Page 2 of 2
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:20 pm
by Dohnut
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:37 am
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:09 am
At the risk of sounding all Harry Redknapp, this is a load of old sh*t.
To quote Mark Twain ......'
'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics. ' (Mark Twain) Page 2 Statistics • 'Statistics is the art of never having to say you're wrong. ' Statistics is a collection of procedures and principles for gaining and processing information in order to make decisions when faced with uncertainty''
The world has moved on since Mark Twain Sid. Statistics play a major role in life. Though some people choose to misrepresent the numbers, if so don’t blame the numbers.
I bet you use them more than you realise.
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2021 12:09 am
by Sid Bishop
Dohnut wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:20 pm
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:37 am
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:09 am
At the risk of sounding all Harry Redknapp, this is a load of old sh*t.
To quote Mark Twain ......'
'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics. ' (Mark Twain) Page 2 Statistics • 'Statistics is the art of never having to say you're wrong. ' Statistics is a collection of procedures and principles for gaining and processing information in order to make decisions when faced with uncertainty''
The world has moved on since Mark Twain Sid. Statistics play a major role in life. Though some people choose to misrepresent the numbers, if so don’t blame the numbers.
I bet you use them more than you realise.
I am a just simple countryman who toils the soil in-between tending my fruit and vegetable garden and i model myself on that real life gardening expert, ''Rambling Syd Rumpo'' ! Where I live, computers have not taken off yet and the only radio and tv shows available are from the 1960s era of Tony Hancock, Carry on films, Men from the Ministry, Navy Lark etc. Anyway have to get to bed now as I have to get up to milk the cows at 6am in the morning !
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Tue Nov 09, 2021 10:01 am
by Ronnie Hotdogs
Real Al wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 3:00 pm
I'm not sure that graph on its own tells us much.
But, if you put it alongside actual goals, you could see how good we are at taking our chances. If you have xG at 3, but actual goals = 0, you've squandered at lot of chances (see Stevenage the other week). If the xG is 1, but we've scored 2, then our forwards have done well with the chances they've had.
You could probably get all that from watching tho.
If you understand the game.
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:16 am
by Horient
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 10:01 am
Real Al wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 3:00 pm
I'm not sure that graph on its own tells us much.
But, if you put it alongside actual goals, you could see how good we are at taking our chances. If you have xG at 3, but actual goals = 0, you've squandered at lot of chances (see Stevenage the other week). If the xG is 1, but we've scored 2, then our forwards have done well with the chances they've had.
You could probably get all that from watching tho.
If you understand the game.
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:37 am
by jamespevans
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:37 am
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:09 am
At the risk of sounding all Harry Redknapp, this is a load of old sh*t.
To quote Mark Twain ......'
'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics. ' (Mark Twain) Page 2 Statistics • 'Statistics is the art of never having to say you're wrong. ' Statistics is a collection of procedures and principles for gaining and processing information in order to make decisions when faced with uncertainty''
Don't want to be A Pedant but that isn't a Mark Twain quote. It's actually Mark Twain quoting somebody else's quote (Disraeli). I don't actually have a view on the expected goals argument but my son swears by it.
Yours
A Pedant
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:00 pm
by Sid Bishop
jamespevans wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:37 am
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:37 am
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:09 am
At the risk of sounding all Harry Redknapp, this is a load of old sh*t.
To quote Mark Twain ......'
'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics. ' (Mark Twain) Page 2 Statistics • 'Statistics is the art of never having to say you're wrong. ' Statistics is a collection of procedures and principles for gaining and processing information in order to make decisions when faced with uncertainty''
Don't want to be A Pedant but that isn't a Mark Twain quote. It's actually Mark Twain quoting somebody else's quote (Disraeli). I don't actually have a view on the expected goals argument but my son swears by it.
Yours
A Pedant
Seems like this saying has been attributed to many people including ''Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington.''
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies,_dam ... statistics
"Lies, damned lies, and statistics" is a phrase describing the persuasive power of numbers, particularly the use of statistics to bolster weak arguments. It is also sometimes colloquially used to doubt statistics used to prove an opponent's point.
The phrase was popularized in the United States by Mark Twain (among others), who vaguely attributed it to the British prime minister Benjamin Disraeli. However, the phrase is not found in any of Disraeli's works and the earliest known appearances were years after his death. Several other people have been listed as originators of the quote, and it is often attributed to Twain himself.
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:48 pm
by Max B Gold
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:00 pm
jamespevans wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:37 am
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:37 am
To quote Mark Twain ......'
'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics. ' (Mark Twain) Page 2 Statistics • 'Statistics is the art of never having to say you're wrong. ' Statistics is a collection of procedures and principles for gaining and processing information in order to make decisions when faced with uncertainty''
Don't want to be A Pedant but that isn't a Mark Twain quote. It's actually Mark Twain quoting somebody else's quote (Disraeli). I don't actually have a view on the expected goals argument but my son swears by it.
Yours
A Pedant
Seems like this saying has been attributed to many people including ''Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington.''
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies,_dam ... statistics
"Lies, damned lies, and statistics" is a phrase describing the persuasive power of numbers, particularly the use of statistics to bolster weak arguments. It is also sometimes colloquially used to doubt statistics used to prove an opponent's point.
The phrase was popularized in the United States by Mark Twain (among others), who vaguely attributed it to the British prime minister Benjamin Disraeli. However, the phrase is not found in any of Disraeli's works and the earliest known appearances were years after his death. Several other people have been listed as originators of the quote, and it is often attributed to Twain himself.
How do we know you haven't just made that up or blindly cut and pasted it from an unreliable interweb site in the same dodgy way you accuse statisticians of cooking the numbers up?
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 1:52 pm
by oxo
I don't really understand this sort of thing either, but if you look at how Brentford have done since they started properly using stats in their decision-making processes, it's hard not to conclude they're onto something.
Football will always need people who have a deep understanding of the game itself, not least because the players are human beings, and there are plenty of characteristics that experienced human beings can account for that a computer can't. That said, data analysis, unromantic as it is, can tell you things things that even experienced people can't in nearly any field that involves numbers.
If you can get the people who understand football to work with (and listen to) the people who understand data, you'd be foolish not to.
Re: Coley Parry - Twitter
Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2021 1:52 pm
by WickfordO
I expect Orient to score every game. That's a good stat.
