Ross’ comments on Ogie

[Red_Army]

I think there are some valid points being made on here.

1. It’s got nothing to do with Ling bashing. I’m supportive of our DoF and want Sam to become a great player.

2. Comments about Sam being passive are spot on. Drives me nuts. Judd is quite the reverse. Give me a player showing passion and trying every day. A player who has never been given a shot, just bit parts, and gets criticised because he ain’t up to speed.

3. If Ross calls out Ogie, then Ling too should get the same treatment. Plenty of issues with his game too. But Ling get star treatment and a fanfare when signing a contract extension. Odd.

4. Gets picked because he is the best. How do we know, Judd has never been given equal opportunities.

1. If its not about Ling bashing, then why has a thread about Ogie turned into a have a pop at Ling thread?
2. If that is your justification, then put me at right back. Don't worry that I'm slow fat and useless, I'll show more passion than you could believe.
3. Most of our players get a similar treatment when signing a new contract, don't be silly.
4. It is abundantly clear to anyone with eyes and a football brain that, right now, Ling is the better of the two currently.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I think there are some valid points being made on here.

1. It’s got nothing to do with Ling bashing. I’m supportive of our DoF and want Sam to become a great player.

2. Comments about Sam being passive are spot on. Drives me nuts. Judd is quite the reverse. Give me a player showing passion and trying every day. A player who has never been given a shot, just bit parts, and gets criticised because he ain’t up to speed.

3. If Ross calls out Ogie, then Ling too should get the same treatment. Plenty of issues with his game too. But Ling get star treatment and a fanfare when signing a contract extension. Odd.

4. Gets picked because he is the best. How do we know, Judd has never been given equal opportunities.

So Judd 'has never been 'given a shot' despite playing 50+ times for us?

Most of those shots came before we bought (yes, we paid a fee!) The Samling, when Myles was just a 17/18 year old boy. He wasn't doing too badly up until that point.

[BiggsyMalone]

AGENDA ALERT
Why do people always have to turn it around to the Lings?
The post is about Ogie. Rightly or wrongly Ross assessed the situation & told it as he saw it. Looks like he will be some player but isn't just ready yet.

Sam Ling plays every week, regardless of how poor he is. Ogie is a kid who has barely played first team football. Nothing to do with agenda, you don’t do that to a kid.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I think there are some valid points being made on here.

1. It’s got nothing to do with Ling bashing. I’m supportive of our DoF and want Sam to become a great player.

2. Comments about Sam being passive are spot on. Drives me nuts. Judd is quite the reverse. Give me a player showing passion and trying every day. A player who has never been given a shot, just bit parts, and gets criticised because he ain’t up to speed.

3. If Ross calls out Ogie, then Ling too should get the same treatment. Plenty of issues with his game too. But Ling get star treatment and a fanfare when signing a contract extension. Odd.

4. Gets picked because he is the best. How do we know, Judd has never been given equal opportunities.

1. If its not about Ling bashing, then why has a thread about Ogie turned into a have a pop at Ling thread?
2. If that is your justification, then put me at right back. Don't worry that I'm slow fat and useless, I'll show more passion than you could believe.
3. Most of our players get a similar treatment when signing a new contract, don't be silly.
4. It is abundantly clear to anyone with eyes and a football brain that, right now, Ling is the better of the two currently.

1. Because of the obvious double standards. For whatever reason, The Samling is afforded much more praise than he warrants, and gets no criticism at all despite deserving plenty. Yet young Shadrach, making what, his second ever appearance for us, is publicly criticised after apparently making a mistake. It's not about bashing The Samling, it's about rightly pointing out the hypocricy displayed by Ross in particular and the club in general.

2. Passion is not the opposite of passive. Dohy is right for once, Samling is passive. It's as if he is too focused on not making a mistake in games rather than contributing something positive. The comparison to Stephen Purchase is a valid one, he too shirked responsibility so as not to make any errors.

3. Come on mate, there's no comparison. People have even commented that the club have started trolling the fanbase it's got so bad.

4. Disagree. And it's impossible to comment when Myles hasn't been afforded a run of games since I don't know when. No one else would retain their place when playing as poorly as Samling has.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

AGENDA ALERT
Why do people always have to turn it around to the Lings?
The post is about Ogie. Rightly or wrongly Ross assessed the situation & told it as he saw it. Looks like he will be some player but isn't just ready yet.

Sam Ling plays every week, regardless of how poor he is. Ogie is a kid who has barely played first team football. Nothing to do with agenda, you don’t do that to a kid.

Exactly this.

