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Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:35 pm
by slacker
Oh, stop with the OTT trolling, Pammy. You're better than that.
I reckon Peake was wrong about Israeli Police training US cops to use the deadly neck kneel hold, as it happens, but there's been lots of eyebrows raised at US police reps travelling to Israel for "anti-terror" tactics training in recent years, as well as at some heavyhanded Israeli Police and IDF tactics in relation to Palestinians in the occupied territories (much of it from Israelis themselves). Shutting down discussion and criticism of these things, and other current policies/practices of the Israeli State as "anti-semitism" isn't a good thing.
Besides, it's one line in a long Indy interview about Peake's work and politics, which is what RLB "liked" or whatever it is she did. I get that its relationship with "the Jewish Community" has become a tricky issue for Labour, but I'm personally disappointed if this thing is why Starmer's sacked RLB.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:55 pm
by AckneyAwks
Did not like Corbyn or his politics but at least you knew what he stood for as against Starmer who i see as a "snide". Out of the two i would trust Corbyn more....and no i did not vote Labour. Not a expert just a observer.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 3:58 pm
by Rich Tea Wellin
We all know that Israel is beyond questioned and any type of criticism is bundled up as ant-semitism.
But really, what could Kier do? If he went done that route it would be the same old sh*t for the net 4 years about how Labour are anti-Semitic.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 4:02 pm
by Admin
Honest question - is this what you're referring to as anti-semitism?
Systemic racism is a global issue,” she adds. “The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.” (A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”
I get politically why Starmer's booted her out as this story is a perfectly timed bit of deflection to take the gaze away from Jenrick although I'm slightly disappointed that Starmer's not called for his dismissal.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 4:03 pm
by PoliticOs
Premier League levels of stupidity from RLB here. Almost impressive.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:16 pm
by Rich Tea Wellin
Really cant see how anyone can construe that as AS but whatever.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:20 pm
by ComeOnYouOs
When we have right-wingers / Tories on here, praising The Labour Party leader, that should tell you all you need to know about TLOTO
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:21 pm
by Long slender neck
It's a weird conspiracy theory, which paints the Israelis as bogeymen.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:24 pm
by ComeOnYouOs
This type of post really pisses me off. A boarder stating all kinds of opinions, as if they were fact......facts he cannot prove.
Maxine Peake isnt an anti semite, and no way in a court of law could you DCC prove that she was...yet you come on here mouthing off a lot of libellous rubbish, as if it were 100% factual
I hope she sues you
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:32 pm
by Millennial Snowflake
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:20 pm
When we have right-wingers / Tories on here, praising The Labour Party leader, that should tell you all you need to know about TLOTO
I'm neither right-wing nor Tory, but thanks for your concern
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:34 pm
by Millennial Snowflake
Me when I see COYOS has posted on the Labour watch thread
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:46 pm
by Admin
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:21 pm
It's a weird conspiracy theory, which paints the Israelis as bogeymen.
Is it?
The Maxine Peake article first quoted an amnesty international report from 2016 which confirmed 000's of US police officers have travelled to Israel for training. This has subsequently been removed from the latest version available on the independent website.
Is it really a massive leap of the imagination that Peake's made to consider the technique could have been passed on? As Slacker's said above, there's plenty of concerns been raised about US officers receiving training in Israel. Even if Peake's a howling at the moon mentalist who's made an incorrect claim, criticism of Israel's policing methods doesn't equate to anti-semitism.
Regardless, RLB's an idiot for presenting an opportunity to deflect attention away from Jenrick etc and for that she's probably given Starmer the excuse he's been looking for to purge a Corbynite from the shad cabinet.
Make no mistake, Labour needs to deal with it's relationship with the Jewish community and I've said before Corbyn wasn't quick enough or decisive enough to deal with the issue. However, in doing so, there needs to be a continued recognition of the difference between anti-zionism and anti-semitism.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:48 pm
by Dunners
This is also about Starmer doing the 'decisive leader' thing on light of Boris not dealing with Jenrick.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:53 pm
by Long slender neck
I haven't looked into the claim at all, was just replying to Apple Wumble. I don't know if being trained by Israelis should be considered a problem or not. I couldn't really care less about the whole Israel Palestine issue and neither should Labour, imo.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:10 pm
by ComeOnYouOs
Millennial Snowflake wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:32 pm
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:20 pm
When we have right-wingers / Tories on here, praising The Labour Party leader, that should tell you all you need to know about TLOTO
I'm neither right-wing nor Tory, but thanks for your concern
You what!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Do you read your own posts?
