Primal Scream / Martin Duffy
Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2023 2:44 pm
Appreciate there's two sides to every story, but this is a painful read to anyone of a certain vintage.
The Unofficial and Independent Leyton Orient Message Board
https://lofcforum.com/forum1/phpBB3/
Just been reading up on it and you're right. 10% of something is better that just being paid per gig, I guess. And, as you said, it was what they signed up to. The statement regarding Martin Duffy seems to hint that this may not have been so clear cut in his case.Scuba Diver wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 10:20 pm ---------------------
Believe the split on the Smiths was 40-40-10-10, which Rourke/Joyce signed at the start. Of course, no band without Morrissey/Marr (as talented as Rourke was he didn't write songs), but that seems heavily loaded in Morrissey/Marr's favour if Rourke/Joyce get to split only 20% of "everything".....
If memory serves correctly, I'm sure Rourke/Joyce dragged the 'other 2' through the Courts, and won, to an extent (a larger slice of the pie).Dunners wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 6:28 amJust been reading up on it and you're right. 10% of something is better that just being paid per gig, I guess. And, as you said, it was what they signed up to. The statement regarding Martin Duffy seems to hint that this may not have been so clear cut in his case.Scuba Diver wrote: ↑Thu Jun 08, 2023 10:20 pm ---------------------
Believe the split on the Smiths was 40-40-10-10, which Rourke/Joyce signed at the start. Of course, no band without Morrissey/Marr (as talented as Rourke was he didn't write songs), but that seems heavily loaded in Morrissey/Marr's favour if Rourke/Joyce get to split only 20% of "everything".....
Anyway, this has sent me down a rabbit hole, and I came across this article explaining how Radiohead manage their finances through complex company structures akin to a conglomerate:
www.theguardian.com/music/2016/apr/29/r ... ture-firms
What was the point of your Phil Chevron anecdote?Dunners wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 10:36 am Before he died in 2013, I became on good terms with Philip Chevron (guitarist with The Pogues). It was interesting speaking to him about how band finances work, and what they can expect to earn. He explained how, back in their earlier days, their manager took 10% of Gross income, and then the band divided what was left after expenses.
Despite some best selling albums and singles, sold out tours across America, Europe and Japan, they'd often end up exhausted at the end of the year with hardly a penny to their name. Sometimes they'd even be in debt. At first the money was divided fairly equally, but gradually this changed as they started to achieve more success with MacGowan and Finer getting most of the song writing credits.
For their fourth album everyone had wised up to how to play the game, so they all tried to get song writing credits. As a result the album was a pile of sh*t and (notwithstanding 3/4 of the Hell's Ditch album that followed) marked the beginning of their end. When they reunited in the mid-2000s, they made a pact to ruthlessly exploit their legacy to ensure they all had a decent final pay day and pension. They also took more careful control of the band's finances, with all members getting an equal share of performance money.
Chevron had managed to buy a modest house in Nottingham. He chose the location purely because he happened to be brought along to a Notts Forest game one day, and just decided he'd live there. He certainly didn't live a lavish lifestyle, but had enough to get by while enjoying his real passion in life - musical theatre.
Now that you put it like that, I'm not sure. Maybe the earnings a member of a relatively successful band could expect to receive or something.TRUMP Plumbing wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 11:45 amWhat was the point of your Phil Chevron anecdote?Dunners wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 10:36 am Before he died in 2013, I became on good terms with Philip Chevron (guitarist with The Pogues). It was interesting speaking to him about how band finances work, and what they can expect to earn. He explained how, back in their earlier days, their manager took 10% of Gross income, and then the band divided what was left after expenses.
Despite some best selling albums and singles, sold out tours across America, Europe and Japan, they'd often end up exhausted at the end of the year with hardly a penny to their name. Sometimes they'd even be in debt. At first the money was divided fairly equally, but gradually this changed as they started to achieve more success with MacGowan and Finer getting most of the song writing credits.
For their fourth album everyone had wised up to how to play the game, so they all tried to get song writing credits. As a result the album was a pile of sh*t and (notwithstanding 3/4 of the Hell's Ditch album that followed) marked the beginning of their end. When they reunited in the mid-2000s, they made a pact to ruthlessly exploit their legacy to ensure they all had a decent final pay day and pension. They also took more careful control of the band's finances, with all members getting an equal share of performance money.
