Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:24 am From all accounts, Clay played well once he came on, makes me wonder why a newly arrived player yet to get match fit got the nod over him. No good playing unfit players in key games. when you have competent fit players on the bench.

Thought Clay did nothing apart from run around.

gshaw wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:34 am

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:27 am Richie thinks Lyden is more creative than a fully fit Clay ?

Well given Clay struggles to find a pass to a red shirt much of the time I'd say yes. Can't fault his workrate or commitment but not enough quality for L2 level, especially when aiming at top 3

Again you'd really want Lyden on the bench being introduced slowly but El Miz' couple of minutes of madness caused another unwanted change of personnel.

We need to get back to a few weeks of stability in the starting XI.

Something we havnt had since 20 minutes into cobblers game !

Loyal_Supporter wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 11:10 am

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:24 am From all accounts, Clay played well once he came on, makes me wonder why a newly arrived player yet to get match fit got the nod over him. No good playing unfit players in key games. when you have competent fit players on the bench.

Thought Clay did nothing apart from run around.

Which is more than can be said for who he replaced.

Fellowo wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 11:18 am

Loyal_Supporter wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 11:10 am

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:24 am From all accounts, Clay played well once he came on, makes me wonder why a newly arrived player yet to get match fit got the nod over him. No good playing unfit players in key games. when you have competent fit players on the bench.

Thought Clay did nothing apart from run around.

Which is more than can be said for who he replaced.

Not according to Wellens .

Jeremy Bentham wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 11:04 am Will Sweeney and Duke McKenna ever get a start? When they've played they've showed energy and positivity, don't see why they don't get a chance.

Duke-McKenna is sadly out for the season, I think he would've flourished in the second half of the season too, a real shame

Madness he started, he might be the best player in the world but after a year out, starting him out of nowhere was bonkers, should've been eased in and Clay was good against Stevenage and Tranmee and deserved to start

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:24 am From all accounts, Clay played well once he came on, makes me wonder why a newly arrived player yet to get match fit got the nod over him. No good playing unfit players in key games. when you have competent fit players on the bench.

Not from all accounts. Clay was his usual self again on Saturday. He's not a 4.

essexfootball wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:29 pm Madness he started, he might be the best player in the world but after a year out, starting him out of nowhere was bonkers, should've been eased in and Clay was good against Stevenage and Tranmee and deserved to start

Won a League 2 championship medal , clogger hasnt yet.

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:54 pm Won a League 2 championship medal , clogger hasnt yet.

Great, he hasn't played a game of football in a year, by this logic sign Leo Fortune West

essexfootball wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:20 pm

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:54 pm Won a League 2 championship medal , clogger hasnt yet.

Great, he hasn't played a game of football in a year, by this logic sign Leo Fortune West

He played Saturday & a behind closed doors , As for Leo I'll phone his brother John or his ex Premier league playing nephew Johnathan & find out what he's upto if you want ?

I have always liked Clay, and still do. He's a decent player at our level, and I'd have him in the team every week, when El Miz isnt available

essexfootball wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:29 pm Madness he started, he might be the best player in the world but after a year out, starting him out of nowhere was bonkers, should've been eased in and Clay was good against Stevenage and Tranmee and deserved to start

As much as I love Clay, he was useless against Stevenage. He might be our worst passer of a football at the club. Wellens only brings him on when we are struggling to win second balls. Lyden should hopefully get better once he gets match sharp.

You could see why Wellens brought Lyden in - he was getting into the right positions to receive the ball and looked tidy enough, but was clearly incredibly rusty and not up to the pace. There were a few passes he completely shanked and couldn't handle the physicality of it. He's the sort of player I think would be good to have next season, putting him straight into a promotion chase is a lot to ask of someone recovering from that long a layoff.

Mistadobalina wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:35 am You could see why Wellens brought Lyden in - he was getting into the right positions to receive the ball and looked tidy enough, but was clearly incredibly rusty and not up to the pace. There were a few passes he completely shanked and couldn't handle the physicality of it. He's the sort of player I think would be good to have next season, putting him straight into a promotion chase is a lot to ask of someone recovering from that long a layoff.

