Labour Watch

[ComeOnYouOs]

My twitter feed is full of Jewish people supporting Corbyn and Labour.
Jewish Voice for Labour are a Jewish group, that support Corbyn 100%
I know loads of Jewish people who support Labour and Corbyn, because they know Corbyn isnt racist in any form, and this is a right wing smear campaign

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

My twitter feed is full of Jewish people supporting Corbyn and Labour.
Jewish Voice for Labour are a Jewish group, that support Corbyn 100%
I know loads of Jewish people who support Labour and Corbyn, because they know Corbyn isnt racist in any form, and this is a right wing smear campaign

That some Jewish people support Labour does not in any way change what is going on.

[Thor]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst, but he is guilty of allowing anti Semitic attacks increase under his watch as labour leader. You therefore know that as the head of the party he becomes guilty by association and for falling to stamp it out as his previous attempts to clean it up were more like lip service to the problem.

[Disoriented]

They see fascists everywhere. They clearly know they are fascists because they challenge their Stalinist thinking.

So you are saying the Jews i talk to are delusional. Big statement.

Thought you might of went for the safer option of “Jewish people” seeing as the word you used is seen as a slur these days

It is Lucky but clearly has passed Max by.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst, but he is guilty of allowing anti Semitic attacks increase under his watch as labour leader. You therefore know that as the head of the party he becomes guilty by association and for falling to stamp it out as his previous attempts to clean it up were more like lip service to the problem.

Nail on the head.

[Disoriented]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst, but he is guilty of allowing anti Semitic attacks increase under his watch as labour leader. You therefore know that as the head of the party he becomes guilty by association and for falling to stamp it out as his previous attempts to clean it up were more like lip service to the problem.

So what you are saying is he is no leader, as he fails to show leadership qualities and does not lead with conviction.

If so, I make you right. I also make Labour unelectable whilst he remains in charge.

[Thor]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst, but he is guilty of allowing anti Semitic attacks increase under his watch as labour leader. You therefore know that as the head of the party he becomes guilty by association and for falling to stamp it out as his previous attempts to clean it up were more like lip service to the problem.

So what you are saying is he is no leader, as he fails to show leadership qualities and does not lead with conviction.

If so, I make you right. I also make Labour unelectable whilst he remains in charge.

Absolutely agree

[Max B Gold]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst, but he is guilty of allowing anti Semitic attacks increase under his watch as labour leader. You therefore know that as the head of the party he becomes guilty by association and for falling to stamp it out as his previous attempts to clean it up were more like lip service to the problem.

So what you are saying is he is no leader, as he fails to show leadership qualities and does not lead with conviction.

If so, I make you right. I also make Labour unelectable whilst he remains in charge.

Absolutely agree

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

So what you are saying is he is no leader, as he fails to show leadership qualities and does not lead with conviction.

If so, I make you right. I also make Labour unelectable whilst he remains in charge.

Absolutely agree

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

Deflection. Blind loyalty. Sad.

[Thor]

So what you are saying is he is no leader, as he fails to show leadership qualities and does not lead with conviction.

If so, I make you right. I also make Labour unelectable whilst he remains in charge.

Absolutely agree

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

[Max B Gold]

Absolutely agree

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Quickly scanned that post. Rife isn't mentioned once. Therefore point fail.

Out of interest who was on that committee?

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I don’t recall anyone calling Corbyn a rasicst,

[Admin]

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Quickly scanned that post. Rife isn't mentioned once. Therefore point fail.

Out of interest who was on that committee?

Didn’t I have this “rife” argument with Maffy a few months ago on this thread? From memory he provided nothing in the way of evidence...

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Quickly scanned that post. Rife isn't mentioned once. Therefore point fail.

Out of interest who was on that committee?

Didn’t I have this “rife” argument with Maffy a few months ago on this thread? From memory he provided nothing in the way of evidence...

Er. We did debate this so I chose other adjectives, equally rejected. All came down to the definition of such words and people’s interpretation of evidence. Don’t want to go there again. We will never agree.

[Admin]

Heh. You don’t want to go there because you couldn’t justify what you were claiming. Go read it again - only 10 or pages back.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

He doesn’t want to go there again.

Let it go admin, you’re never going to win around Mr Dailymail.

[Max B Gold]

Absolutely agree

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Looks like some others have been investigating this problem too

A recent investigation by a left-wing Jewish group severely undermines Ellman’s claim to be the victim of anti-Jewish racism in the party.

On the contrary, in a statement released on Thursday, Jewish Voice for Labour said their report shows evidence of Jews in Ellman’s constituency “facing harassment because they oppose her unquestioning pro-Israel stance,” as well as “her attempt to cut British aid for Palestinians schools; and her open hostility to Corbyn.”

Jewish Voice for Labour concluded in the report that since the spring of 2016, there has been “a systematic campaign by Ellman and her anti-Corbyn allies” in Liverpool “to disempower and drive out members who back the socialist, internationalist politics of the Labour leadership.”

