Independent Leyton Orient Forum

An RAF RC-135 intelligence gathering aircraft (spy plane) is currently in Poland flying up and down close to the border with Belarus. It’s got it’s transponder on so is letting the Russians know they are being watched.

It looks like the invasion proper begins tonight. Thoughts are with the ordinary people in Ukraine. They did nothing to deserve this.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 9:56 pm It looks like the invasion proper begins tonight. Thoughts are with the ordinary people in Ukraine. They did nothing to deserve this.

They could have left the clause prohibiting them joining NATO in their constitution. Really upset Mad Vlad that one.

The RAF were also flying a reconnaissance mission in Ukrainian airspace close to the Russian border earlier.

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 10:11 pm

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 9:56 pm It looks like the invasion proper begins tonight. Thoughts are with the ordinary people in Ukraine. They did nothing to deserve this.

They could have left the clause prohibiting them joining NATO in their constitution. Really upset Mad Vlad that one.

I agree . One way or another Ukraine won’t be joining NATO . If they had stayed neutral this war might have been avoided . Now Putin has his excuse to invade the rest of Ukraine

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Feb 23, 2022 9:56 pm It looks like the invasion proper begins tonight. Thoughts are with the ordinary people in Ukraine. They did nothing to deserve this.

Not much the ordinary people of Russia could do either to be honest. Nevalny proves that , the Babushkas would have suffered the same feat . Again though lets not focus on those ordinaries .

Russia encroaching from Belarus and shelling Ukrainian cities overnight. Looks like it'll be going beyond the Donbass

Feel for the Ukrainian people and the impending large scale loss of life.

There's a fair bit of "she was wearing a revealing dress so deserved it" equivalent vibes from certain boarders on this thread.

News making me queasy. Putin has gone full bond villain, implicitly threatening nuclear war if any other country gets involved and talking about 'denazifying' Ukraine. He's become the sort of unhinged that makes it easy to imagine things escalating in a very dark way.

The west needs to make Russia a complete economic pariah.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:06 am News making me queasy. Putin has gone full bond villain, implicitly threatening nuclear war if any other country gets involved and talking about 'denazifying' Ukraine. He's become the sort of unhinged that makes it easy to imagine things escalating in a very dark way.

The west needs to make Russia a complete economic pariah.

It's always been his goal to establish a Russian Empire.

Sanctions have to be meaningful but he wouldn't have gone into this without believing he could deal with them.

The key to that belief is that the Western capitalists will always seek profit and ignore or work around sanctions. Its what the banks and energy companies did as he acquired assets for the Russian state, himself and his associates.

He also has Cold War experience of circumventing sanctions that was his old job and that of his ex KGB mobsters who are now in charge. Much of the groundwork will have been done over the last 20 years.

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:19 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:06 am News making me queasy. Putin has gone full bond villain, implicitly threatening nuclear war if any other country gets involved and talking about 'denazifying' Ukraine. He's become the sort of unhinged that makes it easy to imagine things escalating in a very dark way.

The west needs to make Russia a complete economic pariah.

It's always been his goal to establish a Russian Empire.

Sanctions have to be meaningful but he wouldn't have gone into this without believing he could deal with them.

The key to that belief is that the Western capitalists will always seek profit and ignore or work around sanctions. Its what the banks and energy companies did as he acquired assets for the Russian state, himself and his associates.

He also has Cold War experience of circumventing sanctions that was his old job and that of his ex KGB mobsters who are now in charge. Much of the groundwork will have been done over the last 20 years.

Yep. I reckon it was around 2004 when he fully made his mind up about the future direction.

Since the 2014 invasion (although, you could also argue 2008), by continuing to enable him through corruption, energy supply agreements and other assorted deals, the West (and the UK in particular) has enabled him to prepare and build his military. He will now use that to slaughter innocent civilians. We have a moral duty help Ukraine.

So the man who has consistently said that he's got no intention of invading Ukraine has actually invaded Ukraine. What a surprise. Just goes to show that you simply cannot trust a word this guy says.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:06 am News making me queasy. Putin has gone full bond villain, implicitly threatening nuclear war if any other country gets involved and talking about 'denazifying' Ukraine. He's become the sort of unhinged that makes it easy to imagine things escalating in a very dark way.

