Are Fylde just as plastic as Salford?

[CreamofSumYungGai]

I sit in the north and a lot of people around me don’t have kids with them ever, now that’s a fact.

I agree.

But when we’re getting 6,000 crowds in sell out games, it ain’t because of the ghost kids. They’re a drop in the ocean.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

I sit in the north and a lot of people around me don’t have kids with them ever, now that’s a fact.

I agree.

But when we’re getting 6,000 crowds in sell out games, it ain’t because of the ghost kids. They’re a drop in the ocean.

Some may say if they are ghosts they should be a drop in the ocean.

[RientO]

... it ain’t because of the ghost kids. They’re a drop in the ocean.

For Wrexham according to Orient web site - ATTENDANCE: 6,643 (931 away fans)
I believe it was sold out (though stand to be corrected)
According to wikipedia 1,459 in away section, so that's 500 off capacity of approx 9,000
so 5,712 Os fans in 7,768 seats that could have been available. Even if you knock off the 768 for TV cameras (generous) it still leaves around 1,300 unused seats .
Looking at the gallery https://www.leytonorient.com/news/2019/ ... amgallery/ there seems to be a lot more empty seats in the north stand
https://www.leytonorient.com/siteassets ... .jpg/Large

[CreamofSumYungGai]

... it ain’t because of the ghost kids. They’re a drop in the ocean.

For Wrexham according to Orient web site - ATTENDANCE: 6,643 (931 away fans)
I believe it was sold out (though stand to be corrected)
According to wikipedia 1,459 in away section, so that's 500 off capacity of approx 9,000
so 5,712 Os fans in 7,768 seats that could have been available. Even if you knock off the 768 for TV cameras (generous) it still leaves around 1,300 unused seats .
Looking at the gallery https://www.leytonorient.com/news/2019/ ... amgallery/ there seems to be a lot more empty seats in the north stand
https://www.leytonorient.com/siteassets ... .jpg/Large

How many does the North Stand hold? There ain't 1,300 empty seats!

[CreamofSumYungGai]

Quick look on the ticketing site and it holds approximately 1,200.

[RientO]

Quick look on the ticketing site and it holds approximately 1,200.

Sure. Probably ghost kids in other stands as well, but less conspicuous :-) [also STHs who couldn't make the early KO for whatever reason]

The issue with the North stand is that adults can only buy season tickets there as of last season if they get a child ticket as well, so there are probably a fair few who decided that paying £180 for their seat + £9 for a kids ticket that may rarely or never be used was preferable to paying £300 in east/west or £280 in South

https://www.leytonorient.com/news/2017/ ... ification/

[RientO]

last season's ticket prices. £179 North, £279 South, £299 East/West

https://www.leytonorient.com/news/2017/ ... s-2017-18/

[RientO]

https://www.leytonorient.com/news/2019/ ... 1920-faqs/

Plenty of adults rightly took advantage of our £9 Under-11 Season Tickets to buy in number for friends and family. The success this created, however, also generated its own problem with a number of Under-11 Season Tickets sadly not used on a regular basis. This has created difficulties on occasions this season during our busiest sell-out games – such as our Football for a Fiver fixtures – when all the seats have been sold, but several hundred are not used. We fully understand there will be occasions throughout the season when fans cannot attend individual matches. However we are aware that some seats have only been used on a handful of occasions, and sometimes not at all, which then prevents others unable to get a ticket from witnessing the unique experience that is football at Leyton Orient FC.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

It's an issue we've done to death and one I'm fully aware of, especially the clubs dodgy statement on why they increased kids tickets by 500%.

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

The £10 kids season ticket was something the club should have been proud of.

But back to the subject, ghost kids in the North (capacity 1,200) doesn't explain away the unused 2,000 or whatever it is.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

Although looking at those photos yeah, there's clearly a lot of spares in the North, no argument that its not a contributing factor.

[RientO]

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

I guess the North is cheaper as it is factoring in an adult bringing a child or two and making it as affordable as possible. And yes, the price in the North should be similar to the South for adults as it is the same view.

Chelsea have a similar pricing for their family section where the tickets for adults are over £10 cheaper in the family section than anywhere else. So the price of two tickets (adult + child) there is little than the cost of the cheapest single ticket elsewhere.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

I guess the North is cheaper as it is factoring in an adult bringing a child or two and making it as affordable as possible. And yes, the price in the North should be similar to the South for adults as it is the same view.

