Independent Leyton Orient Forum

I have said on many occasions that the club need massive injection of money from new investors to enable us to progress.
I honestly believe that without quality, proven players at this level or above at best we will stagnate in this division or at worst be relegated, I hope I am wrong.The sheer waste of money on players like Piggott, giving a long and expensive contract to Moncs who is nowhere near the player he was and introduction on the whole of players on loan that are not proven first team players at this level or above has been our downfall.
Gates will continue to drop as fans fail to get value for money with the crazy prices being charged.
In my opinion there is only one answer a massive injection of money from new investors to spend on quality, proven players.

Nigel Travis is pretty straight and it’s clear there is a lot of mutual respect between him and Richie, so I don’t think there is any deliberate deception going on. But it feels like we are over-reliant on youngsters and loanees, and too many young loanees are simply not up to it, the two Premier leaguers who arrived in January perfect examples. We are also slow movers with summer transfer dealings, and while there are mitigating circumstances, we’ve lost the first three games both this season and last, and that isn’t good enough.

I am puzzled why we kept Sweeney over Hunt; I am puzzled why we are now reliant on a loanee number one keeper, and a decision clearly needs to be made on Hemming, and if that decision is wrong we will be in big trouble.

We’ve had an exceptionally tough start, acquitted ourselves pretty well overall with the GK exception well discussed, and post Shrewsbury have some more tough looking games landing. Richie knew all that, yes he’s frustrated, but clearly feels he can take us further.

They could do one thing to get things on the right track.

There is obviously a difference between the players Richie wants/needs and what is found.

Maybe the whole thing of having a DoF/transfer committee just isn't working and it's time to either bring in another DoF that has better connections/more on Richie's wavelength or just let Richie get on with it.

Fellowo wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 9:21 am They could do one thing to get things on the right track.

There is obviously a difference between the players Richie wants/needs and what is found.

Maybe the whole thing of having a DoF/transfer committee just isn't working and it's time to either bring in another DoF that has better connections/more on Richie's wavelength or just let Richie get on with it.

Or just get rid of our DOF and let Ritchie have the budget and players that he chooses.

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 9:26 am

Fellowo wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 9:21 am They could do one thing to get things on the right track.

There is obviously a difference between the players Richie wants/needs and what is found.

Maybe the whole thing of having a DoF/transfer committee just isn't working and it's time to either bring in another DoF that has better connections/more on Richie's wavelength or just let Richie get on with it.

Or just get rid of our DOF and let Ritchie have the budget and players that he chooses.

I agree, obviously the budget is tight enough as it is, maybe it's time to re-evaluate the number of backroom staff. For instance, the bloke (don't even know his name) that replaced Matt Harrold, is he really necessary.

Rich Tea Wellin wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 8:00 am I don’t think we’ll be in trouble this year (aside from a big batch of key injuries) but the problem will be matching Richie’s ambition, and the fans ambition if we finish 15th

I really hope you're right though at present I have concerns as we don't have a strong spine in this squad at present. An experienced CM, new LB and replacement GK before the window shuts would make it a lot better though we'll be lucky to see even one of those

Qin wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:40 pm Not only have they not backed Richie, they have let him and the supporters down in a big way

Richie is frustrated as hell, listening to him in today's after match interview.
He desperately want some experience in the side, but all the board have given him are non proven kids.

Everyone brought in this summer have been from the bargain bucket.

We have a board of millionaires & multi millionaires, so what's going on? Why are they not spending anything?

Richie deserves better than this, much better

None of us (including you) know how much money the "board of millionaires & multi-millionaires" actually have.
The club lost £4m last season - so whatever they Did have, as a collective they're 4m down.

Perhaps you'd like to join the board and get spending? No, I thought not.

Just because they have money; it doesn't mean they automatically want to throw it away on folly- good sense (as far as possible) has to be employed.
They're no doubt richer than you ( and I ) but we don't know how rich.

