Independent Leyton Orient Forum

PoliticOs wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:48 pm

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:44 pm Where were all these people when Menezes was murdered? Were they not ‘woken’ then?

Partly, yes. But also this was before Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, as many rolling news channels as we have now and at a time where people had a different opinion of their news outlets. I.E taking more at face value.

So mobilising globally was a very different think. Even nationally.


(But also many of those people that did stand up for JCDM would be in London now on this issue, I'd imagine).

I would hope so fella.

There was very lively debate and outrage on this very platform (or one of its predecessors) as I remember it.

Indeed. A lot of people had to be put right on points they were unsure of.

StillSpike wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:54 pm There was very lively debate and outrage on this very platform (or one of its predecessors) as I remember it.

Didn’t stop Cressida from getting promoted though.

jean Charles de Menezes, is a whole new ball game.
Have a look on Google what he was doing work wise, a couple of weeks before he was murdered, then put 2 and 2 together. I'm saying no more

Not another conspiracy?

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:44 pm Where were all these people when Menezes was murdered? Were they not ‘woken’ then?

We were going rage on this very Board but to no avail. Nothing has changed. A Boarding fail if you like.

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:44 pm Where were all these people when Menezes was murdered? Were they not ‘woken’ then?

The Menezes debacle was down to one person, Cresida willy, Yep that's right The Met Chiefs Commisioner

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:22 pm jean Charles de Menezes, is a whole new ball game.
Have a look on Google what he was doing work wise, a couple of weeks before he was murdered, then put 2 and 2 together. I'm saying no more

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:40 am

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:31 am

NuneatonO's wrote: ↑Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:46 pm There's no hysteria from me towards our Police.

The vast majority of coppers do a very good job; in ever-increasing, difficult circumstances.

However, there is clearly an element who believe themselves to be outside of the law. So irrespective of whether you are Left- wing, Right- wing or even completely down the middle, this cannot be condoned.

Not often I agree with you, however your spot on with this one, good post.

I told you Tax, you are becoming more socialist by the day.

I've been more socialist in the past than you are in the present, I see all sides of all parties and can sus out how silly some the ideas are they come up with, mostly pipe dreams but no good for the country as a whole

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:45 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:22 pm jean Charles de Menezes, is a whole new ball game.
Have a look on Google what he was doing work wise, a couple of weeks before he was murdered, then put 2 and 2 together. I'm saying no more

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:52 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:45 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:22 pm jean Charles de Menezes, is a whole new ball game.
Have a look on Google what he was doing work wise, a couple of weeks before he was murdered, then put 2 and 2 together. I'm saying no more

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

You don't think the guy who WAS there, but decided to cover his arse by asking someone who WASN'T there to make the call, bears some responsibility?

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:52 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:45 pm

ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:22 pm jean Charles de Menezes, is a whole new ball game.
Have a look on Google what he was doing work wise, a couple of weeks before he was murdered, then put 2 and 2 together. I'm saying no more

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

Thanks for that, completely irrelevant to the original point about his job being one of the motives or involved somehow.

Also like to know where you heard CD made the ident? As I believe it was made by plain clothes officers on the bus

What about the fire alarm?

Worrying.

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:14 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:52 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:45 pm

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

Thanks for that, completely irrelevant to the original point about his job being one of the motives or involved somehow.

Also like to know where you heard CD made the ident? As I believe it was made by plain clothes officers on the bus

She was in charge of the whole operation, the guys trailing Menezes called back to her for confirmation of the ID of the correct suspect, she confirmed it and gave the go ahead, even though she wasn't there, The hit was made on the tube.

Not quite sure why anyone would even attempt to defend Cressida Co*k for this. She is the perfect example of hypocrisy in relation to a racist tragedy.

o-no wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:05 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:52 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:45 pm

So the Met conspired to kill an electrician on his way to fix a fire alarm!?!!

Blimey

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

You don't think the guy who WAS there, but decided to cover his arse by asking someone who WASN'T there to make the call, bears some responsibility?

He done the right thing, contact higher up the line for ID and also authority to shoot, she has overall authority on all decisions, she ultimately is to blame,

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:03 pm Not quite sure why anyone would even attempt to defend Cressida Co*k for this. She is the perfect example of hypocrisy in relation to a racist tragedy.

I personally don't think race came into this one Dis, Cressida co*cked up big time, she even retired but it's amazing that the Met invited her to come out of retirement as they couldn't find some one better qualified. REALLY!

