Independent Leyton Orient Forum

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:35 pm**

Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:13 pm
redintheface wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 1:29 pm
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 10:42 am

Little to no flair with hardly any players with pace in the midfield and wing areas to run at defences. Things need to change pretty soon if we are to avoid a season of struggling. As to bringing in a ''Midfield player'' well needs to be better than what we already have if he is going to make any impact at all !
Not sure it’s about a lack of pace ( ie foot speed) Sid,to me it’s more around the tempo at which we play and the ball is moved around - appears to be a lack of urgency if you like. Agree 100% that whoever the new boy is, he needs to be capable of starting and not just there to bolster the squad.
When do we ever see midfielders running at the defence and going past opponents, when do we see wingers or wingbacks running at the defence, beating the opposing fullbacks on the outside and then whipping in decent crosses ? Its all such a slow, predictable and plodding tempo. Wingbacks ( ? ) if you can call Ling and Widdowson that, rarely if ever taking their man on, just the predictable check back pass. Brophy with his runs, then rarely an end product. All too slow and predictable, as the saying goes ''No guts, no glory'' We need a bit of the old ''Lazarus'' swagger and gutsy adventurous play. Crowds will not keep coming for the present ''dross'' being served up. So much that is wrong at present, I am sure that if Danny or Jobi was in charge, things would perk up a bit.

Why are you? Dont you realise they are on the coaching team now?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:43 pm**

15 minutes to unveiling according to Orient Twitter

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:50 pm**

Prestige Worldwide wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:35 pm
Sid Bishop wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:13 pm
redintheface wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 1:29 pm

Not sure it’s about a lack of pace ( ie foot speed) Sid,to me it’s more around the tempo at which we play and the ball is moved around - appears to be a lack of urgency if you like. Agree 100% that whoever the new boy is, he needs to be capable of starting and not just there to bolster the squad.
When do we ever see midfielders running at the defence and going past opponents, when do we see wingers or wingbacks running at the defence, beating the opposing fullbacks on the outside and then whipping in decent crosses ? Its all such a slow, predictable and plodding tempo. Wingbacks ( ? ) if you can call Ling and Widdowson that, rarely if ever taking their man on, just the predictable check back pass. Brophy with his runs, then rarely an end product. All too slow and predictable, as the saying goes ''No guts, no glory'' We need a bit of the old ''Lazarus'' swagger and gutsy adventurous play. Crowds will not keep coming for the present ''dross'' being served up. So much that is wrong at present, I am sure that if Danny or Jobi was in charge, things would perk up a bit.
Why are you? Dont you realise they are on the coaching team now?

Of course I realise they are ON the coaching team BUT read properly and fully. I did say ''Sure that ''IF'' Danny or Jobi was in ''CHARGE'' things would perk up a bit'' In CHARGE meaning if one of those two were the caretaker ''MANAGER'' rather than Ross, then things might well improve. I am just giving an opinion and because someone happens to be a coach in a football team, does not give them the same status or power as being the manager does it !

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:56 pm**

Why are you sure about this?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:13 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 11:22 am Brophy did use his right a couple of times Saturday and quite well. Just prefers his left

Not too sure who will get dropped for the new saviour

Looking at our new Midfield player, my question about who would be dropped has been answered. The answer, probably no one. Young George is likely to sit on the bench and get a short run out now and then.

Barring injuries and the return of Jobi and Dayton, perhaps Turley too, the current starting 11 will be “it” in league games for the foreseeable future.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:22 pm**

What I'd like to know is who will he replace? Why has no one asked that question?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:31 pm**

One of the centre backs and then go 442.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 4:11 pm**

Story of O wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:31 pm One of the centre backs and then go 442.

Put Clay on the right wing?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 4:37 pm**

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 4:11 pm
Story of O wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:31 pm One of the centre backs and then go 442.
Put Clay on the right wing?

Er, no.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:27 pm**

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:22 pm What I'd like to know is who will he replace? Why has no one asked that question?

Great question. Why has nobody asked this?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:38 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:27 pm
CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:22 pm What I'd like to know is who will he replace? Why has no one asked that question?
Great question. Why has nobody asked this?

Clay is the obvious candidate.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:41 pm**

Disoriented wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:38 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:27 pm
CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 3:22 pm What I'd like to know is who will he replace? Why has no one asked that question?
Great question. Why has nobody asked this?
Clay is the obvious candidate.