To put it another way- you live in the property you live in because it's no doubt the one you can afford.
If I came and stood outside your place screaming at you to buy a bigger one - it would make no difference - you can't afford to live in another property. Perhaps the board are stretched to the limit already, and fans screaming at them to spend more is simply a physical impossibility.

They might be "millionaires", but a million goes nowhere in the game of football these days.

Scuba Diver wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:46 pm

Qin wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:40 pm Not only have they not backed Richie, they have let him and the supporters down in a big way

Richie is frustrated as hell, listening to him in today's after match interview.
He desperately want some experience in the side, but all the board have given him are non proven kids.

Everyone brought in this summer have been from the bargain bucket.

We have a board of millionaires & multi millionaires, so what's going on? Why are they not spending anything?

Richie deserves better than this, much better

None of us (including you) know how much money the "board of millionaires & multi-millionaires" actually have.
The club lost £4m last season - so whatever they Did have, as a collective they're 4m down.

Perhaps you'd like to join the board and get spending? No, I thought not.

Just because they have money; it doesn't mean they automatically want to throw it away on folly- good sense (as far as possible) has to be employed.
They're no doubt richer than you ( and I ) but we don't know how rich.

To put it another way- you live in the property you live in because it's no doubt the one you can afford.
If I came and stood outside your place screaming at you to buy a bigger one - it would make no difference - you can't afford to live in another property. Perhaps the board are stretched to the limit already, and fans screaming at them to spend more is simply a physical impossibility.

They might be "millionaires", but a million goes nowhere in the game of football these days.

I believe they have taken as far as they can, so they can either invest more themselves or bring in investors that will bring in the massive investment needed to get us further.As the old saying goes get off the pot or start pissing.

DrWindy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:53 am I think we all need to take a breath. Unfortunately our keeper has made some bad mistakes. If he hadn’t have, we would have made a good start. Those players have actually been very good and none of the big clubs have played us off the park. Sort our keeper out and I am confident all will be well.

That's the point. Going forward we're actually pretty good but our keeper is letting the side down . Sort the keeper out and I think we'll be OK.

Qin wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:40 pm Not only have they not backed Richie, they have let him and the supporters down in a big way

Richie is frustrated as hell, listening to him in today's after match interview.
He desperately want some experience in the side, but all the board have given him are non proven kids.

Everyone brought in this summer have been from the bargain bucket.

We have a board of millionaires & multi millionaires, so what's going on? Why are they not spending anything?

Richie deserves better than this, much better

The board want promotion on a wing and a prayer .

I know the likes of Luton and Bournemouth have done it but to get to the next level I think we need to move to a new stadium . That way we can maximise our revenue streams . However with the cost of a new stadium that's easier said than done . With the government starting to apply pressure on local authorities to find brownfield land for housing I suggest Waltham Forest and the club identify potential land for a new stadium right now before it's used for housing . That land could then be ring fenced until the club can afford to move . The alternative is to stay where we are and when we can afford to move leave the borough .

Yanzi Gravy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 1:06 pm

Qin wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:40 pm Not only have they not backed Richie, they have let him and the supporters down in a big way

Richie is frustrated as hell, listening to him in today's after match interview.
He desperately want some experience in the side, but all the board have given him are non proven kids.

Everyone brought in this summer have been from the bargain bucket.

We have a board of millionaires & multi millionaires, so what's going on? Why are they not spending anything?

Richie deserves better than this, much better

The board want promotion on a wing and a prayer .

No chance and definitely not this season with Hemming in goal . They should be a damn sight more concerned about avoiding relegation , never mind promotion .

We need an experienced striker and we need an experienced proven winger that RW wants . Back him now because next stop is Jan ! Can’t understand how we ever thought players like Perkins would really be a game changer and waddington who replaced El Miz can’t even make the first team. Poor signings really and jury out on DJ , who seems overweight and average

Norlington Road wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 1:18 pm We need an experienced striker and we need an experienced proven winger that RW wants . Back him now because next stop is Jan ! Can’t understand how we ever thought players like Perkins would really be a game changer and waddington who replaced El Miz can’t even make the first team. Poor signings really and jury out on DJ , who seems overweight and average

And we got rid of Moncur who is a very good midfielder but also classed as unfit.
So who would you prefer to have out of these two seemingly not fully fit players GM or DJ ?

