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Just fine. They'll have been in government for a decade and a half before Labour even gets a sniff.Max Fowler wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:18 pm So the strategy is to just be tories?
How's that going for the tories right now?
You're not understanding what has happened. The LP is just another fraction of the ruling class and its role is to deliver for business. This is how it has been since before Blair.Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 12:37 pmThe thing I don’t really get is that they don’t really need to do a lot to get into power considering how the current lot have f*cked up. It’s possibly the only time in our lives where Labour have a bit of free rein to be a genuine alternative and still get traditional Tory votes. Instead they’ve gone the other way on a desperate craving for power and to keep donors and ceos happy. Bizarre state of politics we have nowCEB wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 9:43 am Yeah, I mean it’s gone past the point where I can say “at the very least it’ll be slightly better than the Tories” because for a lot of people it really won’t, and this time without the hope that it’ll get better.
There’s distancing yourself from the previous leader, then there’s this…
I asked how is that going right now.Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:21 pmJust fine. They'll have been in government for a decade and a half before Labour even gets a sniff.Max Fowler wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:18 pm So the strategy is to just be tories?
How's that going for the tories right now?
Pretty dire, but some polls indicate that the gap is narrowing. And analysis of results in some of the target constituencies that Labour need to aim for suggests that gap is a lot narrower. The most credible projections right now are that Labour might achieve a minority government. If they're lucky and nothing goes wrong.Max Fowler wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:33 pmI asked how is that going right now.Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:21 pmJust fine. They'll have been in government for a decade and a half before Labour even gets a sniff.Max Fowler wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:18 pm So the strategy is to just be tories?
How's that going for the tories right now?
Once again, the policies being pursued are not about winning an election. They are about neutering the working class on behalf of the ruling class and the boot licking Labour managerial class.Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:07 pmPretty dire, but some polls indicate that the gap is narrowing. And analysis of results in some of the target constituencies that Labour need to aim for suggests that gap is a lot narrower. The most credible projections right now are that Labour might achieve a minority government. If they're lucky and nothing goes wrong.
National snapshots are all well and good, but you cannot ignore the shy-Tory vote and that no party has ever come back from a defeat on the scale of the 2019 result and achieved a working majority at the following election. Despite everything, the 2025 election is still for the Tories to lose.
But if you feel a more radical manifesto and popular (centre) left policies would swing it right now, then maybe you're right. But some people, who study the numbers, have calculated that you're not.
Anyway, where you live it wont make any difference. I think your Tory MP won over half of the votes in both previous elections, so you can rest assured you'll be safe after the next one.
Assuming this turns out to be the case - who do they have to rely upon to be able to transact business? SNP would presumably insist upon another Indyref? LibDems another shot at PR ? Greens would presumable either insist on PR or tell them to GTF. I guess, since they seem to agree with the Tories on just about everything, they might just work together with them?Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:07 pm The most credible projections right now are that Labour might achieve a minority government. If they're lucky and nothing goes wrong.
National snapshots are all well and good, but you cannot ignore the shy-Tory vote and that no party has ever come back from a defeat on the scale of the 2019 result and achieved a working majority at the following election. Despite everything, the 2025 election is still for the Tories to lose.
But if you feel a more radical manifesto and popular (centre) left policies would swing it right now, then maybe you're right. But some people, who study the numbers, have calculated that you're not.
Anyway, where you live it wont make any difference. I think your Tory MP won over half of the votes in both previous elections, so you can rest assured you'll be safe after the next one.
You deliberately left out the Ulsturrr Unionists who share the same love of the flag as Labour. A Union flag in the centre of every city, town, village and hamlet would seal the deal.StillSpike wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 5:12 pmAssuming this turns out to be the case - who do they have to rely upon to be able to transact business? SNP would presumably insist upon another Indyref? LibDems another shot at PR ? Greens would presumable either insist on PR or tell them to GTF. I guess, since they seem to agree with the Tories on just about everything, they might just work together with them?Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:07 pm The most credible projections right now are that Labour might achieve a minority government. If they're lucky and nothing goes wrong.
