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Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm
by Dohnut
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Moderates like me who are, let’s say left of centre, hold the key to election wins. Which is why both parties have enjoyed power in the past. The moderates in the middle switch to whatever numpty is party leader, which is why either party can usually win. Personally I’d use Pareto. With 80% spanning out from the centre but not quite reaching the extreme. It’s the middle portion of this group who ultimately decide. The swing factor. Blair and Mandleson understood this clearly, as does BoJo.
Something Corbyn and Momentum just cannot grasp.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:22 pm
by Ronnie Hotdogs
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Moderates like me who are, let’s say left of centre,
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:41 pm
by Dohnut
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:22 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Moderates like me who are, let’s say left of centre,
Odd comeback. I’ve never made any secret of my support for New Labour in general and Tony Blair in particular. I come from a very much Labour working class background and have voted Red over Blue at the majority of elections.
Now. I’m a definite swing voter. Look at the leader and what they say. Problem for me is Labour leaders of late have been absolute dickheads. So where do I go? I’m sure I’m not alone.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:47 pm
by StillSpike
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:41 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:22 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm
Moderates like me who are, let’s say left of centre,
Odd comeback. I’ve never made any secret of my support for New Labour in general and Tony Blair in particular. I come from a very much Labour working class background and have voted Red over Blue at the majority of elections.
Now. I’m a definite swing voter. Look at the leader and what they say. Problem for me is Labour leaders of late have been absolute dickheads. So where do I go? I’m sure I’m not alone.
Quite extraordinary. So you looked at the 2 manifestos the last time and thought to yourself "well there's not much to choose between these 2 parties so I'll base my pick on which of the 2 leaders I like the most"? Really? That was the difference you saw between the parties?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:56 pm
by tuffers#1
I missed this on saturday
Priti reckons shop lifting is down
Daft Cow
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-st ... -1-6624258
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 6:00 pm
by Dohnut
StillSpike wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:47 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 5:41 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:22 pm
Odd comeback. I’ve never made any secret of my support for New Labour in general and Tony Blair in particular. I come from a very much Labour working class background and have voted Red over Blue at the majority of elections.
Now. I’m a definite swing voter. Look at the leader and what they say. Problem for me is Labour leaders of late have been absolute dickheads. So where do I go? I’m sure I’m not alone.
Quite extraordinary. So you looked at the 2 manifestos the last time and thought to yourself "well there's not much to choose between these 2 parties so I'll base my pick on which of the 2 leaders I like the most"? Really? That was the difference you saw between the parties?
Manifesto reading is fine but I have to believe they are credible and the leader has the ability to actually do what they contain. I don’t believe Corbyn nor Milliband had the ability to create a sensible, costed manifesto not the skills to implement.
Leaders need credibility, without which the manifesto is meaningless. I just never believed Corbyn was capable of delivering.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 6:01 pm
by Dohnut
Crime in general is down. Is Abbott’s son in lockdown?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:08 pm
by tuffers#1
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 6:01 pm
Crime in general is down. Is Abbott’s son in lockdown?
I dont know but even she'd know crime is down in general because everyone is
at home & all the shops are Closed.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:45 pm
by Dohnut
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:08 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 6:01 pm
Crime in general is down. Is Abbott’s son in lockdown?
I dont know but even she'd know crime is down in general because everyone is
at home & all the shops are Closed.
Wasn’t suggesting a link.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:55 pm
by Long slender neck
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Correct, the right wingers always win.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
by Dohnut
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:55 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Correct, the right wingers always win.
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:49 pm
by Disoriented
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:55 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Correct, the right wingers always win.
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
If he is taking note, why has he given Milliband an official position?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:30 pm
by Max B Gold
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:55 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Correct, the right wingers always win.
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
What has the world moved on from ?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:37 pm
by Dohnut
Max B Gold wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:30 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
What has the world moved on from ?
You need me to retell you? Wow. WUM alert. The world has stood still fo 70 years. You need to get out more.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:46 pm
by Max B Gold
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:37 pm
Max B Gold wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:30 pm
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
What has the world moved on from ?
You need me to retell you? Wow. WUM alert. The world has stood still fo 70 years. You need to get out more.
That's not very helpful or specific. In fact it is patronising and disrespectful.
Answer the question.