Clay if we stay 352. Happe if we go 442. Cant say replacing Clay with a guy with zero games and zero experience excites me and tough on Clay. Huge gamble.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:41 pm
Disoriented wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:38 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:27 pm

Great question. Why has nobody asked this?
Clay is the obvious candidate.
Clay if we stay 352. Happe if we go 442. Cant say replacing Clay with a guy with zero games and zero experience excites me and tough on Clay. Huge gamble.

Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm**

Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:41 pm
Disoriented wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:38 pm

Clay is the obvious candidate.
Clay if we stay 352. Happe if we go 442. Cant say replacing Clay with a guy with zero games and zero experience excites me and tough on Clay. Huge gamble.
Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm**

To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:52 pm**

eagwgw wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.

TBF, he probably was before Dale broke his ankle and he's not been the same since . I've often wondered if whether Dale is playing with a fear factor that it might happen again and that's why he's been known to bottle tackles . He bottled two last Saturday . If that's the case, he's got to get it out of his head because it's holding him back .I don't know, it's only just a thought.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:52 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm
Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:41 pm

Clay if we stay 352. Happe if we go 442. Cant say replacing Clay with a guy with zero games and zero experience excites me and tough on Clay. Huge gamble.
Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson

Stick the new kid on the right wing?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:53 pm**

eagwgw wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.

I wonder with Gorman if he has mentally recovered from his injury. Physically I'm sure he is 100% but sometimes he seems lacking in the tough tackling department. Maybe I'm doing him an injustice but he seems to me to sometimes avoid the real physical challenges by holding back.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:54 pm**

CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:52 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm
Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm

Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson
Stick the new kid on the right wing?

So whats your solution?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:55 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:53 pm
eagwgw wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.
I wonder with Gorman if he has mentally recovered from his injury. Physically I'm sure he is 100% but sometimes he seems lacking in the tough tackling department. Maybe I'm doing him an injustice but he seems to me to sometimes avoid the real physical challenges by holding back.

See my post above . We're thinking along the same lines .

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:00 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:54 pm
CreamofSumYungGai wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:52 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson
Stick the new kid on the right wing?
So whats your solution?

I’ve already said FFS.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:04 pm**

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:52 pm
eagwgw wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.
TBF, he probably was before Dale broke his ankle and he's not been the same since . I've often wondered if whether Dale is playing with a fear factor that it might happen again and that's why he's been known to bottle tackles . He bottled two last Saturday . If that's the case, he's got to get it out of his head because it's holding him back .I don't know, it's only just a thought.

Don’t think it’s that.

Gormans tackling isn’t his issue, it’s his ball retention and decision making, he’s always trying something too difficult and giving the ball away.

Maybe he’s just not that good which is why perennial L2 strugglers Stevenage let him go?

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:15 pm**

RedDwarf 1881 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:55 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:53 pm
eagwgw wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:45 pm To be fair Russell Slade did ok with a lop-sided 4-4-2 for a bit.

If this Marsh guy is as tenacious and hard-working as billed it might not be bad. Almost certainly he will have good technical ability.

Words are cheap though. Dale Gorman was called combative and tenacious by the Stevenage site and he is neither really.
I wonder with Gorman if he has mentally recovered from his injury. Physically I'm sure he is 100% but sometimes he seems lacking in the tough tackling department. Maybe I'm doing him an injustice but he seems to me to sometimes avoid the real physical challenges by holding back.
See my post above . We're thinking along the same lines .

It worries me too if Dayton will be the same. Always a risk with players coming back from a serious injury. Some cope better than others. Gorman came with high praise from Jobi, who no doubt understands what makes a decent player. But he has rarely shown what I'm sure he is capable of. Maybe he will come good during the season. Hope so. We will need him as the season progresses.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:30 pm**

dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm
Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:41 pm

Clay if we stay 352. Happe if we go 442. Cant say replacing Clay with a guy with zero games and zero experience excites me and tough on Clay. Huge gamble.
Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson

Right okay. We'll play him out of position then, ahead of players that actually do play that position. People have been saying we need a new central midfielder, so your solution is to sign one, then keep central midfield the same as it was before and play the new one out of position.

Posted: **Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:50 pm**

Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 8:30 pm
dOh Nut wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:23 pm
Red_Army wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2019 6:51 pm

Doh, please explain to me how we would play a 442 with the only change being Marsh for Happe. I'd love to hear it.

Ling Coulson Ekpiteta Widdowson
Marsh Wright Clay Brophy
Angol Wilkinson
Right okay. We'll play him out of position then, ahead of players that actually do play that position. People have been saying we need a new central midfielder, so your solution is to sign one, then keep central midfield the same as it was before and play the new one out of position.

Yawn.

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