Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Joe.Cork315 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:25 am

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:38 am

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:37 am



Good luck for that without a recognised striker...

He clarified that. He said ‘making sure we have all the equipment’. Providing footballs for training=promotion

Overnights as well & lots of rest, with Saturday Tuesday for Feb & March they'll need it.

Should be doing that anyway

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:53 pm

BoniO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:59 am

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:38 am

He clarified that. He said ‘making sure we have all the equipment’. Providing footballs for training=promotion

Really not sure what kind of owners would prevent you having a negative outlook tbh. Bit sad.

They’ve done a lot of good for the club but I don’t have to suffer the bollocks they come out with to appreciate the good. You might want to.

That would sound fine if you didn't badmouth them at every opportunity. Like I said, bit sad.

BoniO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:57 pm

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:53 pm

BoniO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:59 am

Really not sure what kind of owners would prevent you having a negative outlook tbh. Bit sad.

They’ve done a lot of good for the club but I don’t have to suffer the bollocks they come out with to appreciate the good. You might want to.

That would sound fine if you didn't badmouth them at every opportunity. Like I said, bit sad.

Can you read? I said they’ve done a lot of good for the club. I’m sure the group of multimillionaires are really upset that a nobody on a forum thinks they talk bollocks sometimes.

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:03 pm

BoniO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:57 pm

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:53 pm
They’ve done a lot of good for the club but I don’t have to suffer the bollocks they come out with to appreciate the good. You might want to.

That would sound fine if you didn't badmouth them at every opportunity. Like I said, bit sad.

Can you read? I said they’ve done a lot of good for the club. I’m sure the group of multimillionaires are really upset that a nobody on a forum thinks they talk bollocks sometimes.

The bloke literally wrote a book called "The Challenge Culture" - if anything is an issue at Orient it's that he doesn't get enough pushback.

OyinbO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:10 pm

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:03 pm

BoniO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 4:57 pm

That would sound fine if you didn't badmouth them at every opportunity. Like I said, bit sad.

Can you read? I said they’ve done a lot of good for the club. I’m sure the group of multimillionaires are really upset that a nobody on a forum thinks they talk bollocks sometimes.

The bloke literally wrote a book called "The Challenge Culture" - if anything is an issue at Orient it's that he doesn't get enough pushback.

After the previous owner, you’d think fans would be more on top of questioning decisions of the new lot

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:18 pm

OyinbO wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:10 pm

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:03 pm
Can you read? I said they’ve done a lot of good for the club. I’m sure the group of multimillionaires are really upset that a nobody on a forum thinks they talk bollocks sometimes.

The bloke literally wrote a book called "The Challenge Culture" - if anything is an issue at Orient it's that he doesn't get enough pushback.

After the previous owner, you’d think fans would be more on top of questioning decisions of the new lot

That's probably one of the reasons so many are so fragile when it comes to criticising the owners, they don't want to scare off the nice cuddly guy who saved our Club.

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:37 am “I’m obsessed with succession planning and talent management” says the man with a background in HR who oversaw the Embleton, Fletcher, Embleton, Jobi, Jackett experiment.

Whilst humorous, the reality is that Embleton (post JE and Orient through and through), Jobi (possible new kid on the block) and Jackett (experienced manager, outstanding statistical record as a manager) were all feasible in the context of the situation at the time. Fletcher, however, was the worst appointment ever, one wonders who else applied for the job as Fletcher was almost unemployable, to NTs credit he was out of the building within a month.

I've been critical of Orient Outlooks format in the past, but their interviews are conducted very well.
Recommended to those like me, who don't normally tune in.

The Voice of Reason wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:10 am

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:37 am “I’m obsessed with succession planning and talent management” says the man with a background in HR who oversaw the Embleton, Fletcher, Embleton, Jobi, Jackett experiment.

Whilst humorous, the reality is that Embleton (post JE and Orient through and through), Jobi (possible new kid on the block) and Jackett (experienced manager, outstanding statistical record as a manager) were all feasible in the context of the situation at the time. Fletcher, however, was the worst appointment ever, one wonders who else applied for the job as Fletcher was almost unemployable, to NTs credit he was out of the building within a month.

At least Fletcher had played football to a decent level, had previous management experience (although only brief) and had been employed within a football club in a coaching role based on his own merits, not because his dad was mates with certain people.

Why on Earth was Fletcher "unemployable"? He absolutely tanked but nothing in his CV prior to joining us suggested that was inevitable.

Orient’s recruitment not doing their due diligence on Fletcher by checking into his future performance

We really should be asking what it is about Orient that makes it career-ending for aspiring young Managers: Embleton, Fletcher, Jobi. Even experienced heads have all called it a day after getting canned here: Davis, Jackett.

