Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Dohnut wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:43 pm

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:17 pm Labour’s no. 1 objective was economic growth and they aim to achieve this whilst taxing businesses more to expand/exist/start

Has this worked in the past?

No is the short answer.

We hear about putting more money in people’s pockets, working with businesses to generate growth and investment and being honest with people. Yet we have had nothing but the opposite.

That’s what I thought

Do you happen to have any experience in business and/or economics yourself? And how would you fix it?

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:54 pm

Dohnut wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:43 pm

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:17 pm Labour’s no. 1 objective was economic growth and they aim to achieve this whilst taxing businesses more to expand/exist/start

Has this worked in the past?

No is the short answer.

We hear about putting more money in people’s pockets, working with businesses to generate growth and investment and being honest with people. Yet we have had nothing but the opposite.

That’s what I thought

Do you happen to have any experience in business and/or economics yourself? And how would you fix it?

The best way I could help is not getting into politics. Enough idiots in there already.

but I believe in a number of things. Business not Government drive growth. So support business, including farming. And I prefer the concept of people deciding how to spend their money and not the Government deciding for them. Reduce not increase taxation. But that’s simplistic I know.

Buy low, sell high guys

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 8:33 pm Buy low, sell high guys

When you buy low it’s because someone else is selling low. And vice verse. Two way transaction!

Cracking insight

Dohnut wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 9:03 pm

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 8:33 pm Buy low, sell high guys

When you buy low it’s because someone else is selling low. And vice verse. Two way transaction!

Fantastic comment and it seems to me you are a real defender of free speech. Added to that you come across as someone who takes things seriously and sensitively. You've got a good eye for detail and a very enjoyable writing style which it is a joy to read. Your comments are very important to this forum. Keep it up!!

What, no biscuits? McShambles!

All because they're being asked to pay a little bit more Ers NI and a slightly higher minimum wage? Go on then mate, off you f*ck.

Is this the same mcvities that saw "profits skyrocket to £131m"?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/m ... e%20period.

No matter how many bosses of industry make statements on the lack of growth that will result from this budget, the likes of Long slender neck with their lack of knowledge of basic economics, will remain convinced the budget was great. As long as they perceive someone else is paying they are happy, with no concept that If the economy suffers, everybody suffers.

Sir John McVities and his fellow bosses of industry are whinging because they've got to pay a bit more tax and slightly higher wages to their lowest paid workers. So will have less profit to pay to dividends and have to pay themselves a slightly lower bonus.

That's their concern. f*** 'em.

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:23 pm Sir John McVities and his fellow bosses of industry are whinging because they've got to pay a bit more tax and slightly higher wages to their lowest paid workers. So will have less profit to pay to dividends and have to pay themselves a slightly lower bonus.

That's their concern. f*** 'em.

Not wages, National Insurance increases will stifle growth of employment and new business. Basic economics. Then again what would Reeves know as a Mortgage Advisor?

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 9:57 pm Is this the same mcvities that saw "profits skyrocket to £131m"?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/m ... e%20period.

Profit should not be a dirty word in a capitalist society.

I’ll be interested to see how the club is affected by the increased National Insurance payments. Be interesting see how much season tickets cost next time round.

Yanzi Gravy wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2024 10:34 am

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:23 pm Sir John McVities and his fellow bosses of industry are whinging because they've got to pay a bit more tax and slightly higher wages to their lowest paid workers. So will have less profit to pay to dividends and have to pay themselves a slightly lower bonus.

That's their concern. f*** 'em.

Not wages, National Insurance increases will stifle growth of employment and new business. Basic economics. Then again what would Reeves know as a Mortgage Advisor?

Corporate profits are at all time highs. Companies are sitting on massive reserves of cash. As soon as they're asked to pay a little bit more tax, their bosses whinge and whine and threaten to take their ball home. Sad.

I'm no fan of Reeves but she - and the team behind her that constructed this budget - probably know as much as some salesman reality tv 'star'.

They also probably know as much as Eton-educated, Bullingdon member, grandson of Churchill Rupert Soames who was chief whiner at the CBI conference yesterday.

"Corporate profits are at all time highs"

Correct. We are being taken for a ride on the capitalist propoganda machine which is firing on all six bleating cylinders.

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2024 10:56 am

Yanzi Gravy wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2024 10:34 am

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:23 pm Sir John McVities and his fellow bosses of industry are whinging because they've got to pay a bit more tax and slightly higher wages to their lowest paid workers. So will have less profit to pay to dividends and have to pay themselves a slightly lower bonus.

That's their concern. f*** 'em.

Not wages, National Insurance increases will stifle growth of employment and new business. Basic economics. Then again what would Reeves know as a Mortgage Advisor?