The detailed report is based on extensive conversations between Jewish Voice for Labour and local Labour members, as well as an extensive trove of primary documents and audio recordings since 2016.

Local Labour members say they are the victim of a media-led witch hunt encouraged by Ellman and her right-wing party allies.

The report contains some hair-raising findings.

The campaign against ordinary Labour members in Liverpool has included:

Wide-ranging, un-evidenced smears of anti-Semitism;A widely-circulated dossier on “the far-left” in Liverpool’s Labour Party authored by an unnamed person or persons who apparently infiltrated the local chapter of left-wing group Momentum to steal minutes, content from private online forums and other internal documents;An allegedly doctored audio recording intended to smear a local leftist;And “distressing” attacks by the right against left-wing Jewish members.Smears

Jewish Voice’s for Labour’s investigation details how the smears against Liverpool Labour members really kicked off in April 2016 – weeks ahead of local elections which had been regarded as Corbyn’s first real electoral test.

The initial allegations, put forth by Ellman allies like right-wing Labour councilor Nick Small, claimed that at a local party meeting, one member had alleged that Israel was “behind [the] rise in anti-Semitism.”

But as the report states, there was no mention in any of the reporting that the comments were by Helen Marks, who is herself Jewish

Small’s rendering of Marks’ comment was inaccurate, the report states. In fact she “suggested that if there had been a rise in anti-Semitism, particularly in the Labour Party, as Ellman had argued, this might be due in part to the actions of the Israeli government towards the Palestinians.”

The idea that Israel’s wars against Palestinians are often followed by upticks in anti-Semitism is by no means Marks’ original idea, the report says. The Community Security Trust, or CST, “which monitors anti-Semitic incidents noted a 500 percent rise following Israel’s assault on Gaza in 2014.”

The CST is a charity which monitors levels of anti-Semitism in the UK, but which also privately lobbies for Israeland in favor of Zionism.

“Silencing”

Marks told a Labour Party investigator “how distressing it was for her to face anti-Semitism allegations, given her experience as a British Jew whose ancestors had fled bigotry and violence in Russia and Poland before World War I and whose father had lost most of his extended family during the Nazi Holocaust.”

She told the party official that “silencing is what has been happening to people, like myself, critical of Israel’s actions towards the Palestinians, and this has sadly been done by members of the Labour Party who have equated such criticism with anti-Semitism.”

In September 2016, Corbyn was facing a leadership challenge from the Labour right, after a coup attempt launched by Labour Friends of Israel supporter Margaret Hodge in June.

Amid all this, right-wing libertarian blog Guido Fawkes published a dossierclaiming to expose “far-left infiltration of the Labour Party in Liverpool since September 2015” (the month Corbyn was first elected).

Jewish Voice for Labour found that the dossier “was presented as if it revealed a sinister, anti-Semitic Trotskyite plot, justifying Ellman’s public campaign against members of her own CLP.”

The dossier itself is a scurrilous series of smears; a tenuous conspiracy theory seeking to conflate the then-new left-wing group Momentum with the Trotskyist Militant tendency, which made waves in Liverpool in the 1980s.

But the document does contain some telling admissions about its own agenda.

As Jewish Voice for Labour notes, the anonymous dossier “in effect made clear that Louise Ellman faced challenges from the left because of her opposition to Jeremy Corbyn’s leadership and her support for the state of Israel and its treatment of Palestine and Palestinians – not because of her being Jewish.”

One of the “key figures” of the “hard left” that it targeted was Jeremy Hawthorn who “has been an active campaigner with Liverpool Friends of Palestine.”

“Black-op”

Guido Fawkes’ own analysis of the dossier is worth noting. The blog claimed at the time that it had been authored by unnamed “Labour Party moderates.” They said it contained “highly professional, forensic levels of detail.”

Labour HQ denied to the blog that was an official party document.

“Whoever carried out the extensive investigation must have had significant abilities and resources,” Guido wrote. “This is not an amateur job, it is a forensic red-on-red black op which found its way to the press to diminish the party leadership. Note that it’s written in the official party font.”

Despite the blog’s claim that the dossier was written by Labour “moderates” it remains unclear who exactly the author of this “highly professional … black op” was.

This long campaign against the Labour left in Liverpool resulted in an investigation by party bureaucrats.

Although this investigation, led by now-resigned staffer Ben Westerman, ultimately found no evidence of anti-Semitism, the local party was still sanctioned.

Labour’s ruling national executive imposed restrictive conditions on Labour meetings in Liverpool Riverside, which “initially benefited Louise Ellman’s anti-Corbyn faction,” the Jewish Voice for Labour report found.

Westerman and Ellman’s allegations played a prominent part in a now widely discredited episode of the BBC’s Panorama program on the issue in July.