National snapshots are all well and good, but you cannot ignore the shy-Tory vote and that no party has ever come back from a defeat on the scale of the 2019 result and achieved a working majority at the following election. Despite everything, the 2025 election is still for the Tories to lose.
But if you feel a more radical manifesto and popular (centre) left policies would swing it right now, then maybe you're right. But some people, who study the numbers, have calculated that you're not.
Anyway, where you live it wont make any difference. I think your Tory MP won over half of the votes in both previous elections, so you can rest assured you'll be safe after the next one.
Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 3:23 pm Definitely a gap in the UK market for electability advice from socialists
If that were to happen, I could see all parties foregoing any formal agreement and instead a confidence and supply arrangement on an ad hoc basis. It would be mesy and probably short-lived.StillSpike wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 5:12 pmAssuming this turns out to be the case - who do they have to rely upon to be able to transact business? SNP would presumably insist upon another Indyref? LibDems another shot at PR ? Greens would presumable either insist on PR or tell them to GTF. I guess, since they seem to agree with the Tories on just about everything, they might just work together with them?Dunners wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:07 pm The most credible projections right now are that Labour might achieve a minority government. If they're lucky and nothing goes wrong.
National snapshots are all well and good, but you cannot ignore the shy-Tory vote and that no party has ever come back from a defeat on the scale of the 2019 result and achieved a working majority at the following election. Despite everything, the 2025 election is still for the Tories to lose.
But if you feel a more radical manifesto and popular (centre) left policies would swing it right now, then maybe you're right. But some people, who study the numbers, have calculated that you're not.
Anyway, where you live it wont make any difference. I think your Tory MP won over half of the votes in both previous elections, so you can rest assured you'll be safe after the next one.
Who is this Hebden fellow?Max B Gold wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 3:09 pm Could even be the biggest landslide in history if they added a popular policy like removing the two child limit on benefits to reduce child poverty. But who am I to dictate to the Peoples Party.
They overturned a 20 000 majority.Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Jul 20, 2023 9:14 pm Hot off the press from my source close to the candidate in Selby.
The Starmer policy on the two kids benefit situation has gone down like a lead balloon. Campaign badly damaged but they expect to win by a few thousand.
No thanks to Starmer. My source tells me the New baby faced MP strongly opposes the two kid benefit cap. Starmer out. Mather for leader.FrankOFile wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 8:45 amThey overturned a 20 000 majority.Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Jul 20, 2023 9:14 pm Hot off the press from my source close to the candidate in Selby.
The Starmer policy on the two kids benefit situation has gone down like a lead balloon. Campaign badly damaged but they expect to win by a few thousand.
May also have been down to leftists voting Green.ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 11:02 am Labout failing to take Uxbridge, was down to one thing....ULEZ.
Its hated, and will cost Labour dearly in the next Mayoral Elections.
On paper this was the most certain seat the Tories would lose, but people made their feelings known.
Yep. Tories won by 495 votes.Max B Gold wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 11:06 amMay also have been down to leftists voting Green.ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 11:02 am Labout failing to take Uxbridge, was down to one thing....ULEZ.
Its hated, and will cost Labour dearly in the next Mayoral Elections.
On paper this was the most certain seat the Tories would lose, but people made their feelings known.
Only a 46% turnout? Jeez.Dunners wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 12:00 pmYep. Tories won by 495 votes.Max B Gold wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 11:06 amMay also have been down to leftists voting Green.ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 21, 2023 11:02 am Labout failing to take Uxbridge, was down to one thing....ULEZ.
Its hated, and will cost Labour dearly in the next Mayoral Elections.
On paper this was the most certain seat the Tories would lose, but people made their feelings known.
The Lib Dems, got 526 & Greens got 893. That's 1,419 votes that could have been used tactically. I wonder how happy those Lib Dem and Green voters will be feeling about the result?
However, 54% of voters just didn't bother. Labour should be worried by that level of apathy.