Don't think it matters whether you're in a promotion chase or not - if anything, getting up to speed is easier in a promotion chasing, winning side, than a struggling, losing one. (Yes, I know our current form).

The problem is with El Miz stupidly suspended, our only other vaguely acceptable option at the 4 position is Brown and he was injured, so Wellens had no choice. It was that, or totally change our formation and style of play.

The problem is only 1 of the 4 recruits is anywhere near match fit and ready to challenge for a starting spot, the other 3 shouldn't be starting games.

EssexO wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:29 am As much as I love Clay, he was useless against Stevenage. He might be our worst passer of a football at the club. Wellens only brings him on when we are struggling to win second balls. Lyden should hopefully get better once he gets match sharp.

He was not useless against Stevenage, he came on, plenty of hustle, bustle and energy and stemmed the bleeding a bit, clay isn't the answer but not sure why he gets such a bad rap in general from fans, he wins the ball, runs around, just play him next to players with ability and it works

essexfootball wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 10:46 am

EssexO wrote: ↑Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:29 am As much as I love Clay, he was useless against Stevenage. He might be our worst passer of a football at the club. Wellens only brings him on when we are struggling to win second balls. Lyden should hopefully get better once he gets match sharp.

He was not useless against Stevenage, he came on, plenty of hustle, bustle and energy and stemmed the bleeding a bit, clay isn't the answer but not sure why he gets such a bad rap in general from fans, he wins the ball, runs around, just play him next to players with ability and it works

I would much sooner have a fit battler on the pitchlike Clay rather than an unfit player who has been out with injury for a year.

Dan Happe was out for nearly a year came back ok , dont see why everone seems so concerned , Lyden was here since after christmas & would of been given a mini pre season by RW & his Staff . Seems like Vultures are circling above on every Wellens decision .

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:03 am Dan Happe was out for nearly a year came back ok , dont see why everone seems so concerned , Lyden was here since after christmas & would of been given a mini pre season by RW & his Staff . Seems like Vultures are circling above on every Wellens decision .

Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.
I like Clay though and whilst not the best player in our squad he always gives 100%.

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:03 am Dan Happe was out for nearly a year came back ok , dont see why everone seems so concerned , Lyden was here since after christmas & would of been given a mini pre season by RW & his Staff . Seems like Vultures are circling above on every Wellens decision .

Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.
I like Clay though and whilst not the best player in our squad he always gives 100%.

Craig was out for nearly a year & hasnt started
many games, substitutes on after 60 minutes +.
Always gives 100 % .

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am
I like Clay though and whilst not the best player in our squad he always gives 100%.

Ditto

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am
Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.

Absolutely correct, 4 new signings all written off as useless by many after just 1 or 2 games, ridiculous.

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:02 pm

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am
Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.

Absolutely correct, 4 new signings all written off as useless by many after just 1 or 2 games, ridiculous.

Yes, but you're forgetting these fans know a lot more than Richie and all the other staff who have played or been involved in football for years!

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:02 pm

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am
Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.

Absolutely correct, 4 new signings all written off as useless by many after just 1 or 2 games, ridiculous.

The issue is 3 of the 4 need time to get up to speed for one reason or another. We needed reinforcements to come in and improve the first XI now, not in April.

TRUMP Plumbing wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:13 pm

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:02 pm

Cheshunto wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:28 am
Tend to think that fans need to give Lyden a chance and at least 5 or 6 games before making an informed opinion.

Absolutely correct, 4 new signings all written off as useless by many after just 1 or 2 games, ridiculous.

The issue is 3 of the 4 need time to get up to speed for one reason or another. We needed reinforcements to come in and improve the first XI now, not in April.

I think we just have to accept the board are sticking to their plan of promotion next season, rather than this. May seem a bit short sighted to the fans, but makes sense to them

Adz wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 9:38 am

TRUMP Plumbing wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:13 pm

Chelmsford Swimmer wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:02 pm

Absolutely correct, 4 new signings all written off as useless by many after just 1 or 2 games, ridiculous.

The issue is 3 of the 4 need time to get up to speed for one reason or another. We needed reinforcements to come in and improve the first XI now, not in April.

I think we just have to accept the board are sticking to their plan of promotion next season, rather than this. May seem a bit short sighted to the fans, but makes sense to them

Going up this season lad !