Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:45 pm
I don’t hate anyone. I just don’t think they are good at their jobs.
I’m have the same opinion of some people I work with that aren’t good at their jobs. Doesn’t mean I hate them or they are bad people.
Recent turnaround in form not convinced you? So you won't come next season because you think we'll be rubbish? Tell me how you became an orient fan?
I literally said why I’m not getting a ST and it’s nothing to do with winning or losing. The football is turgid. I don’t agree with decisions being made so I’m voting with my feet. It won’t do much, and I’ll still go to some games but I have better things to do with my time and money when we have such obvious holes and the football is non league standard.
Let’s face it, whether you say it on here or not, 99% of orient fans know that Ross isn’t gonna be a good manager for us. So either make a stand and hope that theirs positive change, or wait 1-2 years until he gets the boot and we’ve wasted all that time.
And the ‘turnaround’ is a mirage because we aren’t as sh*t as a few teams in this league, who we’ve happened to play in a short period of time.
So when I go to a home match, I am one of the 55 or so that think Ross can succeed.
Around where I sit, around 80%, thinks he has a chance of success. So less than 40 in the rest of the stadium.
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:33 pm
Unless the fans are all singing from the same hymn sheet, we wont get success, and we are split at the moment
Seems to be two camps.....those who think Ling/Embleton are not what is required, and then theres the give Ross a chance camp
I wasnt at the game today, but there was it seems, a good few Orient fans arguing amongst themselves, something that is happening more and more.
The atmosphere is toxic at the moment, and I have no idea when it will end
Do others feel this too?
I'm with you mate. Never felt so disillusioned with Orient as I do now. Have no faith in Embleton and even less faith in Ling.
The way I see it, everybody as a Leyton Orient fan, wants him to succeed. That is very different from being for or against the appointment. I have said before, I would have preferred somebody else, but that is only my opinion, of course. I have only seen all the home games, but I am struggling to see a pattern of play and I feel at the moment, Ross appears to be tactically inept. Can he turn it around, in the coming weeks and become more tactically aware .... well of course he can .... will he .... that is the million dollar question, of course.
In my mind, there's been less reason to be divided in recent years; we could (almost) all get behind hating Beelzebub and backing the team in incredibly dysfunctional circumstances, and we were all pretty clear that promotion from the National League was the right expectation. Now that we're back in the middle of the League 2 pack, people's expectations of where Orient 'should' be in the league ladder (and how quickly we should get there) are perhaps diverging again.
Personally, given the horrible circumstances over the Summer, my hierarchy of expectations for this season were:
(a) survival
(b) stability
(c) signs of building a management team and squad to compete for promotion next year
We've achieved (a), but not (b) or (c) to any great extent. Unless Embleton delivers a really good run of form to the end of the season, I really think he should step aside and give someone else a go at the helm.
Of course, that's before you consider the bigger picture of social media's impact. People can now broadcast everything that comes into their head, and it's really hard not to jump on an opinion you disagree with, when you know that opinion is being read / heard by an audience of dozens or hundreds or thousands. There's very little focus or education around critical thinking - and facts / data seem to have little value in public or political discourse these days.
Wally Banter wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:12 am
In my mind, there's been less reason to be divided in recent years; we could (almost) all get behind hating Beelzebub and backing the team in incredibly dysfunctional circumstances, and we were all pretty clear that promotion from the National League was the right expectation. Now that we're back in the middle of the League 2 pack, people's expectations of where Orient 'should' be in the league ladder (and how quickly we should get there) are perhaps diverging again.
Personally, given the horrible circumstances over the Summer, my hierarchy of expectations for this season were:
(a) survival
(b) stability
(c) signs of building a management team and squad to compete for promotion next year
We've achieved (a), but not (b) or (c) to any great extent. Unless Embleton delivers a really good run of form to the end of the season, I really think he should step aside and give someone else a go at the helm.
Sensible post. I'd say B and C are in progress, these things take time. We've only really had the single January window to improve the squad and we cant have stability by changing the manager after half a season.
I think competing for promotion next year is a bit ambitious. Top 10 is more realistic.