I have no concern whatsoever for you.......just to put you straight
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:19 pm
by tuffers#1
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:43 pm
by ComeOnYouOs
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:50 pm
by PoliticOs
Hmm, so I probably won't do this opinion justice, however;
I think you could definitely constitute what Maxine Peake has said as dogwhistle antisemitism. I would say, I don't think she necessarily meant or sees it as antisemitic (though she might), and probably the same for RLB. I don't think either of those are outright antisemitic, but like too many on the left, they are letting 'Israel' seep into too much of their thinking and talking and letting genuine concerns there walk into casual racism. It didn't even need saying, nor retweeting.
It is 100% fine to criticise the government and policy there, but Israel isn't the only nation to work with the US on policing. She could have said Iran, she could have said Russia, she could have said New Zealand, or the UK. But she said Israel, as if it needs to be held to a higher regard than any of those other countries mentioned and that is, for me, where it becomes casually antisemitic. It seems like there has been a leap made, and that leap is where it gets dodgy.
I also agree people confuse antizionism with antisemitism, but some will always see both of those as much the same thing.
Those on this side of the political spectrum, myself included, are very keen on people educating themselves on where their blind spots may be. This is a blind spot. Time to take the medicine and reflect, learn and change.
Unfortunately for RLB, she has just had 5 years of people constantly talking about this blind spot. It is incredibly thick to not think this link will be made, she made it impossible for Starmer. She should have known better.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:58 pm
by tuffers#1
PoliticOs wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:50 pm
Hmm, so I probably won't do this opinion justice, however;
I think you could definitely constitute what Maxine Peake has said as dogwhistle antisemitism. I would say, I don't think she necessarily meant or sees it as antisemitic (though she might), and probably the same for RLB. I don't think either of those are outright antisemitic, but like too many on the left, they are letting 'Israel' seep into too much of their thinking and talking and letting genuine concerns there walk into casual racism. It didn't even need saying, nor retweeting.
It is 100% fine to criticise the government and policy there, but Israel isn't the only nation to work with the US on policing. She could have said Iran, she could have said Russia, she could have said New Zealand, or the UK. But she said Israel, as if it needs to be held to a higher regard than any of those other countries mentioned and that is, for me, where it becomes casually antisemitic. It seems like there has been a leap made, and that leap is where it gets dodgy.
I also agree people confuse antizionism with antisemitism, but some will always see both of those as much the same thing.
Those on this side of the political spectrum, myself included, are very keen on people educating themselves on where their blind spots may be. This is a blind spot. Time to take the medicine and reflect, learn and change.
Unfortunately for RLB, she has just had 5 years of people constantly talking about this blind spot. It is incredibly thick to not think this link will be made, she made it impossible for Starmer. She should have known better.
Israel is the only country in the World that has criticism of its existence or its actions protected by its constitution & Claims it as anti-Semitism.
If other countries tried to justify there existence by blaiming , Racism or religion they would be ridiculed by the world .
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:58 pm
by PoliticOs
I also think people can be committed anti-racists and still say and do things that would be casually racist. Much like a feminist could say something misogynistic as a blind spot. This is a good example of why it is such an issue.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:04 pm
by Orient Punxx
WTF has Israel's policing got to do with BLM - of course it's anti-semitism.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:27 pm
by Rich Tea Wellin
Is interesting how it’s ‘defund the police, their training is wrong’ until someone mentions who they may have had some ideas of training from Israel its anti-semitism.
The principle that everything Israel does is good, and if it’s not it’s anti-semitism.
There’s very real anti-semitism in the world (trust me, I’ve been on the end of it). This sort of trivial, political sh*t just covers that up.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:28 pm
by Rich Tea Wellin
Interesting that certain boarders were defending National Front “protesters” not long ago but are all of a sudden very concerned about anti-semitism. Wronguns.
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:58 pm
by kokomO
Apple Wumble wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:28 pm
Interesting that certain boarders were defending National Front “protesters” not long ago but are all of a sudden very concerned about anti-semitism. Wronguns.
This
Re: Labour Watch
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:09 pm
by tuffers#1
Dunnes Stores in Ireland became the 1st to set up apartheid in the world.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunnes_Stores_strike
They tried to do the same thing again recently
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... ettlements
Until U.S buisnesses & Israel flexed there muscles.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishc ... oycott.amp
