Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 12:36 pm Sounds liike speculation rather than reporting.

I think a lot of reporting is speculation to be fair.

Waiting for instructions from Bonio on how we should react to the news of Haniyeh's passing...

Should we celebrate the death of Hamas' leader in the same way as most of us did when Al Qaeda's leader Osama bin Laden was killed? Or should we mourn Haniyeh's passing in the way that Iran's Ayatollah is doing on Twitter?

I don't want to be accused again of being far right on this board by some eejit who doesn't even know me, as that turns my gut as does the killing of innocent civilians on all sides of the spectrum.

Love and hugs.

MalvoliO wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:19 pm Waiting for instructions from Bonio on how we should react to the news of Haniyeh's passing...

Should we celebrate the death of Hamas' leader in the same way as most of us did when Al Qaeda's leader Osama bin Laden was killed? Or should we mourn Haniyeh's passing in the way that Iran's Ayatollah is doing on Twitter?

I don't want to be accused again of being far right on this board by some eejit who doesn't even know me, as that turns my gut as does the killing of innocent civilians on all sides of the spectrum.

Love and hugs.

Very ianteresting.

f*** the Hamas geezer. Just a shame his death will probably lead to many more innocent lives lost

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:45 pm f*** the Hamas geezer. Just a shame his death will probably lead to many more innocent lives lost

Or not. Like the last time Israel attacked the Iranian consulate in Syria, the response from Iran could be staged to give their domestic audience a false show of strength whilst inflicting minimal damage on Israel. A pattern could be emerging.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:18 pm

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:45 pm f*** the Hamas geezer. Just a shame his death will probably lead to many more innocent lives lost

Or not. Like the last time Israel attacked the Iranian consulate in Syria, the response from Iran could be staged to give their domestic audience a false show of strength whilst inflicting minimal damage on Israel. A pattern could be emerging.

I suspect that knowing how to breach the impenetrable iron dome and with continuing Israeli aggression, the response from Iran may be stronger this time

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:28 pm

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:18 pm

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:45 pm f*** the Hamas geezer. Just a shame his death will probably lead to many more innocent lives lost

Or not. Like the last time Israel attacked the Iranian consulate in Syria, the response from Iran could be staged to give their domestic audience a false show of strength whilst inflicting minimal damage on Israel. A pattern could be emerging.

I suspect that knowing how to breach the impenetrable iron dome and with continuing Israeli aggression, the response from Iran may be stronger this time

Maybe. If it is, then that would almost certainly mean full escalation into a regional war. And Israel will have to prioritise wiping out Hezbollah and the thousands of cruise missiles supplied to them by Iran first.

An alternative theory (which I have just made up), is that Iran and Israel are now sort-of collaborating with an end-strategy in mind.

Israel almost certainly had someone on the ground in Iran assisting with the targeted strike. Which means that the Iranian regime is either complicit or incompetent (AKA the USA v Pakistan argument when they killed Bin Laden). But, if there's one thing the Iranian regime takes serious, it's internal security. So that suggests that someone in Iran sold this Hamas fella out.

MalvoliO wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:19 pm Waiting for instructions from Bonio on how we should react to the news of Haniyeh's passing...

Should we celebrate the death of Hamas' leader in the same way as most of us did when Al Qaeda's leader Osama bin Laden was killed? Or should we mourn Haniyeh's passing in the way that Iran's Ayatollah is doing on Twitter?

I don't want to be accused again of being far right on this board by some eejit who doesn't even know me, as that turns my gut as does the killing of innocent civilians on all sides of the spectrum.

Love and hugs.

I can only respond to what’s written in front of me. The same for all of us. My take on what is happening in Israel is that a shameful chancer called Netanyahu is dragging Israel into a protracted war against Hamas, and probably soon to be, Hezbollah. In doing so he is inflicting terrible consequences on the civilians of Gaza (not forgetting the actions in the West Bank). Netanyahu and his cronies do not give a fig about human life - especially if they’re not Israeli but he has failed to secure the release and return of the Hostages as well. He faces a lot of criticism within Israel for not doing this.

Netanyahu would probably be facing criminal charges if he wasn’t leading Israel in a war. Why would he be interested in peace?

For absolute clarity, and repeating myself for the umpteenth time, I completely abhor the actions of Hamas and I won’t shed a single tear over the death of its leader.

The assassination of Haniyeh, will increase the chances of an all out war, which Netenyahu wants.


United States will be drawn in, and god help us all if that happens

It's the US, not Israel that's made the situation as it is.

I can only see terrible things ahead for the whole world

Actual BBC reporting in the wake of his death……

“Despite his tough rhetoric, he was generally seen by analysts as moderate and pragmatic, compared to the more hardline Gaza-based leaders Mohammed Deif and Yahya Sinwar”

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c4ng7g74xppt?page=3

All we need now is for you-know-who to ring interflora and send a wreath, and we'll have a full house.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:35 pm

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:28 pm

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:18 pm

Or not. Like the last time Israel attacked the Iranian consulate in Syria, the response from Iran could be staged to give their domestic audience a false show of strength whilst inflicting minimal damage on Israel. A pattern could be emerging.

I suspect that knowing how to breach the impenetrable iron dome and with continuing Israeli aggression, the response from Iran may be stronger this time

Maybe. If it is, then that would almost certainly mean full escalation into a regional war. And Israel will have to prioritise wiping out Hezbollah and the thousands of cruise missiles supplied to them by Iran first.