Poland and the Baltic states have now called for NATO Article 4 consultation. Also Article 51 focus on right to self defence, which gives every member the right to help a non-member when it has been invaded. All of this does, of course, bring us closer to Article 5 territory, especially given Putin's very pointed comments.

Dunners wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:43 am

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:19 am

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:06 am News making me queasy. Putin has gone full bond villain, implicitly threatening nuclear war if any other country gets involved and talking about 'denazifying' Ukraine. He's become the sort of unhinged that makes it easy to imagine things escalating in a very dark way.

The west needs to make Russia a complete economic pariah.

It's always been his goal to establish a Russian Empire.

Sanctions have to be meaningful but he wouldn't have gone into this without believing he could deal with them.

The key to that belief is that the Western capitalists will always seek profit and ignore or work around sanctions. Its what the banks and energy companies did as he acquired assets for the Russian state, himself and his associates.

He also has Cold War experience of circumventing sanctions that was his old job and that of his ex KGB mobsters who are now in charge. Much of the groundwork will have been done over the last 20 years.

Yep. I reckon it was around 2004 when he fully made his mind up about the future direction.

Since the 2014 invasion (although, you could also argue 2008), by continuing to enable him through corruption, energy supply agreements and other assorted deals, the West (and the UK in particular) has enabled him to prepare and build his military. He will now use that to slaughter innocent civilians. We have a moral duty help Ukraine.

We are trying to help by sending weapons and sanctions along with the rest of the West. Incidentally if I was the leader of Finland or Sweden I would be applying to join NATO as soon as possible.

A proper scary day

Should have nuked Moscow weeks ago. Some of the lily livered comments on here could explain why our League form is so disastrous. Too many vegetarians?

Don’t worry, we’re going to enforce our sanctions to 2 other oligarchs today.

Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:01 am Don’t worry, we’re going to enforce our sanctions to 2 other oligarchs today.

Don't worry Ron the USA will be along in a minute to issue orders to the mop headed w*nk£r soon enough

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:57 am A proper scary day

It certainly is .

Russia has the backing of China so any sanctions are pretty irrelevant

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:12 am Russia has the backing of China so any sanctions are pretty irrelevant

That's why he doesn't care too much about Western sanctions. I wonder if this will now embloden China to strike at Taiwan.

Chances of a convenient assassination attempt?

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:21 am

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:12 am Russia has the backing of China so any sanctions are pretty irrelevant

That's why he doesn't care too much about Western sanctions. I wonder if this will now embloden China to strike at Taiwan.

I wouldn't be surprised. I think this might be the start of a very long and very drawn out world war 3. Russia and China will gradually start encroaching on other countries sovereign territory. I'm not sure the rest of the world has the stomach to stand up to them. China and Russia don't really have matching ideologies though, so they'll end up fighting each other once there's no one left.

This should really prompt the rest of the world to create their own energy independence using renewables, as that's the first thing that will disappear if existing global alliances fall.

There isn’t a lot NATO can do. It won’t get drawn into boots on the ground because it could easily spark a much wider and more dangerous conflict. Individual countries Imposing sanctions is all we have. I imagine the aim now is for Russia to bring about regime change to a pro Russian government.

Feel for the people of Ukraine suffering at the hands of an insecure Russian leader who harbours for a return to the “glory days” of the Soviet Union.

While China will support Russia economically they won’t be drawn into any conflict. Whilst this has potential to become more wide spread I think this will be confined and hopefully over in a few weeks.

It could backfire on Putin big time if Finland and Sweden now join NATO he will bring NATO even closer to Russias border.

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:31 am

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:21 am

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Feb 24, 2022 9:12 am Russia has the backing of China so any sanctions are pretty irrelevant

That's why he doesn't care too much about Western sanctions. I wonder if this will now embloden China to strike at Taiwan.

I wouldn't be surprised. I think this might be the start of a very long and very drawn out world war 3. Russia and China will gradually start encroaching on other countries sovereign territory. I'm not sure the rest of the world has the stomach to stand up to them. China and Russia don't really have matching ideologies though, so they'll end up fighting each other once there's no one left.

This should really prompt the rest of the world to create their own energy independence using renewables, as that's the first thing that will disappear if existing global alliances fall.

Times like these really show up the trade deals we rely on that have been built on the most tenuous of relationships.