Independent Leyton Orient Forum

We are wracking up massive losses each season, at a pretty alarming rate if you worry about the possibility of the owners deciding one day they've had enough and want to call their debts in. The aim is rightfully to become a much more sustainable club financially and we need to have how much we spend somewhat anchored in what we make.

That said, if we're at risk of relegation in January, I imagine we'll find the money for 1-2 players.

Naive question, but is financial sustainability actually achievable these days? No idea if any other league 1 or 2 teams are getting by without building up debts.

Wally Banter wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2023 12:42 pm Naive question, but is financial sustainability actually achievable these days? No idea if any other league 1 or 2 teams are getting by without building up debts.

Very true, maybe someone has the figures ?

https://www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/s ... eague.html

Quite interesting. Apparently I was wrong in what I posted earlier, clubs can't wrack up debts to owners in league 1 if spending on wages as the rules on wage to earnings ratios are quite tough. As a result league 1 and 2 finances on the surface look healthy, as those subsidies have to come via equity and cash transfers. But all the same, if the owners withdraw funding then suddenly you have a massive wage bill with no way of paying it.

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2023 11:44 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 11:30 pm

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 8:21 pm

New investment to enable the club to get rid of the dead wood , league 2 players will not get us promoted.

How does new investment get around FFP Rules ?

Surely we can’t have spent much this year ? Moncs was eighteen months ago and we had the money in from Hector.

Wage increases for L1 players in a 29 man squad. If your average wage is £2k a week thats £3 mill a year. some players will be on more some on a bit less. Jobi was on £1500 or more in the NL.

Pretty sure Travis mentioned in a Q&A that the playing budget is now in excess of £4 million.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2023 7:16 pm Pretty sure Travis mentioned in a Q&A that the playing budget is now in excess of £4 million.

So referring to the post above where it is estimated that we may have spent £3million,there should be approximately £1million left in the kitty plus any additional money from high home gate receipts and for each round of the cup we have got through and potentially more for each further round.

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:37 am

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2023 7:16 pm Pretty sure Travis mentioned in a Q&A that the playing budget is now in excess of £4 million.

So referring to the post above where it is estimated that we may have spent £3million,there should be approximately £1million left in the kitty plus any additional money from high home gate receipts and for each round of the cup we have got through and potentially more for each further round.

We have committed our budget already, in effect the £4million is spent. Bringing in Cooper, Turns and Graham late in the last window took us there, Budget was set at £3.6 million at the start of the season with $400k for players wages etc in January to cover the rest of the season. But because of our injury issues in August we had to spend the $400k then. We will have to wheel and deal in January and RW said last week at the LOFT AGM that a couple will have to leave if we want to bring anyone in this January. We don't receive Cup money until we are knocked out and if that is on Sunday we will get £22,500 for our first round win. £34,000 if we beat Chesterfield and getting through round 3 and winning is £82,000. Even with higher home attendances the receipts won't cover wages as we will lose about £1.5 million this season.

And as for our "rich" American investors they contribute every year along with T&T to cover our losses.

We don't have money to spend unless you've got some loose change?

Would be interested to know how much Stevenage had as a budget as they are doing so well as a comparison, could be they spent their budget more wisely.

Why are people fixating on Stevenage? Some clubs overachieve against their budget, some clubs underachieve. We are probably erring on underachieving right now but with the caveat that we have just been promoted and have had terrible injuries.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:41 am Why are people fixating on Stevenage? Some clubs overachieve against their budget, some clubs underachieve. We are probably erring on underachieving right now but with the caveat that we have just been promoted and have had terrible injuries.

We are definitely underachieving, need a probe into where money is wasted and why.

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:35 am Would be interested to know how much Stevenage had as a budget as they are doing so well as a comparison, could be they spent their budget more wisely.

https://salarysport.com/football/league-one/stevenage/

Don't know how accurate these are .

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:03 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:41 am Why are people fixating on Stevenage? Some clubs overachieve against their budget, some clubs underachieve. We are probably erring on underachieving right now but with the caveat that we have just been promoted and have had terrible injuries.

We are definitely underachieving, need a probe into where money is wasted and why.

https://salarysport.com/football/league ... on-orient/

According to this we spent less initially on our budget than Stevenage.

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:39 am

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:03 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:41 am Why are people fixating on Stevenage? Some clubs overachieve against their budget, some clubs underachieve. We are probably erring on underachieving right now but with the caveat that we have just been promoted and have had terrible injuries.

We are definitely underachieving, need a probe into where money is wasted and why.

https://salarysport.com/football/league ... on-orient/

According to this we spent less initially on our budget than Stevenage.

Looking at the two sets of stats and our respective positions in the table at this point in time, we need to take a leaf out of Stevenages book.
Stevenage are 4th and only 4 points off top spot and we are 16th only six points off a relegation place.

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:36 am

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:35 am Would be interested to know how much Stevenage had as a budget as they are doing so well as a comparison, could be they spent their budget more wisely.

https://salarysport.com/football/league-one/stevenage/

Don't know how accurate these are .

They are guesswork. The only people who know are the Players, the clubs and the EFL/FA who have to ratify the contracts.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:41 am Why are people fixating on Stevenage? Some clubs overachieve against their budget, some clubs underachieve. We are probably erring on underachieving right now but with the caveat that we have just been promoted and have had terrible injuries.

This.

PoundshopO sh*tting himself because Stevenage are higher in the table than we are is about right, just another "fan" who likes to highlight anything negative. Stevenage haven't had anywhere near the injuries we had at the start of the season and tbf have done very well. I think he should change his user name to "completelyunrealisticbleatingO"

Wally Banter wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2023 12:42 pm Naive question, but is financial sustainability actually achievable these days? No idea if any other league 1 or 2 teams are getting by without building up debts.

I think Walsall turned a small profit for a couple of seasons going back to pre Covid, but the football expenses are offset by a weekly market in their car park that rakes in a fair bit.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:17 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:36 am

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 29, 2023 11:35 am Would be interested to know how much Stevenage had as a budget as they are doing so well as a comparison, could be they spent their budget more wisely.

https://salarysport.com/football/league-one/stevenage/

Don't know how accurate these are .

They are guesswork. The only people who know are the Players, the clubs and the EFL/FA who have to ratify the contracts.

Yes I Kmow.

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 10:07 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:39 am

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:03 am

We are definitely underachieving, need a probe into where money is wasted and why.

https://salarysport.com/football/league ... on-orient/

According to this we spent less initially on our budget than Stevenage.

Looking at the two sets of stats and our respective positions in the table at this point in time, we need to take a leaf out of Stevenages book.
Stevenage are 4th and only 4 points off top spot and we are 16th only six points off a relegation place.

Why ?

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:38 pm

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:17 am

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 5:36 am

https://salarysport.com/football/league-one/stevenage/

Don't know how accurate these are .

They are guesswork. The only people who know are the Players, the clubs and the EFL/FA who have to ratify the contracts.

Yes I Kmow.

Sorry Joe was meant for Poundshop - no offence.he seems to have taken those figures as gospel.

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 9:02 pm

Joe315 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:38 pm

Top of the JES wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:17 am

They are guesswork. The only people who know are the Players, the clubs and the EFL/FA who have to ratify the contracts.

Yes I Kmow.

Sorry Joe was meant for Poundshop - no offence.he seems to have taken those figures as gospel.

I Know