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:28 pm

Norlington Road wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 1:18 pm We need an experienced striker and we need an experienced proven winger that RW wants . Back him now because next stop is Jan ! Can’t understand how we ever thought players like Perkins would really be a game changer and waddington who replaced El Miz can’t even make the first team. Poor signings really and jury out on DJ , who seems overweight and average

And we got rid of Moncur who is a very good midfielder but also classed as unfit.
So who would you prefer to have out of these two seemingly not fully fit players GM or DJ ?

It's still early days but to me DJ looks quite slow . A part from one cup game ,when he comes on he hasn't made any impact . Hopefully it's just a fitness issue and he improves but at his moment in time , I think I prefer Moncur .

gshaw wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:56 pm My question is where has the budget gone? Supposedly 10% more than last season, senior pros been moved on yet we have a team of loans and youths with no major signings coming in?

Drinan
Pigott
Moncur
Sanders
Hunt
El Miz

All chunky wage players and when you look at what's come in it seems hard to believe they're costing more than what's gone out the door.

You forgot to add to that list of player's, a player who was always invisible to you....Ruel Sotiriou, our leading goal scorer last season. On 26 June 2024, Sotiriou agreed to join fellow League One side Bristol Rovers on a three-year deal with the option for a further season. Although the striker was due to be out of contract, an undisclosed fee was agreed in order to avoid the need for a compensation committee hearing. So an unknown amount of money came back to the club along with something also back for Sanders who joined Crewe Alexandra on a two-year deal for an undisclosed fee.

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:43 pm

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:28 pm

Norlington Road wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 1:18 pm We need an experienced striker and we need an experienced proven winger that RW wants . Back him now because next stop is Jan ! Can’t understand how we ever thought players like Perkins would really be a game changer and waddington who replaced El Miz can’t even make the first team. Poor signings really and jury out on DJ , who seems overweight and average

And we got rid of Moncur who is a very good midfielder but also classed as unfit.
So who would you prefer to have out of these two seemingly not fully fit players GM or DJ ?

It's still early days but to me DJ looks quite slow . A part from one cup game ,when he comes on he hasn't made any impact . Hopefully it's just a fitness issue and he improves but at his moment in time , I think I prefer Moncur .

From what we hear, fans from Charlton did not rate DJ very highly, we shall see ? At least with GM you knew what you had, at least at the worst, a good 30 or 40 minutes worth off the bench.

After a disappointing Summer , I think the squad is now weaker than it was last season .With League One being a tougher league this season and with Hemming in goal we'll be lucky not to be involved a relegation battle this season . Results wise we haven't started very well .

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:57 pm

DrWindy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:53 am I think we all need to take a breath. Unfortunately our keeper has made some bad mistakes. If he hadn’t have, we would have made a good start. Those players have actually been very good and none of the big clubs have played us off the park. Sort our keeper out and I am confident all will be well.

That's the point. Going forward we're actually pretty good but our keeper is letting the side down . Sort the keeper out and I think we'll be OK.

Honestly, this seems it. Weird how broad the rationale tends to get on here.

Decent quality team with some top quality yet to come in Theo and Graham who are essential to how Richie likes to play.

The keeper thing is a rot and it's a bit like when Agyei got bowled out in pre season last year and we had no answer and the first games became a write off searching for one.

Pray God a new keeper comes in this week. Decisive.

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:52 pm After a disappointing Summer , I think the squad is now weaker than it was last season .With League One being a tougher league this season and with Hemming in goal we'll be lucky not to be involved a relegation battle this season . Results wise we haven't started very well .

Exactly.

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:51 pm

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:43 pm

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:28 pm

And we got rid of Moncur who is a very good midfielder but also classed as unfit.
So who would you prefer to have out of these two seemingly not fully fit players GM or DJ ?

It's still early days but to me DJ looks quite slow . A part from one cup game ,when he comes on he hasn't made any impact . Hopefully it's just a fitness issue and he improves but at his moment in time , I think I prefer Moncur .

