Independent Leyton Orient Forum

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:49 am

faldO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:43 am Well done to Trump and the Republicans, who won well. A victory for fascists, Nazis and garbage everywhere.

Hard not to feel sympathy for the Democrat leadership and liberal elite who chose probably the only person who could have lost to Trump. They put identity politics above competence and have paid the price.

The problem is there's no point branding your political opponents things like that while having no answers for fixing the problems that you , yourself created . Trump is back in power because of the failure of left wing policies . Edit . I agree with your second point . I don't think the Democrats could have chosen a worse candidate who in turn chose the worse running mate . I still believe anybody half decent who actually knew what they were talking about would have given Trump a much tougher race

What left wing?

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:53 am He’s going to win every swing state

Possibly yes . It's a massacre. This is what you call a landslide

Hoover Attack wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:54 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:49 am

faldO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:43 am Well done to Trump and the Republicans, who won well. A victory for fascists, Nazis and garbage everywhere.

Hard not to feel sympathy for the Democrat leadership and liberal elite who chose probably the only person who could have lost to Trump. They put identity politics above competence and have paid the price.

The problem is there's no point branding your political opponents things like that while having no answers for fixing the problems that you , yourself created . Trump is back in power because of the failure of left wing policies . Edit . I agree with your second point . I don't think the Democrats could have chosen a worse candidate who in turn chose the worse running mate . I still believe anybody half decent who actually knew what they were talking about would have given Trump a much tougher race

What left wing?

What are the Democrats ? Answers on a postcard please . Anyway I know you're not that thick Tuffers . I know you just like to tease .

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:28 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:15 am UK really pissing in the wind now, USA free trade deal was the big 'prize' of Brexit. Instead we're going to get hammered by trade tariffs without an economic bloc to attach ourselves to as the world gets a lot more protectionist.

That's because we have the wrong party in power .

Well, luckily we have a strong Labour government who will stand up to Trump and his friends and not bend over backwards for them…

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:02 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:28 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:15 am UK really pissing in the wind now, USA free trade deal was the big 'prize' of Brexit. Instead we're going to get hammered by trade tariffs without an economic bloc to attach ourselves to as the world gets a lot more protectionist.

That's because we have the wrong party in power .

Well, luckily we have a strong Labour government who will stand up to Trump and his friends and not bend over backwards for them…

Bullshit . For example Lammy is already in full reverse gear to the previous rhetoric he's come out with

Looking at the results it appears Trump has won convincingly thanks in part to improving his numbers massively with typical white supremacist demographics such as non white voters and young voters

Wally Banter wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:04 am The most depressing element here is how far we are away from a society in which most people (including myself in this) can:

- understand political issues (like the economy) at even a rudimentary level;
- recognise non-defensively the influences of power and oppression
- properly appraise information and its credibility (including media bias)
- explore their individual unconscious biases and insecurities, and how these might affect their decisions
- listen to opposing views with openness and empathy, rather than blaming, attacking and judging which only widens the divide with others

I wish these things would be prioritised in education, so that we might end up with future generations of astute, politically engaged, reasonable people.

If it's any comfort (and it wont be), we've never been close to achieving any of this across the population, and it was probably never realistic.

From the 1950s up until 2008 the West experienced unprecedented growth and prosperity on a per-capita basis which meant that most people were happy to rub along reasonably well. This was through favourable demographics, globalisation and a US-led security guarantee.

But it was always going to end. Our societies are ageing out of the pre-existing socio-economic consensus being sustainable. The solution thus far - mass immigration - is now at levels that exceed those even the USA experienced in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. It's an untested experiment that risks civil unrest, especially as we begin to observe reversals in GDP per capita (fascism becomes very real when people become poorer because of immigration).

And through the emergence of other regional powers and the desire for the US into further isolation, we're now in a multi-polar world. Trade barriers are likely to become the norm, resulting in further inflation and reduction in living standards.

It's going to be like living in the 19th century, but with added tech. Living in a low-growth, multi-polar world is going to suck in comparison with what we had before. And nobody alive will understand how best to navigate that reality.