Westerman claimed to have been asked by a Liverpool member if he was “from Israel,” and said that as a Jewish person, he had been shocked to face such anti-Semitism.

But an investigation by The Canary, based on an audio recording of Westerman’s interview severely undermined the former official’s claims.

The audio showed that the woman had actually asked “what branch are you in,” and had not asked where he was “from” – and crucially had said nothing about Israel at all.

[bobo66]

I don't understand why Corbyn not supporting Israel is translated as being anti-Semitic. Can someone explain?

[spen666]

When will you be dealing with the FACT I posted? Which clearly demonstrated that antisemitism is NOT rife in the Labour Party. The real ones are in the Tory and Brexit Parties and Nazi organisations.

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Looks like some others have been investigating this problem too

A recent investigation by a left-wing Jewish group severely undermines Ellman’s claim to be the victim of anti-Jewish racism in the party.

On the contrary, in a statement released on Thursday, Jewish Voice for Labour said their report shows evidence of Jews in Ellman’s constituency “facing harassment because they oppose her unquestioning pro-Israel stance,” as well as “her attempt to cut British aid for Palestinians schools; and her open hostility to Corbyn.”

......

Hmm that settles the issue once and for all. A body calling its self in its name as being ..."FOR LABOUR" is clearly an impartial source and we can rely on thie report as being 100% impartial

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I don't understand why Corbyn not supporting Israel is translated as being anti-Semitic. Can someone explain?

It's not that he doesn't support Israel. It's that he, quite rightly, doesn't support their foreign policy.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

In October, the House of Commons Home Affairs Select Committee held an inquiry into antisemitism in the United Kingdom and found that, it was critical of Corbyn's response to antisemitic incidents against Labour MPs and described the Chakrabarti inquiry as "ultimately compromised" The report also found that "the failure of the Labour Party to deal consistently and effectively with anti-Semitic incidents in recent years risks lending force to allegations that elements of the Labour movement are institutionally anti-Semitic".

How’s that for starters mr blindsided maxy boy?

Looks like some others have been investigating this problem too

A recent investigation by a left-wing Jewish group severely undermines Ellman’s claim to be the victim of anti-Jewish racism in the party.

On the contrary, in a statement released on Thursday, Jewish Voice for Labour said their report shows evidence of Jews in Ellman’s constituency “facing harassment because they oppose her unquestioning pro-Israel stance,” as well as “her attempt to cut British aid for Palestinians schools; and her open hostility to Corbyn.”

......

Hmm that settles the issue once and for all. A body calling its self in its name as being ..."FOR LABOUR" is clearly an impartial source and we can rely on thie report as being 100% impartial

So you think that these Jewish people with Jewish Voice for Labour would turn a blind eye to anti-Semitism? That's a very serious accussation.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

Heh. You don’t want to go there because you couldn’t justify what you were claiming. Go read it again - only 10 or pages back.

Not so. I looked at the definitions of the words used and like many things it’s down to interpretation. Therefore agreement was never going to be reached. I find it interesting that someone else chose to use the same word. But this debate is a dead duck.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

Looks like some others have been investigating this problem too

A recent investigation by a left-wing Jewish group severely undermines Ellman’s claim to be the victim of anti-Jewish racism in the party.

On the contrary, in a statement released on Thursday, Jewish Voice for Labour said their report shows evidence of Jews in Ellman’s constituency “facing harassment because they oppose her unquestioning pro-Israel stance,” as well as “her attempt to cut British aid for Palestinians schools; and her open hostility to Corbyn.”

......

Hmm that settles the issue once and for all. A body calling its self in its name as being ..."FOR LABOUR" is clearly an impartial source and we can rely on thie report as being 100% impartial

So you think that these Jewish people with Jewish Voice for Labour would turn a blind eye to anti-Semitism? That's a very serious accussation.

I think you need to study history and find other people who were supported by parts of the Jewish community. Let me say from the outset that in no way am I comparing the people concerned then, with now, just the strange support.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I think you need to study history and find other people who were supported by parts of the Jewish community. Let me say from the outset that in no way am I comparing the people concerned then, with now, just the strange support.

I don't know what you're saying? Please elaborate.

[Admin]

Heh. You don’t want to go there because you couldn’t justify what you were claiming. Go read it again - only 10 or pages back.

Not so. I looked at the definitions of the words used and like many things it’s down to interpretation. Therefore agreement was never going to be reached. I find it interesting that someone else chose to use the same word. But this debate is a dead duck.

Relentless.

You're intellectually the equivalent of 23-24 Leinster Gardens - a fake facade with nothing behind (go look it up). Be a man and admit you were wrong. I bet you still think anti-semitism is rife in the labour party - not because you've any real evidence to support it, but because you've read it somewhere in the main stream media. I bet you secretly think Boris is quite good because he's showing "leadership" right now - you're his dream voter pal.

What a sad man you are.