First and foremost like everyone else I always want the best for the club. Happy with TT & KT, and it's pretty obvious Macklin is maximising income opportunities. Off the pitch I don't think anyone could complain and I think with the tribute to JE renaming the west stand is the perfect time to draw a line under JE's sad passing, while always remembering him.
Football wise we all seem to have opinions that fall broadly into two camps. For me as much as I respect what Martin Ling & Ross Embleton for what they have done helping the club to recover from the mess of three years ago, I'm not sure that they are the dream ticket that will take the club forward.
Normally I don't get over excited when we win or too down when we lose,the rider with that is I expect to see us try and win games, pass and press with tempo and intent wether it's against top or bottom of the table, had we gone out on Saturday and played with real intent first half we could and would have made it more difficult for Cheltenham than it actually was but we never really pinned them back. The second half was spirited defence and I accept conditions played their part but the substitutions and formation change IMHO condemed us to defeat.
There is obviously much work to do in building a team capable of finishing top seven which should be our target next season, we need to bring in some creativity and pace and ensure we have players playing in their correct positions,I accept RE will be in charge at the start of next season and wish him every success but if he fails both Ling and Embleton should move on and an experienced manager brought in to handle all football matters.
Wally Banter wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:12 am
In my mind, there's been less reason to be divided in recent years; we could (almost) all get behind hating Beelzebub and backing the team in incredibly dysfunctional circumstances, and we were all pretty clear that promotion from the National League was the right expectation. Now that we're back in the middle of the League 2 pack, people's expectations of where Orient 'should' be in the league ladder (and how quickly we should get there) are perhaps diverging again.
Personally, given the horrible circumstances over the Summer, my hierarchy of expectations for this season were:
(a) survival
(b) stability
(c) signs of building a management team and squad to compete for promotion next year
We've achieved (a), but not (b) or (c) to any great extent. Unless Embleton delivers a really good run of form to the end of the season, I really think he should step aside and give someone else a go at the helm.
Sensible post. I'd say B and C are in progress, these things take time. We've only really had the single January window to improve the squad and we cant have stability by changing the manager after half a season.
I think competing for promotion next year is a bit ambitious. Top 10 is more realistic.
Why shouldn't we be challenging for a promotion spot next season?
In Vigaro, Marvin, Happe, Brophy, Cisse, JMD, Angol and Wilkinson, plus the likes of Ruel, Judd and Hector who will continue to develop, we have the makings of a promotion team.
We have one of the biggest fanbases, the biggest incomes and biggest playing budgets in this division. Why shouldn't we be hitting those top spots?
Wally Banter wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:12 am
In my mind, there's been less reason to be divided in recent years; we could (almost) all get behind hating Beelzebub and backing the team in incredibly dysfunctional circumstances, and we were all pretty clear that promotion from the National League was the right expectation. Now that we're back in the middle of the League 2 pack, people's expectations of where Orient 'should' be in the league ladder (and how quickly we should get there) are perhaps diverging again.
Personally, given the horrible circumstances over the Summer, my hierarchy of expectations for this season were:
(a) survival
(b) stability
(c) signs of building a management team and squad to compete for promotion next year
We've achieved (a), but not (b) or (c) to any great extent. Unless Embleton delivers a really good run of form to the end of the season, I really think he should step aside and give someone else a go at the helm.
Sensible post. I'd say B and C are in progress, these things take time. We've only really had the single January window to improve the squad and we cant have stability by changing the manager after half a season.
I think competing for promotion next year is a bit ambitious. Top 10 is more realistic.
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
Evidence of biggest incomes and budgets please?
Marvin is out of contract.
Cisse isnt our player.
Angol and Wilkinson havent pulled up any trees.
Much of the squad are below promotion standard or lacking league experience, in the summer we will have the opportunity to move a few on and improve.
We dont have any right to be playing League One football, our attendances are one of the highest in Lg2 or the worst in Lg1.
So whose fault is it these players are below promotion standard? The funding is there - T&T have been quite open about where we sit as payers. It's not about having a 'right' to be a L1 team but if you're spending more money on players and staff than other teams, you should have a better team than them.