OyinbO wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:45 am We really should be asking what it is about Orient that makes it career-ending for aspiring young Managers: Embleton, Fletcher, Jobi. Even experienced heads have all called it a day after getting canned here: Davis, Jackett.

All of them are still involved in football apart from Jobi who is in media

OyinbO wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:45 am We really should be asking what it is about Orient that makes it career-ending for aspiring young Managers: Embleton, Fletcher, Jobi. Even experienced heads have all called it a day after getting canned here: Davis, Jackett.

Imagine the fact Jackett has retired might be news to his current employers.

The issue with Fletcher was he wanted to clear out players that the owners liked.

Davis obviously still working in the game as well and even managed a few for Wolves as caretaker. Odd take.

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 12:23 pm The issue with Fletcher was he wanted to clear out players that the owners liked.

And that his support staff were actively plotting against him after deciding (incorrectly) they could be a manager after all.

Lifelongfan wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 12:13 pm

OyinbO wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:45 am We really should be asking what it is about Orient that makes it career-ending for aspiring young Managers: Embleton, Fletcher, Jobi. Even experienced heads have all called it a day after getting canned here: Davis, Jackett.

All of them are still involved in football apart from Jobi who is in media

I should have been clearer: I meant a career in football management, not a career in football.

None of them are Managers/First Team Head Coaches, or have held one of those roles on anything other than a short-term caretaker basis at any point since being binned by Orient.

(TBF Jobi wasn't "binned" per se, his playing contract was allowed to run out)

Is it interesting? If any of them had gone on to succeed elsewhere, I imagine the criticism would be 'well it they could do it at x what was wrong at Orient?!' failing as a manager at league 2 and non conference is normally your last chance to make it, and TBF, Embleton and Fletcher were not good appointments.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:46 pm Is it interesting? If any of them had gone on to succeed elsewhere, I imagine the criticism would be 'well it they could do it at x what was wrong at Orient?!' failing as a manager at league 2 and non conference is normally your last chance to make it, and TBF, Embleton and Fletcher were not good appointments.

Well I can't answer to criticisms that haven't been made about situations that haven't happened, but if Travis is getting praised here for being a top HR exec who knows how to handle things, then it's reasonable to ask why Orient has done such a rotten job at developing managerial talent, and whether it actually killed their desire to continue in that career.

Are two league titles not enough for some people? For Nigel to be considered a 'top HR exec' would we have had to have won the Champions League by now?

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 4:03 pm Are two league titles not enough for some people? For Nigel to be considered a 'top HR exec' would we have had to have won the Champions League by now?

As Nigel himself will be the first to remind you, when it comes to annual appraisal time, even top performers need to be given areas they can improve in.

The Voice of Reason wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:10 am

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:37 am “I’m obsessed with succession planning and talent management” says the man with a background in HR who oversaw the Embleton, Fletcher, Embleton, Jobi, Jackett experiment.

Whilst humorous, the reality is that Embleton (post JE and Orient through and through), Jobi (possible new kid on the block) and Jackett (experienced manager, outstanding statistical record as a manager) were all feasible in the context of the situation at the time. Fletcher, however, was the worst appointment ever, one wonders who else applied for the job as Fletcher was almost unemployable, to NTs credit he was out of the building within a month.

Embleton second time around was not feasablable. Jobi was not feasable.

The Fletcher situation reminds me of something RW said in an interview about his early managerial career where he hadn't learnt the subtleties of getting his message across.

The brand of football Fletcher wanted was right but with that group of players in the situation we were in didn't fit at all. Wanted an "arms around shoulders" type manager to steady the ship rather than someone hungry to rip it up and rebuild in his own image

All that said he was proven right in the end regarding needing most of that squad replaced though.

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 4:51 pm

The Voice of Reason wrote: ↑Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:10 am

BiggsyMalone wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:37 am “I’m obsessed with succession planning and talent management” says the man with a background in HR who oversaw the Embleton, Fletcher, Embleton, Jobi, Jackett experiment.

Whilst humorous, the reality is that Embleton (post JE and Orient through and through), Jobi (possible new kid on the block) and Jackett (experienced manager, outstanding statistical record as a manager) were all feasible in the context of the situation at the time. Fletcher, however, was the worst appointment ever, one wonders who else applied for the job as Fletcher was almost unemployable, to NTs credit he was out of the building within a month.

Embleton second time around was not feasablable. Jobi was not feasable.

Jobi was never given a real chance. Embleton had plenty.