Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:43 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:21 pm Inexplicably though, I must add. It shows why ideology trumps competency. They've been terrible fora decade but were rewarded with a big f*** off majority because people like their ideology and excuse their incompetence.

This is exactly why I say you don't even believe your own opinions. I thoroughly accept and agree Corbyn was the main reason people didn't vote for them. But they also did reject left wing politics too OR AT LEAST what they think was left wing politics. They tended to be in favour of big and individual policy, but didn't like the far left/hardlef/progressives in general. But I think I'm still correct. You'd agree they've been terrible, right? But people on the centre right or right would vote for them in spite of that incompetence because it at least fits their own ideology.

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:51 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:43 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:21 pm Inexplicably though, I must add. It shows why ideology trumps competency. They've been terrible fora decade but were rewarded with a big f*** off majority because people like their ideology and excuse their incompetence.

This is exactly why I say you don't even believe your own opinions.

I'm embarrassed for you

And then you back it up in four words. So edgy.

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:50 pm Or the moderates sympathise more with the Tories than they do the far left. Just depends which side you're on.

Its the wishy washy moderates who continue to cost the Labour Party
victory In elections .

Loads of them ran for the hills when murdoch printed the
Last one out turn out the lights front cover.

I vote Labour whoever or whatever wing of the party is in the ascendancy.

Just dont get the moderates who faff .

Must be like those O's 1 week Wet spam the next week type of Footy Fan i hear about.

Enough to make your stomach turn

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:38 am

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:50 pm Or the moderates sympathise more with the Tories than they do the far left. Just depends which side you're on.

Its the wishy washy moderates who continue to cost the Labour Party
victory In elections .

Loads of them ran for the hills when murdoch printed the
Last one out turn out the lights front cover.

I vote Labour whoever or whatever wing of the party is in the ascendancy.

Just dont get the moderates who faff .

Must be like those O's 1 week Wet spam the next week type of Footy Fan i hear about.

Enough to make your stomach turn

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:15 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:08 pm

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 9:57 pm

Corbyn already scuppered Starmer's chance to be PM by delivering Labour's worst postwar GE result.

His imaginary new party would be lucky to get 5% of the vote

And you dont think 5% would be enough to stop Starmer?

I think Corbs achieving Labour's worst result since 1935 will stop Starmer

Well lets see how the Brexit fiasco goes before we see how Labours next Election campaign goes shall we.

Im sure an offer of a payrise for Nurses & Health care from Labour will be believed far more by the Electorate than anything the story party will offer.
#DurhamDom has been found out now so his spin will be worthless.

Confucius wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 1:51 am

tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:38 am

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:50 pm Or the moderates sympathise more with the Tories than they do the far left. Just depends which side you're on.

Its the wishy washy moderates who continue to cost the Labour Party
victory In elections .

Loads of them ran for the hills when murdoch printed the
Last one out turn out the lights front cover.

I vote Labour whoever or whatever wing of the party is in the ascendancy.

Just dont get the moderates who faff .

Must be like those O's 1 week Wet spam the next week type of Footy Fan i hear about.

Enough to make your stomach turn

EA17C17F-A15F-4717-924E-2B54A58DA383.jpeg

Why ?

Can you define the Wisdom courage or Justice within your
philosophical Statement ?

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:51 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:43 pm

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:21 pm Inexplicably though, I must add. It shows why ideology trumps competency. They've been terrible fora decade but were rewarded with a big f*** off majority because people like their ideology and excuse their incompetence.

This is exactly why I say you don't even believe your own opinions. I thoroughly accept and agree Corbyn was the main reason people didn't vote for them. But they also did reject left wing politics too OR AT LEAST what they think was left wing politics. They tended to be in favour of big and individual policy, but didn't like the far left/hardlef/progressives in general. But I think I'm still correct. You'd agree they've been terrible, right? But people on the centre right or right would vote for them in spite of that incompetence because it at least fits their own ideology.

That's a lot of words to say you think the electorate is thick.

Actually don't fully agree that people reject left-wing politics. The country tends to lean economically to the left, but socially to the right. So most people would have agreed with Corbyn on making rich people/companies pay more taxes, but not supported his policies on immigration, crime etc.

The problem with Labour and their policies was twofold imo:

1) they included so many undeliverable promises in a 5-year manifesto that people didn't buy it that much

2) Corbyn/the leadership - I personally came across a lot of people who said Corbs had some good policies but just couldn't have confidence in him as PM, and have read plenty of accounts of Labour activists reporting the same

Who, in their right mind, doesn’t think the electorate is thick?

