bobo66 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:08 pm
Let's be brutally honest. I suspect he got the job because he was willing to come and not choose his own assistant (and other backroom staff) and he was quite cheap.
bobo66 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:08 pm
Let's be brutally honest. I suspect he got the job because he was willing to come and not choose his own assistant (and other backroom staff) and he was quite cheap.
I think you have probably got it in one.
Agreed but it won't be cheap to replace .
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:33 pm
by Max B Gold
bobo66 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:08 pm
Let's be brutally honest. I suspect he got the job because he was willing to come and not choose his own assistant (and other backroom staff) and he was quite cheap.
It's not cheap if the gamble you suspect doesn't pay off.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:02 pm
by Chief crazy horse
Yes, that's more or less the reason. (and that he doesn't present any threat to Lings standing at the club) And this is why when hiring managers we are at a big big disadvantage.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:08 pm
by Max B Gold
Chief crazy horse wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:02 pm
Yes, that's more or less the reason. (and that he doesn't present any threat to Lings standing at the club) And this is why when hiring managers we are at a big big disadvantage.
Agreed Horse"""YYYY boy.
I have nothing against Martin Ling but I have never been in favour of this Director of Soccerball at a small club from the start. A decent CEO to look after owners and investors interests and a strong experienced manager is all that is required.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:15 pm
by Ronnie Hotdogs
Chief crazy horse wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:02 pm
Yes, that's more or less the reason. (and that he doesn't present any threat to Lings standing at the club) And this is why when hiring managers we are at a big big disadvantage.
So why did we hire Justin last time we went through this process?
Chief crazy horse wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:02 pm
Yes, that's more or less the reason. (and that he doesn't present any threat to Lings standing at the club) And this is why when hiring managers we are at a big big disadvantage.
So why did we hire Justin last time we went through this process?
He was an experienced manager who knew the lower divisions and the NL.
Chief crazy horse wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:02 pm
Yes, that's more or less the reason. (and that he doesn't present any threat to Lings standing at the club) And this is why when hiring managers we are at a big big disadvantage.
So why did we hire Justin last time we went through this process?
He was an experienced manager who knew the lower divisions and the NL.
As opposed to Fletch who doesn't know lower league football and his last experience was 6 years ago.
So why did we hire Justin last time we went through this process?
He was an experienced manager who knew the lower divisions and the NL.
As opposed to Fletch who doesn't know lower league football and his last experience was 6 years ago.
sh*t process if you ask me.
Same process different result. Weird.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:19 pm
by Thor
Different process and we got a different result. Justin would not be considered now under the process they used this time as he'd had multiple clubs.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:31 pm
by redintheface
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:19 pm
Different process and we got a different result. Justin would not be considered now under the process they used this time as he'd had multiple clubs.
Not according to Porter & Ling Snr. They say the“ process” used to select Fletcher was the same one that got us Edinburgh and Steve Davis. Make of that what you will. Indicates two things very clearly to me :-
1. that any recruitment process is only as good as the candidates available
2. that insisting on preconditions likely to exclude good, experienced candidates is a bad mistake.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:35 pm
by Thor
No porter said they will not be selecting or recruiting someone who has been at other multiple clubs. Justin had multiple clubs on his cv so I'm guessing he would not qualify now due to this new way of doing things.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:44 pm
by Max B Gold
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:35 pm
No porter said they will not be selecting or recruiting someone who has been at other multiple clubs. Justin had multiple clubs on his cv so I'm guessing he would not qualify now due to this new way of doing things.
Porter is talking poo poo.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:59 pm
by redintheface
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:35 pm
No porter said they will not be selecting or recruiting someone who has been at other multiple clubs. Justin had multiple clubs on his cv so I'm guessing he would not qualify now due to this new way of doing things.
Thor, I am referring to the recruitment “ process” as defined by Ling in his interview given after RE announced he was stepping down which as in essence contains the following stages :
1. Invite applications/ CVs
2. Ling sorts out the wheat from the chaff
3. Ling “ informally “ approaches the half dozen or so possibles “ over a cup of coffee”
4. Based on the informal discussions Ling narrows down the list to three or four candidates to be interviewed by the Board
5. Interviews take place and successful candidate selected
The fact that the Board ( as per Porter’s comments) chose to add a rider that candidates who had “ multiple previous clubs” on their CV is outside of “ the process” itself. Whether this requirement was known to Ling before he did his recruiting or was added later when the candidates were narrowed down to the last few I don’t know. Whenever it was added it seems to me like a bloody big mistake, much like stipulating that the existing coaching staff must be retained in it’s entirety.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:27 pm
by Osal
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:35 pm
No porter said they will not be selecting or recruiting someone who has been at other multiple clubs. Justin had multiple clubs on his cv so I'm guessing he would not qualify now due to this new way of doing things.
