Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:12 am I thought Corbyn debated well, not much to choose between them as the poll I posted suggests. A main issue for me was Corbyn refusing to say how he would campaign in the event he had to negotiate a new deal with the eu should he win the election. I do believe it’s important to know where he stands and what he believes in. I know what Boris wants, I know what Jo wants, I have no idea what Jeremy wants. That’s a poor show from him to hide behind whatever, it’s sneaky and snidey in my opinion.

Obviously, the Tories would like him to make a stand NOW, one way or another, on which way he'd campaign in his own referendum, because they know that would alienate around half the country, so he's fairly sensible to refuse to make that point now. It's also not an unreasonable position from him that it would be absurd to state in advance whether or not he'd campaign for a deal that's yet to be negotiated. He may well know what his opening position in any negotiations would be, and I suppose if the negotiations ended with him getting everything he wanted at the start, then he'd back the exit deal that resulted. If, on the other hand, the negotiations ended up with a "deal" that he felt was so far short of his ideal (start position) and was so bad for the UK that he'd put it to the people - as promised - but campaign against it.

StillSpike wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 8:20 am

Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:12 am I thought Corbyn debated well, not much to choose between them as the poll I posted suggests. A main issue for me was Corbyn refusing to say how he would campaign in the event he had to negotiate a new deal with the eu should he win the election. I do believe it’s important to know where he stands and what he believes in. I know what Boris wants, I know what Jo wants, I have no idea what Jeremy wants. That’s a poor show from him to hide behind whatever, it’s sneaky and snidey in my opinion.

I'll just post this bit again, as you may have missed it:

Obviously, the Tories would like him to make a stand NOW, one way or another, on which way he'd campaign in his own referendum, because they know that would alienate around half the country, so he's fairly sensible to refuse to make that point now. It's also not an unreasonable position from him that it would be absurd to state in advance whether or not he'd campaign for a deal that's yet to be negotiated. He may well know what his opening position in any negotiations would be, and I suppose if the negotiations ended with him getting everything he wanted at the start, then he'd back the exit deal that resulted. If, on the other hand, the negotiations ended up with a "deal" that he felt was so far short of his ideal (start position) and was so bad for the UK that he'd put it to the people - as promised - but campaign against it.

Why is his position so hard for you to understand? JO just wants to ignore half the country without even letting them have a say. So does Johnson, just it's the other half, and his plan includes tanking the economy and breaking up the Union.

Now I can't claim to know exactly how I would vote in a potential new referendum of any possible new deal that Corbyn might be able to get Vs Remain, because I haven't seen Corbyn's deal yet (and neither has he, as it hasn't been through negotiation yet). My inclination is that I'd probably vote Remain, but if his deal was good for the UK then I might support it, if I thought we'd be better off under it, and it brought the country together again.

Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:12 am I thought Corbyn debated well, not much to choose between them as the poll I posted suggests. A main issue for me was Corbyn refusing to say how he would campaign in the event he had to negotiate a new deal with the eu should he win the election. I do believe it’s important to know where he stands and what he believes in. I know what Boris wants, I know what Jo wants, I have no idea what Jeremy wants. That’s a poor show from him to hide behind whatever, it’s sneaky and snidey in my opinion.

RedO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:44 am It doesn’t matter what he wants. He will do what the people want.

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:50 am

Thor wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:12 am I thought Corbyn debated well, not much to choose between them as the poll I posted suggests. A main issue for me was Corbyn refusing to say how he would campaign in the event he had to negotiate a new deal with the eu should he win the election. I do believe it’s important to know where he stands and what he believes in. I know what Boris wants, I know what Jo wants, I have no idea what Jeremy wants. That’s a poor show from him to hide behind whatever, it’s sneaky and snidey in my opinion.

Is that the same Boris who wrote newspaper articles in favour of remain AND leave?

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:00 am He doesnt want Johnsons deal. He wants to negotiate his own deal and then let the public decide if they like it. Cant be much clearer than that.

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:06 am How can he know how he'd vote if the deal hasnt been negotiated yet? It isnt always possible to give definitive answers, things are rarely so simple.

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:48 am Is that not how its pronounced?

RedO wrote: ↑Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:44 am It doesn’t matter what he wants. He will do what the people want.