Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Andersonitis wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 6:49 pm If we lose this one the decision should be made.

Really boring.

I always thought the Sherpa Van Trophy was a terrible competition anyway. It needed freshening up & putting B teams in was a good idea. Will be good to see our younger talents like Sargeant, Judd, Ogie & Sotiriou play against Premier League youngsters

Smendrick Feaselberg wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 2:41 pm I'm not going tomorrow but would be ridiculous and totally inaccurate to call that a boycott. Same probably goes for most of the people not going.

This. Boycott no, insufficiently interested to attend yes. A team, B team not bothered and as a glory hunter of course I'd go to Wembley.

Even though it's the easiest away game I can go to it's a no from me. Not having anything to do with any competition that involves U23 sides.

Has to be Marsh and Gorman in CM tomorrow or even Kyprianou. Give Sweeney a go at LB too.

Don't blame anyone for not going, personally I will be there but I understand why most people won't bother. Anyone who questions why someone is/isn't going is an idiot, its each to their own.

The only thing I will say, is that if by some miracle we reach the Semi Finals/Final then alot of people will change their tune and will magically appear as we get closer to the final!

But with Portsmouth, Ipswich and Sunderland all currently in League One and having two League One sides in our group, I think its safe to say we will be out of this fairly quickly, if we make it out of the group stages!

It is a good job the Central and Victoria line strikes by RMT Drivers was called off, planned to start Tuesday evening. The Central line dispute has been settled and it must have be threat to cause delays for O's fans that finally meant the Managment gave in.

BIGRON wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 6:48 pm

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:45 pm I’ll be going tomorrow but only because as Gallery Season Ticket holders we get Free tickets, and i’m Hoping we get to see George Marsh and few of the other ‘fringe’ players.

I reckon there will be more chance of seeing Rodney Marsh , add me to the list that is going

If Marsh doesn’t get a game tomorrow Ron then he may as well go back to Spurs, but I think he’ll start.

gshaw wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:27 pm Even though it's the easiest away game I can go to it's a no from me. Not having anything to do with any competition that involves U23 sides.

Has to be Marsh and Gorman in CM tomorrow or even Kyprianou. Give Sweeney a go at LB too.

Are you a southend fan?

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 2:36 pm Bet everyone changes their tune if we get to Wembley.

That’s what the mushrooms said at Blackpool, didn’t happen though.

Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:52 pm

gshaw wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:27 pm Even though it's the easiest away game I can go to it's a no from me. Not having anything to do with any competition that involves U23 sides.

Has to be Marsh and Gorman in CM tomorrow or even Kyprianou. Give Sweeney a go at LB too.

Are you a southend fan?

Not fan, more resident

Not boycotting as such, but just not bothering.

Used to do all the JPT home games, but with the inclusion of the B-teams this feels like a step toward trying to make the smaller clubs feeder entities.
For that reason, I'm out.

I was looking forward to this game, but reading the comments from most of the above, I'm really disappointed about peoples thoughts, Why are people not happy, we're back in the EFL and competitions associated with them, but all people wanna a do is run everything down, depressing me so much turned off of going

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:16 am I was looking forward to this game, but reading the comments from most of the above, I'm really disappointed about peoples thoughts, Why are people not happy, we're back in the EFL and competitions associated with them, but all people wanna a do is run everything down, depressing me so much turned off of going

Nothing to do with being happy or not to be back in the league. Everything to do with the potentially insidious introduction of B-teams via the back door. Complacency about these things only plays into the EFL’s hands.

Does the boycott include the live stream?

Red_Army wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 1:58 pm Does the boycott include the live stream?

Yes it does.

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:16 am I was looking forward to this game, but reading the comments from most of the above, I'm really disappointed about peoples thoughts, Why are people not happy, we're back in the EFL and competitions associated with them, but all people wanna a do is run everything down, depressing me so much turned off of going

Bigger picture is more important, safeguarding the future of lower league clubs. The U23 sides have already stripped sides at our level of fair transfer fees and playing time for youth players and that's set to get even worse with the FIFA changes to remove tribunals.

Look at our recent talents from the academy and how many we actually had a chance to see make a meaningful impact on the side before the vultures snatched them for their U23 squads (Koroma the exception we got a season out of him).

Koroma - one season
Alzate - a handful of games
Abrahams - a handful of games
Dalby - even smaller handful of games
Adeboyejo - barely any games
Obafemi - barely any games

Plus many more that left at 15-16 that we didn't even get to hear about bar the odd thread on here.

gshaw wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:09 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:16 am I was looking forward to this game, but reading the comments from most of the above, I'm really disappointed about peoples thoughts, Why are people not happy, we're back in the EFL and competitions associated with them, but all people wanna a do is run everything down, depressing me so much turned off of going

Bigger picture is more important, safeguarding the future of lower league clubs. The U23 sides have already stripped sides at our level of fair transfer fees and playing time for youth players and that's set to get even worse with the FIFA changes to remove tribunals.

