will there’s a way as far as money bags is concerned Joe

ffs Give it a rest will ya, Barry will not dive into this particular mud pile or any other, he kept us going, unlike Ron Martin. Barry has withdrawn away from the rough and tumble

Thank you for your comment it really means a lot to me