Corporate profits are at all time highs. Companies are sitting on massive reserves of cash. As soon as they're asked to pay a little bit more tax, their bosses whinge and whine and threaten to take their ball home. Sad.

I'm no fan of Reeves but she - and the team behind her that constructed this budget - probably know as much as some salesman reality tv 'star'.

They also probably know as much as Eton-educated, Bullingdon member, grandson of Churchill Rupert Soames who was chief whiner at the CBI conference yesterday.

I agree with your last two paragraphs. We need companies to do well to promote growth not to stifle it .

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:15 pm No matter how many bosses of industry make statements on the lack of growth that will result from this budget, the likes of Long slender neck with their lack of knowledge of basic economics, will remain convinced the budget was great. As long as they perceive someone else is paying they are happy, with no concept that If the economy suffers, everybody suffers.

Since when have industry bosses been known for telling the truth? I've not met many honest businessmen in my career.

BoniO wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2024 4:31 pm

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:15 pm No matter how many bosses of industry make statements on the lack of growth that will result from this budget, the likes of Long slender neck with their lack of knowledge of basic economics, will remain convinced the budget was great. As long as they perceive someone else is paying they are happy, with no concept that If the economy suffers, everybody suffers.

Since when have industry bosses been known for telling the truth? I've not met many honest businessmen in my career.

As I said basic economics, you'ed rather believe your chosen politicians

The country is on its knees in many areas because funds have been starved. Police, education, health, transport, just off the top of my head. Most of that was due to political choice but lower taxes means lower income and less money to spend on this issues. We need to raise more taxes. Improve all these issues and the country benefits as a whole. That’s how society works.

Why can’t people understand this?

People who think 'basic economics' is good enough to form a tax and spending strategy for a country are the reason we got Brexit, Truss and then Reform at 14%. The comfort of a simple 'common sense' solution will always appeal to the hard of thinking.

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 9:06 am

BoniO wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2024 4:31 pm

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 10:15 pm No matter how many bosses of industry make statements on the lack of growth that will result from this budget, the likes of Long slender neck with their lack of knowledge of basic economics, will remain convinced the budget was great. As long as they perceive someone else is paying they are happy, with no concept that If the economy suffers, everybody suffers.

Since when have industry bosses been known for telling the truth? I've not met many honest businessmen in my career.

As I said basic economics, you'ed rather believe your chosen politicians

See above. These 'industry bosses' are bitching because the dividends they pay to shareholders, and therefore the amount of bonus and options they can declare to themselves, will be reduced. That's what's driving their whinging and whining.

The amount of growth will not change because a Canadian pension fund or Saudi billionaire receives a slightly lower dividend next year.

Stowaway wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 9:27 am The country is on its knees in many areas because funds have been starved. Police, education, health, transport, just off the top of my head. Most of that was due to political choice but lower taxes means lower income and less money to spend on this issues. We need to raise more taxes. Improve all these issues and the country benefits as a whole. That’s how society works.

Why can’t people understand this?

The country can only afford what it can afford. Borrowing just increases debt, and brings problems down the line. No problem with raising taxes, raising income tax for the higher paid works fine for me. You've left it in the hands of the businesses how they recoup their loss. Naive to think they will just accept lower profits, they will look to reduce costs. Some will go bust, some will reduce staff, or take on less than in future. Millions of workers are now enrolled in pensions that are derived from business profit, business needs to grow. Reeves will not be able to hit business year on year. What she does in two years time when the monies gone, god only knows. For any government to commit in a manifesto to not increase Income Tax or National Insurance if they need to, and at the same time aim to raise living standards, is absolutely ludicrous. Its like going into bat with your hand tied behind you back. Not increasing thresholds, the back door tax rise, impacts the lowest earners the most.

Mick McQuaid wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 10:07 am People who think 'basic economics' is good enough to form a tax and spending strategy for a country are the reason we got Brexit, Truss and then Reform at 14%. The comfort of a simple 'common sense' solution will always appeal to the hard of thinking.

Anyone who understood economics didn't vote for Brexit. Lets leave one of the biggest market forces in the world and negotiate on our own, brilliant idea!

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 10:52 am

Mick McQuaid wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2024 10:07 am People who think 'basic economics' is good enough to form a tax and spending strategy for a country are the reason we got Brexit, Truss and then Reform at 14%. The comfort of a simple 'common sense' solution will always appeal to the hard of thinking.

Anyone who understood economics didn't vote for Brexit. Lets leave one of the biggest market forces in the world and negotiate on our own, brilliant idea!

And strike a deal with Australia that heaps more pressure on our struggling farmers.