From what we hear, fans from Charlton did not rate DJ very highly, we shall see ? At least with GM you knew what you had, at least at the worst, a good 30 or 40 minutes worth off the bench.

A players previous club's supporters are not usually wrong . For example Tranmere fans were laughing at us taking Alabi . Look how right they were .Lets just hope Richie can get more out of DJ than Charlton did .

idontkn0 M wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:55 pm

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:57 pm

DrWindy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:53 am I think we all need to take a breath. Unfortunately our keeper has made some bad mistakes. If he hadn’t have, we would have made a good start. Those players have actually been very good and none of the big clubs have played us off the park. Sort our keeper out and I am confident all will be well.

That's the point. Going forward we're actually pretty good but our keeper is letting the side down . Sort the keeper out and I think we'll be OK.

Honestly, this seems it. Weird how broad the rationale tends to get on here.

Decent quality team with some top quality yet to come in Theo and Graham who are essential to how Richie likes to play.

The keeper thing is a rot and it's a bit like when Agyei got bowled out in pre season last year and we had no answer and the first games became a write off searching for one.

Pray God a new keeper comes in this week. Decisive.

We all agree with you on that point and who recommended this new keeper I wonder ?

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:58 pm

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:51 pm

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:43 pm

It's still early days but to me DJ looks quite slow . A part from one cup game ,when he comes on he hasn't made any impact . Hopefully it's just a fitness issue and he improves but at his moment in time , I think I prefer Moncur .

From what we hear, fans from Charlton did not rate DJ very highly, we shall see ? At least with GM you knew what you had, at least at the worst, a good 30 or 40 minutes worth off the bench.

A players previous club's supporters are not usually wrong . For example Tranmere fans were laughing at us taking Alabi . Look how right they were .Lets just hope Richie can get more out of DJ than Charlton did .

To many on this forum, Alibi was a sort of cult hero !

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 2:44 pm

gshaw wrote: ↑Sat Aug 24, 2024 9:56 pm My question is where has the budget gone? Supposedly 10% more than last season, senior pros been moved on yet we have a team of loans and youths with no major signings coming in?

Drinan
Pigott
Moncur
Sanders
Hunt
El Miz

All chunky wage players and when you look at what's come in it seems hard to believe they're costing more than what's gone out the door.

You forgot to add to that list of player's, a player who was always invisible to you....Ruel Sotiriou, our leading goal scorer last season. On 26 June 2024, Sotiriou agreed to join fellow League One side Bristol Rovers on a three-year deal with the option for a further season. Although the striker was due to be out of contract, an undisclosed fee was agreed in order to avoid the need for a compensation committee hearing. So an unknown amount of money came back to the club along with something also back for Sanders who joined Crewe Alexandra on a two-year deal for an undisclosed fee.

I didn't include him as there's a like-for-like replacement in Kelman who has started the season well.

Similar for Thompson replaced by Simpson, although in his case the like-for-like also includes being injured.

With the undisclosed fees it's difficult to be sure what the levels are but I suspect the Sanders money in and the fee for Clare going in the other direction likely balanced each other out.

Have heard the Ruel figure being up to 300k (not sure how accurate that is) so yes good qu where that's gone, likely into the "reduce operating losses" pot with the Sky money and / or paid for the solar panels

PoundhillO wrote: ↑Sun Aug 25, 2024 8:35 am I have said on many occasions that the club need massive injection of money from new investors to enable us to progress.
I honestly believe that without quality, proven players at this level or above at best we will stagnate in this division or at worst be relegated, I hope I am wrong.The sheer waste of money on players like Piggott, giving a long and expensive contract to Moncs who is nowhere near the player he was and introduction on the whole of players on loan that are not proven first team players at this level or above has been our downfall.
Gates will continue to drop as fans fail to get value for money with the crazy prices being charged.
In my opinion there is only one answer a massive injection of money from new investors to spend on quality, proven players.

Most would agree but getting these new investors with deep pockets is easier said than done .