Chelsea have a similar pricing for their family section where the tickets for adults are over £10 cheaper in the family section than anywhere else. So the price of two tickets (adult + child) there is little than the cost of the cheapest single ticket elsewhere.

Make it affordable to bring kids by reducing the kids tickets price, not weirdly reducing the adult's ticket price.

I'm still not sure this will solve the problem as people will want to stay in the North now rather than be moved elsewhere. What they should do is demand proof that the child exists and then require a certain number of attendances.

[spen666]

As a neutral, I’m not so sure your input is needed on this topic.

So you have no answer to the fact that Leyton Orient were re born in 2017?

They weren't re-born, they were revived as they were only on their death bed not actually in the morgue.

Salford weren't even on their death bed before the class of 92 pumped them full of financial steroids

[Esteban]

So you have no answer to the fact that Leyton Orient were re born in 2017?

They weren't re-born, they were revived as they were only on their death bed not actually in the morgue.

Salford weren't even on their death bed before the class of 92 pumped them full of financial steroids

They were in their infancy before the Class of 92 came along.

[Delamod]

I think one issue is wanting to stay near people you've got to know.
I've had season tickets for the north stand for quite a few years now and know most people who sit near our group.
I think we'll have two more seasons where my son qualifies for the junior ticket. I personally wouldn't mind paying full whack once he gets beyond that if we could stay in the north- it may be a solution to the phantom kids ( I actually doubt there are many real phantoms, more like genuine children who are very infrequent attenders).

[spen666]

I think one issue is wanting to stay near people you've got to know.
I've had season tickets for the north stand for quite a few years now and know most people who sit near our group.
I think we'll have two more seasons where my son qualifies for the junior ticket. I personally wouldn't mind paying full whack once he gets beyond that if we could stay in the north- it may be a solution to the phantom kids ( I actually doubt there are many real phantoms, more like genuine children who are very infrequent attenders).

The club kicked out adults who no longer have kids from North Stand a few years ago.

It is a shame as like you say, you make friends with those around you for years and then suddenly are kicked out because your kid turns 18. It changes the enjoyment you have at games, and I suspect may result in some people stopping attending.

The other side of the coin is you can't have a family stand made up of adults without kids.

Perhaps a way forward would be to make it a stand where strict rules of behaviour are enforced. No swearing, no abuse of opposition etc to make it family friendly without excluding adults who can watch games without such behaviour. The only other point is that I hear far worse language in the North Stand than I do on occasions I sit in other stands. Usually from parents attending with their kids!

[Delamod]

I think one issue is wanting to stay near people you've got to know.
I've had season tickets for the north stand for quite a few years now and know most people who sit near our group.
I think we'll have two more seasons where my son qualifies for the junior ticket. I personally wouldn't mind paying full whack once he gets beyond that if we could stay in the north- it may be a solution to the phantom kids ( I actually doubt there are many real phantoms, more like genuine children who are very infrequent attenders).

The club kicked out adults who no longer have kids from North Stand a few years ago.

It is a shame as like you say, you make friends with those around you for years and then suddenly are kicked out because your kid turns 18. It changes the enjoyment you have at games, and I suspect may result in some people stopping attending.

The other side of the coin is you can't have a family stand made up of adults without kids.

Perhaps a way forward would be to make it a stand where strict rules of behaviour are enforced. No swearing, no abuse of opposition etc to make it family friendly without excluding adults who can watch games without such behaviour. The only other point is that I hear far worse language in the North Stand than I do on occasions I sit in other stands. Usually from parents attending with their kids!

Yep- pretty much agree with all that.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

The only other point is that I hear far worse language in the North Stand than I do on occasions I sit in other stands. Usually from parents attending with their kids!

No disrespect but that's totally f**king bullsh*t. Take it you've never ventured into the South?

[spen666]

The only other point is that I hear far worse language in the North Stand than I do on occasions I sit in other stands. Usually from parents attending with their kids!

No disrespect but that's totally f**king bullsh*t. Take it you've never ventured into the South?

I take it reading and comprehension are not your strong point.

