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Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:45 am
by tuffers#1
E10EU wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:06 am
211 Tory MPs have made it public that they are not bothered about honesty and integrity.
These 'morally inadequates' are still in parliament, continuing to collect mega pay and benefits.
Good , there corrupt ways will end the story party for good !
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:52 am
by Dunners
Most of those who voted for him will be on Government payroll. Three quarters of non-Gov Tory MPs want him gone. That is a devastating vote, and is probably the worst outcome for the party.
Nobody would have voted against his for the fun of it. They must be seeing some scary polling data from their constituencies. And now the job of removing him is slightly harder.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 8:14 am
by BoniO
Is there any reason why there couldn’t be another vote of no confidence shortly after the local elections?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 8:25 am
by Dunners
Nope. Just requires an amendment to the 1922 Committee rules. Not impossible at all, but just slightly harder than a straightforward confidence vote defeat.
Personally, I hope he clings on a bit now. Removing him now risks a new leader hitting the GE honeymoon sweet spot, given the likely timetable.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 8:46 am
by spen666
It always amuses me that the people who get most excited about the leadership of Tory party are Labour voters and those most excited about leader of Labour Party are Tory voters
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 9:36 am
by JimbO
I like the way his "supporters" are describing it as a decisive win. They must think the electorate are morons.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:27 am
by CEB
211 Tory MP’s voted for Boris, I guess MB Gold will be along any minute to discuss the fact that Johnson’s actions in post are clearly those of a vote winner
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:32 am
by Max B Gold
CEB wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:27 am
211 Tory MP’s voted for Boris, I guess MB Gold will be along any minute to discuss the fact that Johnson’s actions in post are clearly those of a vote winner
They must be he won the vote.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:19 am
by spen666
JimbO wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 9:36 am
I like the way his "supporters" are describing it as a decisive win. They must think the electorate are morons.
Boris got I believe 58.77 % of that vote - the No confidence side got I believe 41.23% of the vote.
Thus a winning margin of 17.54%
At the last General Election, which most people regard as a decisive win for the Tories over Labour, the Tories got 43.6% of the vote and Labour got 32.1% of the vote. Thus a margin of 11.5%. or put another way a 65.53% bigger percentage margin than the Tories had in last election
The point being, without context and interpretation figures are meaningless.
All sides will spin figures to suit their aims/ POV. There are lies damn lies and statistics
PS The margin for Brexit was what? 4%?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:22 am
by Max Fowler
Yes of course.
But 40% of your own MPs saying they have no confidence in you as PM is a disaster for him.
For non tories, this is probably the best possible outcome.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:45 am
by spen666
Gary the Plumber wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:22 am
Yes of course.
But 40% of your own MPs saying they have no confidence in you as PM is a disaster for him.
For non tories, this is probably the best possible outcome.
Like I said, everyone will spin figures to suit their own agenda
40% voting NC means by a large majority the MPs do have confidence
Lets see the opposition seek a motion of no confidence in government and see what that 40% of Tory MPs do then
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:48 am
by CEB
spen666 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:19 am
JimbO wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 9:36 am
I like the way his "supporters" are describing it as a decisive win. They must think the electorate are morons.
Boris got I believe 58.77 % of that vote - the No confidence side got I believe 41.23% of the vote.
Thus a winning margin of 17.54%
At the last General Election, which most people regard as a decisive win for the Tories over Labour, the Tories got 43.6% of the vote and Labour got 32.1% of the vote. Thus a margin of 11.5%. or put another way a 65.53% bigger percentage margin than the Tories had in last election
The point being, without context and interpretation figures are meaningless.
All sides will spin figures to suit their aims/ POV. There are lies damn lies and statistics
PS The margin for Brexit was what? 4%?
All sides will spin, but why? And why “spin” in a transparent attempt to deny reality, rather than act in a way that works with where they are and begins to create a new narrative? Spin for spin’s sake isn’t even a tactic really, it’s just a half arsed attempt to stagger on a bit longer.
It’d be equally as cynical to be like “this is a sobering result, but I will learn lessons from it and I’ve heard the message loud and clear and I’ll use it to become a better leader”, but that at least would be a meaningful take on it that’d resonate with the most gullible. The “everything is great” tactic is mad
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:59 am
by Max Fowler
spen666 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:45 am
Gary the Plumber wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:22 am
Yes of course.
But 40% of your own MPs saying they have no confidence in you as PM is a disaster for him.
For non tories, this is probably the best possible outcome.
Like I said, everyone will spin figures to suit their own agenda
40% voting NC means by a large majority the MPs do have confidence
Lets see the opposition seek a motion of no confidence in government and see what that 40% of Tory MPs do then
Like I said, 40% of your people having no confidence in you is clearly not a majority but it's disastrous.
Let me try to put it into a more relatable example - say you support 10 football clubs, and the fans of 4 of those clubs want you to f*** off, you wouldn't be thinking that's good, 6 of the clubs fans want me to stay, would you?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:37 pm
by Friend or fart
Tory MP Lee Anderson, says this is all the BBC's fault. He says they & the rest of " mainstream media " having been leading a witch hunt against poor Boris, who is doing a grand job>
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:41 pm
by Gary's Big Brother
Friend or faux wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:37 pm
Tory MP Lee Anderson, says this is all the BBC's fault. He says they & the rest of " mainstream media " having been leading a witch hunt against poor Boris, who is doing a grand job>
Lee is ex Labour. Says it all really.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 1:54 pm
by Long slender neck
spen666 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 8:46 am
It always amuses me that the people who get most excited about the leadership of Tory party are Labour voters and those most excited about leader of Labour Party are Tory voters
This man getting quite excited
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 2:22 pm
by Dunners
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 3:30 pm
by spen666
CEB wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2022 11:48 am
....
All sides will spin, but why? And why “spin” in a transparent attempt to deny reality, ....
What you say is spin or denying reality, someone will say is reality
40 % of MPs rebel or Majority of Tory MPs behind Boris - even 50% more Tory's MPs support Boris as oppose him
All are reality
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 3:32 pm
by CEB
Yes, all those statistics are reality. But the implications of those numbers in every other situation are also tangible reality. And crucially, as per my point, the spin won’t work. It’s just going through the motions. Only time will tell whether that’s because he’s out of ideas and knows his days are numbered, or if he really is arrogant enough to genuinely attempt to ride it all out. I don’t know what I’d place my money on, but I do think that the rebels in the Tory party are not going to let it slide
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:41 pm
by tuffers#1
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 9:24 am
by PutneyO
Boris is a latter day Jesus Christ
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 10:06 am
by Friend or fart
PutneyO said :-Boris is a latter day Jesus Christ
I say that this is a very offensive comment & ought to be removed immediately!
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:01 am
by tuffers#1
Tory donor Maurizio Bragagni's 'foreign Muslim' comments condemned
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61745024
Good to see the Tories not letting go of Islamaphobia
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2022 6:40 am
by Orient_Man_And_Boy
PutneyO wrote: ↑Wed Jun 08, 2022 9:24 am
Boris is a latter day Jesus Christ
Well, someone’s got to …..
‘No, he’s not. He’s a very naughty boy!’
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2022 10:20 pm
by The Mindsweep
Friend or faux wrote: ↑Wed Jun 08, 2022 10:06 am
PutneyO said :-Boris is a latter day Jesus Christ
I say that this is a very offensive comment & ought to be removed immediately!
Boris is hanging around a lot longer than Jesus allegedly did.