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:59 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:14 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:52 pm

The police were watching the building he was living in for another guy, Cresida willy was in charge of that team hunting the other man, The officers thought they had spotted the right guy however they contacted Cresida who was not with them to confirm he was the right man and she said yes, even though she was not there, she alone was responsible for them killing the wrong guy

Thanks for that, completely irrelevant to the original point about his job being one of the motives or involved somehow.

Also like to know where you heard CD made the ident? As I believe it was made by plain clothes officers on the bus

She was in charge of the whole operation, the guys trailing Menezes called back to her for confirmation of the ID of the correct suspect, she confirmed it and gave the go ahead, even though she wasn't there, The hit was made on the tube.

Yes you've repeated yourself, my question was where did you hear that? Genuinely interested

Because most sources attribute the ident to the plain clothes officers who were convinced of his identity by his appearance and his actions around Brixton tube. This was later relayed to gold who acted on the ident and ordered that they not let him enter Stockwell Station

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:10 pm

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:03 pm Not quite sure why anyone would even attempt to defend Cressida Co*k for this. She is the perfect example of hypocrisy in relation to a racist tragedy.

I personally don't think race came into this one Dis, Cressida co*cked up big time, she even retired but it's amazing that the Met invited her to come out of retirement as they couldn't find some one better qualified. REALLY!

My point is that she controlled an operation that killed a foreigner in a case of ‘mistaken identity’.

The implications of this are clear.

Even if it is argued she should not have been sacked, it is inconceivable that the ‘higher ups’ considered her to be promoted to the most senior police position in the land.

If JCM was white-British, this undoubtedly would not have been the case.

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:20 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:59 pm

Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 10:14 pm

Thanks for that, completely irrelevant to the original point about his job being one of the motives or involved somehow.

Also like to know where you heard CD made the ident? As I believe it was made by plain clothes officers on the bus

She was in charge of the whole operation, the guys trailing Menezes called back to her for confirmation of the ID of the correct suspect, she confirmed it and gave the go ahead, even though she wasn't there, The hit was made on the tube.

Yes you've repeated yourself, my question was where did you hear that? Genuinely interested

Because most sources attribute the ident to the plain clothes officers who were convinced of his identity by his appearance and his actions around Brixton tube. This was later relayed to gold who acted on the ident and ordered that they not let him enter Stockwell Station

We are along similar lines, never heard of "gold" though, assume that was Cressida, "gold" or who ever had the final say and gave the ok to kill him.

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:29 pm

point nine one eight wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:10 pm

Disoriented wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:03 pm Not quite sure why anyone would even attempt to defend Cressida Co*k for this. She is the perfect example of hypocrisy in relation to a racist tragedy.

I personally don't think race came into this one Dis, Cressida co*cked up big time, she even retired but it's amazing that the Met invited her to come out of retirement as they couldn't find some one better qualified. REALLY!

My point is that she controlled an operation that killed a foreigner in a case of ‘mistaken identity’.

The implications of this are clear.

Even if it is argued she should not have been sacked, it is inconceivable that the ‘higher ups’ considered her to be promoted to the most senior police position in the land.

If JCM was white-British, this undoubtedly would not have been the case.

She was not sacked, the finger was pointed at her but managed to wiggle off the hook by some clever work from the Met, she later retired but as I said they reckoned there was no one better than her to be the new senior Met officer so she came back.

Back on topic- statues being taken down across the land. Were these really causing offence? Is this the #1 aim of the BLM protests? Surely they can come up with something better?

I quite like a statue (and other public sculptures) as part of the streetscape, but rarely know who the geezer being commemorated is, or the circumstances of the erection (fnar).

As well as finding it funny, I think those that tore down the Colston statue and chucked it in the water have down us a favour. Hardly anyone outside of Bristol would have known who this slave trader was, how many deaths, or how much human misery, his business was responsible for - that no amount of philanthropy makes up for (the Jimmy Saville equation, if you like).

It’s about time this country had a proper look and reflection on its history and its “Great Men”. Most peoples knowledge is very shallow indeed: Churchill being voted number 1 Brit a few years back being a prime example, despite his very obvious odious views on race, eugenics, plus his long list of howlers and uselessness outside of being the right cheerleader at the right time in WW2.

Will also confess my ignorance of most statues. Not sure if getting rid of them is the right way to go though. It doesn't seem fair to judge people from the past on today's values.