[orienfan64920]

It's an issue we've done to death and one I'm fully aware of, especially the clubs dodgy statement on why they increased kids tickets by 500%.

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

The £10 kids season ticket was something the club should have been proud of.

But back to the subject, ghost kids in the North (capacity 1,200) doesn't explain away the unused 2,000 or whatever it is.

How do we get rid of the ghost kids without pushing the price of kids tickets up though?

With your proposed pricing it would still be cheaper to buy an adult and child ticket than go elsewhere, so why would people who favour the north not do that?

[RientO]

How do we get rid of the ghost kids without pushing the price of kids tickets up though?

One option would be unallocated seating and to do what they did with the free youth season tickets they had a few years ago. You got a book of vouchers, but only got the ticket when you turned up and handed it in. That way it would be possible to know how many kids seats were actually used on average and to sell extra adult tickets to compensate. Only danger would be if loads of extra kids did actually turn up.

The east stand is effectively unallocated seating as there is often someone sat in my assigned seat, but we just shift along a few seats.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

It's an issue we've done to death and one I'm fully aware of, especially the clubs dodgy statement on why they increased kids tickets by 500%.

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

The £10 kids season ticket was something the club should have been proud of.

But back to the subject, ghost kids in the North (capacity 1,200) doesn't explain away the unused 2,000 or whatever it is.

How do we get rid of the ghost kids without pushing the price of kids tickets up though?

With your proposed pricing it would still be cheaper to buy an adult and child ticket than go elsewhere, so why would people who favour the north not do that?

The reason I've suggested the North should be cheaper than the South is that it hasn't got the bar. Just as both are cheaper than the West because of the worse view. Do you honestly think someone would rather pay £249 plus £9 to sit in the North, when they could pay £279 and use the bar in the South?

I've also suggested some sort of attendance requirement.

[CreamofSumYungGai]

How do we get rid of the ghost kids without pushing the price of kids tickets up though?

One option would be unallocated seating and to do what they did with the free youth season tickets they had a few years ago. You got a book of vouchers, but only got the ticket when you turned up and handed it in. That way it would be possible to know how many kids seats were actually used on average and to sell extra adult tickets to compensate. Only danger would be if loads of extra kids did actually turn up.

The east stand is effectively unallocated seating as there is often someone sat in my assigned seat, but we just shift along a few seats.

No issue with unallocated seating in there but not sure this gets around the issue - you'd still need to reserve x amount of seats to accommodate the kids season ticket holders should they turn up.

[orienfan64920]

It's an issue we've done to death and one I'm fully aware of, especially the clubs dodgy statement on why they increased kids tickets by 500%.

I don't understand why the North adult price is that much lower. It just doesn't make sense. If the West is £299 with the best view, the South £279 with the use of the bar included then something like £249 would be about right for the North. That's what they should have corrected.

The £10 kids season ticket was something the club should have been proud of.

But back to the subject, ghost kids in the North (capacity 1,200) doesn't explain away the unused 2,000 or whatever it is.

How do we get rid of the ghost kids without pushing the price of kids tickets up though?

With your proposed pricing it would still be cheaper to buy an adult and child ticket than go elsewhere, so why would people who favour the north not do that?

The reason I've suggested the North should be cheaper than the South is that it hasn't got the bar. Just as both are cheaper than the West because of the worse view. Do you honestly think someone would rather pay £249 plus £9 to sit in the North, when they could pay £279 and use the bar in the South?

I've also suggested some sort of attendance requirement.

Not many perhaps. Another thing to factor in though is optimistic parents buying tickets for uninterested kids, who only turn up to three or five games a season. More expensive kids tickets fundamentally discourages 'casual' ticket buying, which is going to be a reason, combined with completely non existent children, for our poor sell out attendances.

I wonder if we really need a whole family stand. It's not as if you don't get families elsewhere, and from videos taken from the North it doesn't seem there are many children at all.

[RientO]

No issue with unallocated seating in there but not sure this gets around the issue - you'd still need to reserve x amount of seats to accommodate the kids season ticket holders should they turn up.

Airlines do this type of thing to fill planes up by factoring in no shows. Estimate the percentage of kids (and adults) that won't turn up and oversell a proportion of that. Midweek games often have more no shows. That written, it was only an issue for at most 3 games last season.