Chevron had managed to buy a modest house in Nottingham. He chose the location purely because he happened to be brought along to a Notts Forest game one day, and just decided he'd live there. He certainly didn't live a lavish lifestyle, but had enough to get by while enjoying his real passion in life - musical theatre.
If its pointless anecdotes you want here is an extract from Max B Gold's memoirs, Vol I - " The Mental Years"TRUMP Plumbing wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 11:45 amWhat was the point of your Phil Chevron anecdote?Dunners wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 10:36 am Before he died in 2013, I became on good terms with Philip Chevron (guitarist with The Pogues). It was interesting speaking to him about how band finances work, and what they can expect to earn. He explained how, back in their earlier days, their manager took 10% of Gross income, and then the band divided what was left after expenses.
Despite some best selling albums and singles, sold out tours across America, Europe and Japan, they'd often end up exhausted at the end of the year with hardly a penny to their name. Sometimes they'd even be in debt. At first the money was divided fairly equally, but gradually this changed as they started to achieve more success with MacGowan and Finer getting most of the song writing credits.
For their fourth album everyone had wised up to how to play the game, so they all tried to get song writing credits. As a result the album was a pile of sh*t and (notwithstanding 3/4 of the Hell's Ditch album that followed) marked the beginning of their end. When they reunited in the mid-2000s, they made a pact to ruthlessly exploit their legacy to ensure they all had a decent final pay day and pension. They also took more careful control of the band's finances, with all members getting an equal share of performance money.
Chevron had managed to buy a modest house in Nottingham. He chose the location purely because he happened to be brought along to a Notts Forest game one day, and just decided he'd live there. He certainly didn't live a lavish lifestyle, but had enough to get by while enjoying his real passion in life - musical theatre.
Average indeed. Not crap, but decidedly average. Even their much creamed over magnum-opus Screamadelica is a 6.5/7 out of 10.OTF Photography Ltd wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:50 pm Gillespie is a silly sausage and the band are overrated outside of a couple of songs. Bang average.
I think it's a stretch to even credit Primal Scream for that album.Scuba Diver wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 7:37 pmAverage indeed. Not crap, but decidedly average. Even their much creamed over magnum-opus Screamadelica is a 6.5/7 out of 10.OTF Photography Ltd wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:50 pm Gillespie is a silly sausage and the band are overrated outside of a couple of songs. Bang average.
Good point, Dunners- - essentially an Andy Weatherall production from top to bottom.Dunners wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 8:43 pmI think it's a stretch to even credit Primal Scream for that album.Scuba Diver wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 7:37 pmAverage indeed. Not crap, but decidedly average. Even their much creamed over magnum-opus Screamadelica is a 6.5/7 out of 10.OTF Photography Ltd wrote: ↑Fri Jun 09, 2023 12:50 pm Gillespie is a silly sausage and the band are overrated outside of a couple of songs. Bang average.
It would appear that things are still the same. Interesting read here in The Guardian about the financial reality for bands and artists who are touring.
Something has to be done. If only the rich can afford to be wandering minstrels pretty soon we will be up to our eyeballs in Mumford & Sons types. Nobody wants that and it has to be stopped by any means necessary.Dunners wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2024 11:41 amIt would appear that things are still the same. Interesting read here in The Guardian about the financial reality for bands and artists who are touring.
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2024/ ... ylor-swift
I hear you, but what? The youngsters are not that into live music. I've tried explaining to my kids the glory of downing several pints of Guinness before getting your ribs cracked in a sweaty, heaving mosh pit and coming out covered in blood, vomit and p*ss. But they don't see the appeal for some reason. They're weird.Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2024 12:48 pmSomething has to be done. If only the rich can afford to be wandering minstrels pretty soon we will be up to our eyeballs in Mumford & Sons types. Nobody wants that and it has to be stopped by any means necessary.Dunners wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2024 11:41 amIt would appear that things are still the same. Interesting read here in The Guardian about the financial reality for bands and artists who are touring.
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2024/ ... ylor-swift