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:20 am And then you back it up in four words. So edgy.

Why would I spend any time on blatant gaslighting?

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:40 am

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:20 am And then you back it up in four words. So edgy.

Why would I spend any time on blatant gaslighting?

Well let's start again then like adults. Apologies you feel this way, and apologies if I have. Can you tell me the parts you felt I was gaslighting?

Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:59 am

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:51 pm

This is exactly why I say you don't even believe your own opinions. I thoroughly accept and agree Corbyn was the main reason people didn't vote for them. But they also did reject left wing politics too OR AT LEAST what they think was left wing politics. They tended to be in favour of big and individual policy, but didn't like the far left/hardlef/progressives in general. But I think I'm still correct. You'd agree they've been terrible, right? But people on the centre right or right would vote for them in spite of that incompetence because it at least fits their own ideology.

That's a lot of words to say you think the electorate is thick.

Actually don't fully agree that people reject left-wing politics. The country tends to lean economically to the left, but socially to the right. So most people would have agreed with Corbyn on making rich people/companies pay more taxes, but not supported his policies on immigration, crime etc.

The problem with Labour and their policies was twofold imo:

1) they included so many undeliverable promises in a 5-year manifesto that people didn't buy it that much

2) Corbyn/the leadership - I personally came across a lot of people who said Corbs had some good policies but just couldn't have confidence in him as PM, and have read plenty of accounts of Labour activists reporting the same

Its not so much about the electorate being thick, but people vote for what they feel, not for the facts. Plus they pick a team and that is that. Look at right now, the Labour left is constantly holding Starmer to account - do conservatives do the same thing? No, they team up together even when evidence is against them. Digby's posts are a good example, he is a Labour supporter/voter that holds Labour's past leadership to a higher standard than the current Conservative government. And I think that is a good thing.

I think we agree though, I did say they were in favour of big and individual policy but I'd say the general population has a pretty poor grasp of what being on the left actually is, or what leftism is. You see it in this thread. People throwing marxist and socialist around as an insult without really knowing what it means. We don't say 'stupid capitalists' or 'righties' as insults anywhere near as much, maybe bar kids on Twitter.
'Lefties' and 'socialists' is used as an insult often for politics that aren't particularly left or socialist. People haven't taken to lefties in general because they think they are patronising (ironic in this post admittedly), virtue signalling, do gooders etc that only care about transpeople and political correctness. It has been demonised. That is just a part of it.

Agree with you on both points.

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:40 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 7:33 pm Jeremy Corbyn is seeking legal advice at this moment in time, so it isnt something I would comment on until the legal position has been sorted.

As an aside, there are a lot of people begging Corbyn to form a new party. I expect at his age he wouldnt be interested, but if he did, he would have 200,000 members in the first week, and he would completely scupper Starmers chance to be Prime Minister
Food for thought!

If you want a racist loony left party where your anti Jewish schitk is tolerated... Join the SWP

Corbyn might be consulting legal advice, but only because he's repeated Milne's defamatory lies and is now facing litigation himself

I’m seriously concerned with COYO’s anti Semitism. He’s the vilest form of racist.

StockholmO wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 1:43 am

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:40 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 7:33 pm Jeremy Corbyn is seeking legal advice at this moment in time, so it isnt something I would comment on until the legal position has been sorted.

As an aside, there are a lot of people begging Corbyn to form a new party. I expect at his age he wouldnt be interested, but if he did, he would have 200,000 members in the first week, and he would completely scupper Starmers chance to be Prime Minister
Food for thought!

If you want a racist loony left party where your anti Jewish schitk is tolerated... Join the SWP

Corbyn might be consulting legal advice, but only because he's repeated Milne's defamatory lies and is now facing litigation himself

I’m seriously concerned with COYO’s anti Semitism. He’s the vilest form of racist.

It seems to have no bounds.

Disoriented wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 7:18 am

StockholmO wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 1:43 am

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:40 pm

If you want a racist loony left party where your anti Jewish schitk is tolerated... Join the SWP

Corbyn might be consulting legal advice, but only because he's repeated Milne's defamatory lies and is now facing litigation himself

I’m seriously concerned with COYO’s anti Semitism. He’s the vilest form of racist.

It seems to have no bounds.