[BiggsyMalone]

1) Embleton shouldn't have called out Ogie - that was ridiculous and another example of why he isn't cut-out to manage

2) Ling hasn't made similar errors under Embleton (for example giving away a penalty). Either way, just because Embleton's frustration boiled over with Ogie we don't want him to routinely put down our players in public irrespective of who they are

3) Embleton also hasn't called out players like Wright, Ekpiteta or Clay but for some reason people are turning his comments about Ogie into an attack on Ling, which is clearly their confirmation bias talking

I’m talking about his comments about his positioning and get dragged about. It happens to Ling all the time, that’s why Marv gets dragged out to right back because Ling is never in the right place

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I also thought Marvin had been called out by Ross.....

[Red_Army]

I think there are some valid points being made on here.

1. It’s got nothing to do with Ling bashing. I’m supportive of our DoF and want Sam to become a great player.

2. Comments about Sam being passive are spot on. Drives me nuts. Judd is quite the reverse. Give me a player showing passion and trying every day. A player who has never been given a shot, just bit parts, and gets criticised because he ain’t up to speed.

3. If Ross calls out Ogie, then Ling too should get the same treatment. Plenty of issues with his game too. But Ling get star treatment and a fanfare when signing a contract extension. Odd.

4. Gets picked because he is the best. How do we know, Judd has never been given equal opportunities.

1. If its not about Ling bashing, then why has a thread about Ogie turned into a have a pop at Ling thread?
2. If that is your justification, then put me at right back. Don't worry that I'm slow fat and useless, I'll show more passion than you could believe.
3. Most of our players get a similar treatment when signing a new contract, don't be silly.
4. It is abundantly clear to anyone with eyes and a football brain that, right now, Ling is the better of the two currently.

1. Because of the obvious double standards. For whatever reason, The Samling is afforded much more praise than he warrants, and gets no criticism at all despite deserving plenty. Yet young Shadrach, making what, his second ever appearance for us, is publicly criticised after apparently making a mistake. It's not about bashing The Samling, it's about rightly pointing out the hypocricy displayed by Ross in particular and the club in general.

2. Passion is not the opposite of passive. Dohy is right for once, Samling is passive. It's as if he is too focused on not making a mistake in games rather than contributing something positive. The comparison to Stephen Purchase is a valid one, he too shirked responsibility so as not to make any errors.

3. Come on mate, there's no comparison. People have even commented that the club have started trolling the fanbase it's got so bad.

4. Disagree. And it's impossible to comment when Myles hasn't been afforded a run of games since I don't know when. No one else would retain their place when playing as poorly as Samling has.

I think its pretty nasty to call Ling a shirker. The amount of crap he gets is incredible.

We have 3 players who have player games at right back for us and Judd is not in the top two. I don't think any of the players in that position are much cop and is certainly a position that could be improved, but if you honestly believe that Judd should be first choice, then you have a serious bias issue going on, are choosing to be wrong to suit your agenda or you are a poor judge of a footballer.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I also thought Marvin had been called out by Ross.....

Yes he has. So has Judd.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1554&hilit=marv+ross&start=125

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

1. If its not about Ling bashing, then why has a thread about Ogie turned into a have a pop at Ling thread?
2. If that is your justification, then put me at right back. Don't worry that I'm slow fat and useless, I'll show more passion than you could believe.
3. Most of our players get a similar treatment when signing a new contract, don't be silly.
4. It is abundantly clear to anyone with eyes and a football brain that, right now, Ling is the better of the two currently.

1. Because of the obvious double standards. For whatever reason, The Samling is afforded much more praise than he warrants, and gets no criticism at all despite deserving plenty. Yet young Shadrach, making what, his second ever appearance for us, is publicly criticised after apparently making a mistake. It's not about bashing The Samling, it's about rightly pointing out the hypocricy displayed by Ross in particular and the club in general.

2. Passion is not the opposite of passive. Dohy is right for once, Samling is passive. It's as if he is too focused on not making a mistake in games rather than contributing something positive. The comparison to Stephen Purchase is a valid one, he too shirked responsibility so as not to make any errors.

3. Come on mate, there's no comparison. People have even commented that the club have started trolling the fanbase it's got so bad.

4. Disagree. And it's impossible to comment when Myles hasn't been afforded a run of games since I don't know when. No one else would retain their place when playing as poorly as Samling has.

I think its pretty nasty to call Ling a shirker. The amount of crap he gets is incredible.

We have 3 players who have player games at right back for us and Judd is not in the top two. I don't think any of the players in that position are much cop and is certainly a position that could be improved, but if you honestly believe that Judd should be first choice, then you have a serious bias issue going on, are choosing to be wrong to suit your agenda or you are a poor judge of a footballer.

Nasty?

I'm glad we've finally had an admission that you don't think Samling is up to much, that's a start.

Judd is clearly the better player of the two now, and if he's actually given a proper run of games and allowed to develop, is going to be by far the better player.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

I think there are some valid points being made on here.