Look at our recent talents from the academy and how many we actually had a chance to see make a meaningful impact on the side before the vultures snatched them for their U23 squads (Koroma the exception we got a season out of him).

Koroma - one season
Alzate - a handful of games
Abrahams - a handful of games
Dalby - even smaller handful of games
Adeboyejo - barely any games
Obafemi - barely any games

Plus many more that left at 15-16 that we didn't even get to hear about bar the odd thread on here.

The Obafemi that is playing for Southampton never made an appearance for Orient. His older brother played a couple of games.

Koroma played 3 seasons.

I dont have a problem with it as a competition.

A chance to see stars of the future
in a competition that was dire previously.

Saying that,
If they dropped the competition altogether
I dont think it would be missed.

gshaw wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:09 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:16 am I was looking forward to this game, but reading the comments from most of the above, I'm really disappointed about peoples thoughts, Why are people not happy, we're back in the EFL and competitions associated with them, but all people wanna a do is run everything down, depressing me so much turned off of going

Bigger picture is more important, safeguarding the future of lower league clubs. The U23 sides have already stripped sides at our level of fair transfer fees and playing time for youth players and that's set to get even worse with the FIFA changes to remove tribunals.

Look at our recent talents from the academy and how many we actually had a chance to see make a meaningful impact on the side before the vultures snatched them for their U23 squads (Koroma the exception we got a season out of him).

Koroma - one season
Alzate - a handful of games
Abrahams - a handful of games
Dalby - even smaller handful of games
Adeboyejo - barely any games
Obafemi - barely any games

Plus many more that left at 15-16 that we didn't even get to hear about bar the odd thread on here.

This a lot.

The hoarding of players by the top sides is one of the biggest problems in the game. It leads to the massive wage inflation we see, especially at the top of the game, it denies clubs further down the pyramid the chance to develop (and profit from) young players coming through the ranks, and is, in general terms, a bar to the so-called "trickle down" of monies in the game.

Allowing U23 teams into competition with full time teams not only facilitates this hoarding of players, it's also the thin end of a very troubling wedge, when your Chelseas and Man Citys decide they'd like an even bigger slice of the pie and demand that the compliant EFL allows their B-teams into the League set up as well.

If young players need game time, then they should be signed to clubs lower down the pyramid to get it - then, if they're good enough, they should be able to move up the leagues by transferring up (with the consequent movement of ££ in the other direction).

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 3:12 pm I dont have a problem with it as a competition.

A chance to see stars of the future
in a competition that was dire previously.

Saying that,
If they dropped the competition altogether
I dont think it would be missed.

It was perfectly decent before the revamp. All this has done is reduce crowds and increase the minimum amount of games players and fans have to go to.

Red_Army wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:11 pm

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 3:12 pm I dont have a problem with it as a competition.

A chance to see stars of the future
in a competition that was dire previously.

Saying that,
If they dropped the competition altogether
I dont think it would be missed.

It was perfectly decent before the revamp. All this has done is reduce crowds and increase the minimum amount of games players and fans have to go to.

Was it ?

Take away the year we.got to the semi.& lost to southend
How many games.had we had more than a 1000 at

Not many.
If they hadnt done something it would be lost
Also you get a chance to say we beat wet spam or whoever
if you actually do win

Again
It would be better to disregard & start a completely new
Cup

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:22 pm

Red_Army wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:11 pm

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 3:12 pm I dont have a problem with it as a competition.

A chance to see stars of the future
in a competition that was dire previously.

Saying that,
If they dropped the competition altogether
I dont think it would be missed.

It was perfectly decent before the revamp. All this has done is reduce crowds and increase the minimum amount of games players and fans have to go to.

Was it ?

Take away the year we.got to the semi.& lost to southend
How many games.had we had more than a 1000 at

Not many.
If they hadnt done something it would be lost
Also you get a chance to say we beat wet spam or whoever
if you actually do win

The crowds weren't great but that's true of any cup draw against lower league sides. At least if you lost you were out early and didn't have to play 3 games.

I would be embarrassed to play against West Ham's reserves/kids, and be even more embarrassed to enjoy beating them- it would be demeaning.

If they hadn't done anything, it would have continued as the quiet and harmless Trophy which could get exciting if you did well, but wasn't too taking if you did badly.

TBH I don't think the experiment has worked and nobody cares, not even the big clubs.

But then it was a pony competition beforehand, with clubs having to be threatened with sanctions not to rest loads of players.

Needs to be a fresh approach, but I don't know what that would be. Prize money is immaterial for most teams unless you make it all the way.
For instance in the FA Trophy, we made something like £70k out of our run, which in net terms actually was very little once the cost of overnights was paid for.

Bit of a liberty that the club are charging the same amount to stream the game as a League game, but the entrance fee to see it is massively cut from a normal game.

In my view they could have made this free or £1 to test out whether the fixes have worked. After all, the costs incurred to get it ready for stream have already been spent. Seems a very unreliable service so far.