Is the need for a different economic system any less relevant today than it was 70 years ago?
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:32 pm
by Ronnie Hotdogs
Redline wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:38 am
Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:55 pm
RedO wrote: ↑Mon Apr 27, 2020 11:32 am
Elections aren’t being won on centre ground.
Correct, the right wingers always win.
And always will until the left appoint a decent Leader. Seem to remember Blair did very well, for a while. Why, he went for the popular vote, the centre ground. Starmer is Labour taking note that numpties like Milliband and Corbyn won’t succeed. The world has moved on, Labour need to do the same.
As PW said, the right wingers always win.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:16 pm
by Currywurst and Chips
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
by NuneatonO's
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:26 pm
by Currywurst and Chips
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
So it was before
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:53 pm
by Rich Tea Wellin
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
Bizarrely they are still publicly targeting 100,000 a day by end of tomorrow, even though they only did 40,000 today and have capacity for 70,000. Lying until the end.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:07 pm
by tuffers#1
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... xMktIkkcD4
Cummings the Rat involved in so much.
So much for the British & UN- ELECTED bureacrats running things .
The EU must be having a rye chuckle at this
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:20 pm
by faldO
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
Yes, questions need to be asked. Like is a saliva-based test (accuracy not yet proven) from a US startup (always risky to do business with) which take at least 72 hours to process in the US (hardly efficient) really a feasible option?
A non story from the Guardian. Anyone can "offer tests". Whether they are fit for purpose is the question.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:41 pm
by NuneatonO's
faldO wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:20 pm
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
Yes, questions need to be asked. Like is a saliva-based test (accuracy not yet proven) from a US startup (always risky to do business with) which take at least 72 hours to process in the US (hardly efficient) really a feasible option?
A non story from the Guardian. Anyone can "offer tests". Whether they are fit for purpose is the question.
Oh you mean like the 3.5 Million test kits previously purchased by the Tory Government; that were subsequently proven to be unfit for purpose:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... oronavirus
Was this a non-story from The Guardian as well?
Perhaps you'd also like to explain how the target of 100,000 tests per day can be met, whilst we don't have the testing kits in place?
Insufficient virus-testing is due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Insufficient PPE is also due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Clearly, given the number of Covid-19 cases; coupled with the high UK death rate; this is also due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Whatever way people want to spin it, Johnson, Cummings and senior Tories, have 'blood on their hands'.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:05 pm
by Max B Gold
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:41 pm
faldO wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:20 pm
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
With Matt Hancock's promise of 100,000 tests per day (by tomorrow) evaporating into yet another lie, here is even further evidence of this incompetent, blundering Tory Government:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... -weeks-ago
Thousands of testing kits obviously WERE available.
Questions seriously need to be asked.
This isn't about playing politics anymore. This issue; together with inadequate PPE provision for NHS Staff; is about Tory Politicians being held accountable for people actually losing their lives.
Yes, questions need to be asked. Like is a saliva-based test (accuracy not yet proven) from a US startup (always risky to do business with) which take at least 72 hours to process in the US (hardly efficient) really a feasible option?
A non story from the Guardian. Anyone can "offer tests". Whether they are fit for purpose is the question.
Oh you mean like the 3.5 Million test kits previously purchased by the Tory Government; that were subsequently proven to be unfit for purpose:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... oronavirus
Was this a non-story from The Guardian as well?
Perhaps you'd also like to explain how the target of 100,000 tests per day can be met, whilst we don't have the testing kits in place?
Insufficient virus-testing is due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Insufficient PPE is also due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Clearly, given the number of Covid-19 cases; coupled with the high UK death rate; this is also due to this Tory Governments' incompetence.
Whatever way people want to spin it, Johnson, Cummings and senior Tories, have 'blood on their hands'.
You attribute the Tory government failures to their incompetence. They clearly are and it arises from the political decisions they have made.
Re: Tory Watch
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:16 pm
by faldO
NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:41 pm
Oh you mean like the 3.5 Million test kits previously purchased by the Tory Government; that were subsequently proven to be unfit for purpose:
Thank you, that was exactly the point I was making. A startup in the US rings up and offers tests and the government is supposed to bite off their hand?
You described it as further evidence of government incompetence. Believe the Guardian's spin on the story if you like, but to me the headline does not match the substance of the story.