Wally Banter wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:12 am
In my mind, there's been less reason to be divided in recent years; we could (almost) all get behind hating Beelzebub and backing the team in incredibly dysfunctional circumstances, and we were all pretty clear that promotion from the National League was the right expectation. Now that we're back in the middle of the League 2 pack, people's expectations of where Orient 'should' be in the league ladder (and how quickly we should get there) are perhaps diverging again.
Personally, given the horrible circumstances over the Summer, my hierarchy of expectations for this season were:
(a) survival
(b) stability
(c) signs of building a management team and squad to compete for promotion next year
We've achieved (a), but not (b) or (c) to any great extent. Unless Embleton delivers a really good run of form to the end of the season, I really think he should step aside and give someone else a go at the helm.
Sensible post. I'd say B and C are in progress, these things take time. We've only really had the single January window to improve the squad and we cant have stability by changing the manager after half a season.
I think competing for promotion next year is a bit ambitious. Top 10 is more realistic.
Couldn't we have improved in the summer?
We did sign Josh Wright and extended Clay, Coulson, Brill, Jobi, Dayton and Harolds contracts.
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
Evidence of biggest incomes and budgets please?
Marvin is out of contract.
Cisse isnt our player.
Angol and Wilkinson havent pulled up any trees.
Much of the squad are below promotion standard or lacking league experience, in the summer we will have the opportunity to move a few on and improve.
We dont have any right to be playing League One football, our attendances are one of the highest in Lg2 or the worst in Lg1.
So whose fault is it these players are below promotion standard? The funding is there - T&T have been quite open about where we sit as payers. It's not about having a 'right' to be a L1 team but if you're spending more money on players and staff than other teams, you should have a better team than them.
Unless something is wrong somewhere.
UNLESS, we just came up from the NL and players are still contracted and also the manager died?
What would you have ML do? Pay up anyone deemed not good enough and bring in like 10 players all in the short space of a couple of grief stricken months? The squad is evolving, be patient.
Sensible post. I'd say B and C are in progress, these things take time. We've only really had the single January window to improve the squad and we cant have stability by changing the manager after half a season.
I think competing for promotion next year is a bit ambitious. Top 10 is more realistic.
Couldn't we have improved in the summer?
We did sign Josh Wright and extended Clay, Coulson, Brill, Jobi, Dayton and Harolds contracts.
Wright was already lined up. A contract extension is a lot easier than recruiting brand new players.
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
Evidence of biggest incomes and budgets please?
Marvin is out of contract.
Cisse isnt our player.
Angol and Wilkinson havent pulled up any trees.
Much of the squad are below promotion standard or lacking league experience, in the summer we will have the opportunity to move a few on and improve.
We dont have any right to be playing League One football, our attendances are one of the highest in Lg2 or the worst in Lg1.
So whose fault is it these players are below promotion standard? The funding is there - T&T have been quite open about where we sit as payers. It's not about having a 'right' to be a L1 team but if you're spending more money on players and staff than other teams, you should have a better team than them.
Unless something is wrong somewhere.
UNLESS, we just came up from the NL and players are still contracted and also the manager died?
What would you have ML do? Pay up anyone deemed not good enough and bring in like 10 players all in the short space of a couple of grief stricken months? The squad is evolving, be patient.
Not asking for anyone to be paid up - Alabi excluded - but maybe not extend contracts of players who might not be able to cope.
So whose fault is it these players are below promotion standard? The funding is there - T&T have been quite open about where we sit as payers. It's not about having a 'right' to be a L1 team but if you're spending more money on players and staff than other teams, you should have a better team than them.
Unless something is wrong somewhere.
UNLESS, we just came up from the NL and players are still contracted and also the manager died?
What would you have ML do? Pay up anyone deemed not good enough and bring in like 10 players all in the short space of a couple of grief stricken months? The squad is evolving, be patient.
Not asking for anyone to be paid up - Alabi excluded - but maybe not extend contracts of players who might not be able to cope.
We're already hamstrung for next season.
So dont give extensions to the keeper who played every game, the captain, the guy who won player of the season or the influential veteran?