Pleae tell me where ive said anything anti-semetic, cos im buggered if i can find it!
I will reply to these slurs later on, as im having to go out and im running late.

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 8:54 am

Disoriented wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 7:18 am

StockholmO wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 1:43 am

I’m seriously concerned with COYO’s anti Semitism. He’s the vilest form of racist.

It seems to have no bounds.

Pleae tell me where ive said anything anti-semetic, cos im buggered if i can find it!
I will reply to these slurs later on, as im having to go out and im running late.

Anti semitism is jew hate....where have i mentioned jew or jewish? I hate Hodge because she is a right wing hypocrite, who acted disgracefully within the Labour party, and for no other reason.
You really must stop imagining things

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:47 am Anti semitism is jew hate....where have i mentioned jew or jewish? I hate Hodge because she is a right wing hypocrite, who acted disgracefully within the Labour party, and for no other reason.
You really must stop imagining things

As do you, as you seem to see Zionist conspiracies everywhere.

Give it a rest fella - it’s beyond boring now.

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:47 am Anti semitism is jew hate....where have i mentioned jew or jewish? I hate Hodge because she is a right wing hypocrite, who acted disgracefully within the Labour party, and for no other reason.
You really must stop imagining things

Suggesting a jewish person is more loyal to Israel than her own country is antisemitic. Linking jews to banking when there is no reason to is an antisemitic trope. Suggesting she's being sneaky by somehow concealing her name is antisemtic.

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:54 am

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:47 am Anti semitism is jew hate....where have i mentioned jew or jewish? I hate Hodge because she is a right wing hypocrite, who acted disgracefully within the Labour party, and for no other reason.
You really must stop imagining things

Suggesting a jewish person is more loyal to Israel than her own country is antisemitic. Linking jews to banking when there is no reason to is an antisemitic trope. Suggesting she's being sneaky by somehow concealing her name is antisemtic.

Do you not think there is a single Jew anywhere in the Uk, that is more loyal to Israel, than to UK? i bet there are some.
Your generalisations are plain silly.....you are reading things into my narrative, that are figments of your imagination.
Hodge is from a banking family.....thats a fact, whether you like it or not......am i not allowed to say that because you can twist it into saying someones anti-semitic.
anyone who supports the Palestinian people is now labeled as an anti semite, and thats the crux of this
As i said, later today i will post on here a long detailed post, that will surprise you, so ill leave it there for now

Is speaking out against a corrupt, lying Israeli Government (and its' supporters) that enables innocent Palestinian men, women and children to be murdered, antisemitic?

Or is there a gagging order upon that as well?

Because reading the Mainstream Media, you would certainly think so.

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:13 amDo you not think there is a single Jew anywhere in the Uk, that is more loyal to Israel, than to UK? i bet there are some.

He can’t help himself.

Looking forward to this long post later

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:13 am

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:54 am

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:47 am Anti semitism is jew hate....where have i mentioned jew or jewish? I hate Hodge because she is a right wing hypocrite, who acted disgracefully within the Labour party, and for no other reason.
You really must stop imagining things

Suggesting a jewish person is more loyal to Israel than her own country is antisemitic. Linking jews to banking when there is no reason to is an antisemitic trope. Suggesting she's being sneaky by somehow concealing her name is antisemtic.

Do you not think there is a single Jew anywhere in the Uk, that is more loyal to Israel, than to UK? i bet there are some.
Your generalisations are plain silly.....you are reading things into my narrative, that are figments of your imagination.
Hodge is from a banking family.....thats a fact, whether you like it or not......am i not allowed to say that because you can twist it into saying someones anti-semitic.
anyone who supports the Palestinian people is now labeled as an anti semite, and thats the crux of this
As i said, later today i will post on here a long detailed post, that will surprise you, so ill leave it there for now

COYOS, something to consider; 'Diane Abbott is more loyal to Jamaica than she is to the UK'.

If you think that sentence is unfair, racist and conspiracy, which it is - have a think on what you are saying yourself.

Not only more loyal but in the pay off secretly because she's a secret banker who's hiding that fact by taking her husband's surname

I see that the Labour Party is having to pay out £370k to the 7 whistleblowers (let that sink in for a min) in settlement of the recent court case. Now another 42 cases have been logged which potentially could bankrupt the party as the bill could run to millions.

A party which has a fine tradition of defending the weak and the poor and stands against racism being brought to its knees fighting against the very thing it used to beleive in and fight against.

Shame on Labour. An absolute disgrace of a party.