Wow, that is astounding if true, majority of managers up and down the leagues, would have multiple clubs on their CV's! Football wise, I am starting to wonder about our board of directors. Don't get me wrong, I am still grateful for T&T saving the club, but I would, like the majority of us, I guess, see us continue to make progress on the Football side. Sort of understand how we ended up with someone like Fletcher, then. Just out of interest, I wonder what figure they determined as multiple!
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 4:59 pm
by VeganO
Its clearly too early to sack Fletcher but results & performances have been worrying since he took over.
Personally I would give him until sometime next month. We cannot afford to get relegated again & this must take priority over everything else.
It is starting to look like a big mistake appointing him.
As others have said you wonder what's going on behind the scenes as he came in on the back of 3 league wins on the bounce. Injuries don't help but you simply cannot have displays like the ones against Argyle, Morecambe & worst of all last Sun.
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:35 pm
No porter said they will not be selecting or recruiting someone who has been at other multiple clubs. Justin had multiple clubs on his cv so I'm guessing he would not qualify now due to this new way of doing things.
Wow, that is astounding if true, majority of managers up and down the leagues, would have multiple clubs on their CV's! Football wise, I am starting to wonder about our board of directors. Don't get me wrong, I am still grateful for T&T saving the club, but I would, like the majority of us, I guess, see us continue to make progress on the Football side. Sort of understand how we ended up with someone like Fletcher, then. Just out of interest, I wonder what figure they determined as multiple!
bobo66 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:08 pm
Let's be brutally honest. I suspect he got the job because he was willing to come and not choose his own assistant (and other backroom staff) and he was quite cheap.
I think you have probably got it in one.
Agreed but he won't be cheap to replace .
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:40 pm
by Article_50
Let's be brutally honest. I suspect he got the job because he was willing to come and not choose his own assistant (and other backroom staff) and he was quite cheap.
That's about right
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:44 pm
by RedDwarf 1881
Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:19 pm
Different process and we got a different result. Justin would not be considered now under the process they used this time as he'd had multiple clubs.
I know, it’s hard to believe. Let’s face it, the club’s dropped a right clanger on this one.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:16 pm
by redintheface
[
I thought it might be of interest to re- post the Martin Ling on “ the process” leading to Carl Fletcher’s selection as new head coach.
I thought it might be of interest to re- post the Martin Ling on “ the process” leading to Carl Fletcher’s selection as new head coach.
Doesn’t make for comfortable listening.
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:47 pm
by F*ck The Poor & Fat
Dean Smith was assistant Manager at Leyton Orient for four years. Also he was head of Youth at Walsall before getting the caretaker, then manager Job at Walsall, in effect an internal promotion within a club he knew well, players and Board and with decent experience as an assistant.
Martin Ling has been a player at Leyton Orient for four years, under Barry Hearn and became caretaker manager, then Manager under Hearn. Hardly taking on an unknown quantity, Ling knew the club very well and probably Hearn too.
I’m struggling to see the similarities between the chances they got and that of Fletcher as per the Ling interview Sorry it his comments just don’t stack up. More like you make your choice and then fit everything around it.
The process Lings talks of is just that, a process. Whilst that remains the same what can change is the criteria for the job used within the process
I thought it might be of interest to re- post the Martin Ling on “ the process” leading to Carl Fletcher’s selection as new head coach.
Doesn’t make for comfortable listening.
He certainly doesn’t know when to stop digging !
Re: f*cking disgraceful
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:19 pm
by F*ck The Poor & Fat
Having now listened to it a few times, he’s put in a little cop out clause about no magic wand for getting it right.
Very Naive in places. Due diligence, chatting to people who have f*** all idea whether he could be a successful league manager. But he’s a nice guy who wants the job. That’s OK then.
Nigel talking to their Board. They will have f*** all idea too. That chat probably about any compensation issues
Covered the Dean Smith/Martin Ling chances already. Totally different and not relevant at all.
Ticking all the boxes, depends on what you deem is top, totally flexible. Totally fixable.
Leader, so his L1/L2 competition we’re not after 200 odd games experience
Like that he failed. I bet the other candidates had too at some point
Dealing with a skint club. Limited money is par for the course Mostly In L1/L2
The more I see this interview the it seems to be smoke and mirrors. Beginning to think people are right, he was cheap, desperate and willing to fit into any structure going. And won’t be a difficult guy for Ling to deal with.
But he is here to stay short of absolutely f*cking it up. The club will ride out the storm in the hope he finally gets a few decent results, when they will say, Told you so. We’re in for a rocky ride