Sorry, I started typing in an attempt to try and cheer you up but it would appear that we're dooooomed!

Fair play to RedDwarf though

Four years of standing by his man whilst everyone with a login gave him dog abuse and now he’s barely gloating

Fair play to Nick Lowles here.

"We have lost politically, economically and culturally." The first step to solving a problem is to recognising what went wrong.

Currywurst and Chips wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:10 am Looking at the results it appears Trump has won convincingly thanks in part to improving his numbers massively with typical white supremacist demographics such as non white voters and young voters

I heard on the radio that they reckon 1 on 4 black men voted Republican plus the highest ever number of Hispanics and Asian Americans voted Republican . Not bad for a Nazi , wouldn't you say . Of course all those Democrat smears was just a load of old bollocks .

Just shows there are thick people everywhere.

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:20 am Just shows there are thick people everywhere.

Yeah, that's why Labour won our last election . There's a lot of buyers remorse here already .

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:06 am

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:02 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:28 am

That's because we have the wrong party in power .

Well, luckily we have a strong Labour government who will stand up to Trump and his friends and not bend over backwards for them…

Bullshit . For example Lammy is already in full reverse gear to the previous rhetoric he's come out with

Woooosh

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:02 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:28 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 10:15 am UK really pissing in the wind now, USA free trade deal was the big 'prize' of Brexit. Instead we're going to get hammered by trade tariffs without an economic bloc to attach ourselves to as the world gets a lot more protectionist.

That's because we have the wrong party in power .

Well, luckily we have a strong Labour government who will stand up to Trump and his friends and not bend over backwards for them…

We are completely isolated. I don't know what else Labour can do in this situation. We have put up massive barriers with our main trading partner and now our second main trading partner is in the hands of an isolationist who is proposing 10-20% on all imports. The nonsense we were sold about Global Britain is looking like a cruel cosmic joke - we couldn't have timed it worse.

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:34 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:06 am

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:02 am

Well, luckily we have a strong Labour government who will stand up to Trump and his friends and not bend over backwards for them…

Bullshit . For example Lammy is already in full reverse gear to the previous rhetoric he's come out with

Woooosh

OK, you got me on that one .

Tbf to Lammy he hasn't called Trump anything worse than what Vance has, and that seems to be fine.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:39 am

The photo made me laugh . Is there any significance with a squirrel .?

You don't know about Peanut the Squirrel? Look it up.

Not all bad for the loony left

It gives the JSO/Gaza children another reason to play in traffic and do criminal damage

Some excellent analysis by Lewis Goodall.

" Trump won everywhere. He's going to win the popular vote. He did better across the demographics. He grew his coalition, better with black voters, Latinos, young voters. The US become less racially divided by party." Ouch.

CEB2ElectricBoogaloo wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 8:49 am You can. And he is. But the pertinent thing here is that Trump lies (as well as in many other contexts) to tell people what they want to hear, in a context where people are primed to respond well to it.

The Democrats, and the “progressives” “liberals” etc, are seen by many working class/not wealthy Americans as lying to them about their experiences (again, see Owen Jones’s cabbie)

I'm just hopeless at this sarcasm thing

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:05 pm Some excellent analysis by Lewis Goodall.

" Trump won everywhere. He's going to win the popular vote. He did better across the demographics. He grew his coalition, better with black voters, Latinos, young voters. The US become less racially divided by party." Ouch.

If I was really squinting my eyes for a glimmer of hope, it'd that overall turnout was down on the last election. Trump of 2024 loses to 2020 vote number wise. The Democrat vote simply didn't vote.

However, 2028 is probably too late for the Democrats to get their arse into gear (if they are even capable of it). The Republicans will likely control every branch of government and use that power to bolt the door closed. Trump could get 2-3 supreme court picks in this term, meaning 2-3 more ultra conservative, young justices. He could put in a hard right massive majority on the court that will exist for longer than most boarders on here will live for.

They - and by extension - we are f*cked.

Ahhh yes….. The ol’ comparison of national vote numbers to previous elections with higher turnout in an electoral system that’s not decided by national popular vote.

Novara would be proud.