1. It’s got nothing to do with Ling bashing. I’m supportive of our DoF and want Sam to become a great player.

2. Comments about Sam being passive are spot on. Drives me nuts. Judd is quite the reverse. Give me a player showing passion and trying every day. A player who has never been given a shot, just bit parts, and gets criticised because he ain’t up to speed.

3. If Ross calls out Ogie, then Ling too should get the same treatment. Plenty of issues with his game too. But Ling get star treatment and a fanfare when signing a contract extension. Odd.

4. Gets picked because he is the best. How do we know, Judd has never been given equal opportunities.

1. If its not about Ling bashing, then why has a thread about Ogie turned into a have a pop at Ling thread?
2. If that is your justification, then put me at right back. Don't worry that I'm slow fat and useless, I'll show more passion than you could believe.
3. Most of our players get a similar treatment when signing a new contract, don't be silly.
4. It is abundantly clear to anyone with eyes and a football brain that, right now, Ling is the better of the two currently.

It’s fair to look at how different players get treated. In fact it’s very fair. Are you seriously suggesting that’s wrong?

Ling is passive. If you can’t see that then you don’t go to games. There may be a decent player in there but he needs to man up. Maybe he suffers from a confidence issue.

I don’t recall players like Macca, Koroma, Harold, Dayton etc getting all the photo shoot stuff when signing contract extensions. Now I don’t always look at the Orient website so maybe I’m wrong. So you tell me, does every player who signs an extension get that treatment? Not talking about new players, just those signing extensions.

Ling better, because he is getting a real chance to develop as a player. Judd is frankly being left behind. Boco island stuff. All Judd gets is bit parts, not a run of games. Anybody with a football brain can see it’s impossible to compare the two. We don’t seem to be an equal opportunity club. If Judd wants a career he needs to go elsewhere.

When Judd started playing he did very well in a poor performing team. In the last few years all he has got is bit parts, behind Ling in the main. Sure injuries didn’t help, you nor I know if he has what it takes to make it.

You have always been pro Sam Ling. All that means is you have lost objectivity. But his defending is average at best, his forward play consists of short balls passing responsibility to others, plus a smattering of decent moves. Oh and a long throw. One day we may see him take on a man. I live in hope. Right now he is average at best.

[Red_Army]

1. Because of the obvious double standards. For whatever reason, The Samling is afforded much more praise than he warrants, and gets no criticism at all despite deserving plenty. Yet young Shadrach, making what, his second ever appearance for us, is publicly criticised after apparently making a mistake. It's not about bashing The Samling, it's about rightly pointing out the hypocricy displayed by Ross in particular and the club in general.

2. Passion is not the opposite of passive. Dohy is right for once, Samling is passive. It's as if he is too focused on not making a mistake in games rather than contributing something positive. The comparison to Stephen Purchase is a valid one, he too shirked responsibility so as not to make any errors.

3. Come on mate, there's no comparison. People have even commented that the club have started trolling the fanbase it's got so bad.

4. Disagree. And it's impossible to comment when Myles hasn't been afforded a run of games since I don't know when. No one else would retain their place when playing as poorly as Samling has.

I think its pretty nasty to call Ling a shirker. The amount of crap he gets is incredible.

We have 3 players who have player games at right back for us and Judd is not in the top two. I don't think any of the players in that position are much cop and is certainly a position that could be improved, but if you honestly believe that Judd should be first choice, then you have a serious bias issue going on, are choosing to be wrong to suit your agenda or you are a poor judge of a footballer.

Nasty?

I'm glad we've finally had an admission that you don't think Samling is up to much, that's a start.

Judd is clearly the better player of the two now, and if he's actually given a proper run of games and allowed to develop, is going to be by far the better player.

I've never claimed that Ling was anything other than adequate. He is a better option than Judd though.

I hope 'Samling' goes better for you than 'JWMD' did.

[F*ck The Poor & Fat]

For me it’s not about whether Ling is better or worse than Judd. None of us know, impossible to compare.

It’s a simple matter that despite average Ling performances, Judd just never seems to get the chance to prove his worth by getting a run of games, a run, not the odd bit part where he is ring rusty, but a run. Accepting mistakes as he gets up to speed. Jeez, the club have been tolerant to Llngs shortcomings

Only then can we really see who offers the best option. A passive, almost invisible player, or one who stupidly gets stuck in. Like Judd or not, you know he’s playing.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

He's not adequate.

The Samling definitely has more potential. Im sticking with this one.

[Red_Army]

For me it’s not about whether Ling is better or worse than Judd. None of us know, impossible to compare.

It’s a simple matter that despite average Ling performances, Judd just never seems to get the chance to prove his worth by getting a run of games, a run, not the odd bit part where he is ring rusty, but a run. Accepting mistakes as he gets up to speed. Jeez, the club have been tolerant to Llngs shortcomings

Only then can we really see who offers the best option. A passive, almost invisible player, or one who stupidly gets stuck in. Like Judd or not, you know he’s playing.