An alternative theory (which I have just made up), is that Iran and Israel are now sort-of collaborating with an end-strategy in mind.

Israel almost certainly had someone on the ground in Iran assisting with the targeted strike. Which means that the Iranian regime is either complicit or incompetent (AKA the USA v Pakistan argument when they killed Bin Laden). But, if there's one thing the Iranian regime takes serious, it's internal security. So that suggests that someone in Iran sold this Hamas fella out.

Okay. It's starting to look like my alternative theory is definitely bollocks. Rumours now spreading that a leader of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard (IRGC), Hajj Habib Zadeh, has been just been assassinated.

I'm not sure Iran will tolerate another moderate pragmatist being killed so soon after the last one. And Netanyahu just gave an address on Israeli television that sounded like a general war is increasingly likely.

Heard about Zadeh but couldn’t find any information on the latest moderate pragmatist so assumed it was made up.

Seen some Internet stuff on the assassination.

Some are saying it may be the result of an internal feud.

Others that it was Israeli agents in Syria.

MSM not reporting it yet.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 6:27 pm All we need now is for you-know-who to ring interflora and send a wreath, and we'll have a full house.

A wreath of poppies.

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:35 pm An alternative theory (which I have just made up), is that Iran and Israel are now sort-of collaborating with an end-strategy in mind.

Israel almost certainly had someone on the ground in Iran assisting with the targeted strike. Which means that the Iranian regime is either complicit or incompetent (AKA the USA v Pakistan argument when they killed Bin Laden). But, if there's one thing the Iranian regime takes serious, it's internal security. So that suggests that someone in Iran sold this Hamas fella out.

Isn't it more likely that Israel have had people placed inside Iran for the last 30 years for this eventuality. They're more than happy to play the slow game when it comes to achieving their means.

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Aug 01, 2024 1:43 am

Dunners wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 2:35 pm An alternative theory (which I have just made up), is that Iran and Israel are now sort-of collaborating with an end-strategy in mind.

Israel almost certainly had someone on the ground in Iran assisting with the targeted strike. Which means that the Iranian regime is either complicit or incompetent (AKA the USA v Pakistan argument when they killed Bin Laden). But, if there's one thing the Iranian regime takes serious, it's internal security. So that suggests that someone in Iran sold this Hamas fella out.

Isn't it more likely that Israel have had people placed inside Iran for the last 30 years for this eventuality. They're more than happy to play the slow game when it comes to achieving their means.

Yep, that's possible too. But this bloke would have been given a high risk category, so I'd have thought his movements and locations wouldn't have been made public and Iranian security keeping watch.

Therefore, for your theory to be correct, that could mean Israeli assets placed in the heart of Iranian services. If Tehran didn't give him up then, right now, they'll be having a word or two with their own security services to get to the traitor.

Maybe Haniyeh was vaccinated and was being tracked by the Microsoft chip in his arm

faldO wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 8:34 pm

E10EU wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 12:41 am After 10 months of bombing Gaza to smithereens and starving the population they have so far failed to eliminate their top 3 targets ... So with all their sophisticated weaponry and with generous supplies and assistance from the US and UK they are still failing with their supposed objective .... They must be quite useless as a military force!

Wrong.

The top three Hamas targets are Deif, Marwan Issa and Yahya Sinwar. Issa was killed in March, and the IDF are reasonably confident they got Deif in the latest air strikes.

The IDF also said yesterday they have killed around half of the leadership of the Hamas military wing, and killed or injured around 14,000 Hamas terrorists, which suggests the operation is not going quite as badly as you think.

Mohammed Deif now confirmed eliminated by the IDF.

By eliminated you obviously mean murder. Yet another crime committed by the terrorist rogue state of Israel

"Article 3(d) of the First Geneva Convention explicitly prohibits carrying out executions without passing a prior judgement by a competent and regularly constituted court with all commonly recognized judicial guarantees for everyone taking part in the trial."

Can’t be many in the Hamas senior leadership left after the IDF’s recent hat trick

Factor of around 10,000 civilians killed for each Hamas leader seems a little out of balance I feel.

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Aug 01, 2024 10:33 am By eliminated you obviously mean murder. Yet another crime committed by the terrorist rogue state of Israel

"Article 3(d) of the First Geneva Convention explicitly prohibits carrying out executions without passing a prior judgement by a competent and regularly constituted court with all commonly recognized judicial guarantees for everyone taking part in the trial."

Mohammed Deif was a combatant and therefore a legitimate target.

He was killed (on the battlefield) and therefore not murdered, and for that reason the First Geneva Convention does not apply in this instance.

faldO wrote: ↑Thu Aug 01, 2024 11:23 am

Max B Gold wrote: ↑Thu Aug 01, 2024 10:33 am By eliminated you obviously mean murder. Yet another crime committed by the terrorist rogue state of Israel

"Article 3(d) of the First Geneva Convention explicitly prohibits carrying out executions without passing a prior judgement by a competent and regularly constituted court with all commonly recognized judicial guarantees for everyone taking part in the trial."

Mohammed Deif was a combatant and therefore a legitimate target.

He was killed (on the battlefield) and therefore not murdered, and for that reason the First Geneva Convention does not apply in this instance.

And the others?

What about?