Apart from the time when Judd did get a run in the team last season between September and December, but don't worry about that.

It is quite easy to judge between the two, if you watch them both play and don't take a biased position in either direction.

Again, if that is your criteria for judging a player, then that really says it all.

[Redcard]

Like Sid bishop, I’ve been exited about ogie since I saw him as a junior. I’ve been impressed every time I’ve seen him and against a very physical southend forward he was exceptional and everyone who was at that game would have seen what a talent he is. His performance was all the more encouraging because he was often facing an overlapping full back as well and received no tracking back by Dennis , however after the game Embleton ridiculously critisised his second half performance.
It appears that Embleton has a problem with ogie and his comments after the Wimbledon game are another example of singling out ogie for criticism while never doing the same with other players.
He could have said that Dennis missed a chance that any pro footballer could have buried , or that Gorman can’t complete 90 minutes without getting himself booked etc , but no , once again for some reason he singled out ogie whereas we have seen games where Ekpiteta, coulson , and Happe have given away penalties and escaped similar criticism.
The man may be a staunch orient supporter but he is an idiot. He should be building up the confidence of young players and highlighting their attributes not critisising them publicly.
I am not one who knocks Sam ling because of his family connection and he has put in some decent games lately but ogie is and will be a much much better defender in every aspect than ling. He is stronger , quicker, more energetic, better in the air , and actually tackles rather than backing off , it’s just a pity that he is a left back rather than right sided.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

August to December last season was a pretty productive period, wasn't it. Stepped in whenever Ling or Widdowson were injured, played either flank well, then as soon as either of them were half fit he was bombed out again.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

L it’s just a pity that he is a left back rather than right sided.

It's not. At least he has a chance of getting a game here as he's a left back.

[Red_Army]

August to December last season was a pretty productive period, wasn't it. Stepped in whenever Ling or Widdowson were injured, played either flank well, then as soon as either of them were half fit he was bombed out again.

The same period where you said we were carrying both central midfielders and that Clay wasn't good enough? Why can it be that a team performance is made of 11 players when we're talking about players you like, but not when it is players you don't like?

[Beradogs]

Ling senior always comes across as a slightly, in the loosest possible terms, more knowledgeable version of Sitton. While Sitts drives cabs, Ling would be a controller, stubbing out his fags. He calls birds behind the bar darling and babes and likes putting on a Acca at Wincanton.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

August to December last season was a pretty productive period, wasn't it. Stepped in whenever Ling or Widdowson were injured, played either flank well, then as soon as either of them were half fit he was bombed out again.

The same period where you said we were carrying both central midfielders and that Clay wasn't good enough? Why can it be that a team performance is made of 11 players when we're talking about players you like, but not when it is players you don't like?

Of course.

But I don't think we were carrying Myles at all during that period. I thought he was good.

I think we just have to accept we're never going to agree on this one. I think our treatment of Myles has been pretty shabby and that pre-dates Ross. I can't see Ling going anywhere so think it's for his best that he moves on to fulfil his potential, because I can't see it happening here which is a real shame.

[ComeOnYouOs]

I rate Ogie very highly, and to call him out, is a bad move by Embleton.

Its not a good idea to compare Ogie & Ling because they are chalk and cheese......completely different type of players, but what I will say is, I will be shocked, if Ogie doesnt play at a much higher level than Ling one day in the future.

[Smendrick Feaselberg]

I rate Ogie very highly, and to call him out, is a bad move by Embleton.

Its not a good idea to compare Ogie & Ling because they are chalk and cheese......completely different type of players, but what I will say is, I will be shocked, if Ogie doesnt play at a much higher level than Ling one day in the future.

Yep agree with you on this. I'd personally not be singling any players out, especially now he's admitted he's not up to the job and will be handing over to someone else.

[Smendrick Feaselberg]

Like Sid bishop, I’ve been exited about ogie since I saw him as a junior. I’ve been impressed every time I’ve seen him and against a very physical southend forward he was exceptional and everyone who was at that game would have seen what a talent he is. His performance was all the more encouraging because he was often facing an overlapping full back as well and received no tracking back by Dennis , however after the game Embleton ridiculously critisised his second half performance.
It appears that Embleton has a problem with ogie and his comments after the Wimbledon game are another example of singling out ogie for criticism while never doing the same with other players.
He could have said that Dennis missed a chance that any pro footballer could have buried , or that Gorman can’t complete 90 minutes without getting himself booked etc , but no , once again for some reason he singled out ogie whereas we have seen games where Ekpiteta, coulson , and Happe have given away penalties and escaped similar criticism.
The man may be a staunch orient supporter but he is an idiot. He should be building up the confidence of young players and highlighting their attributes not critisising them publicly.
I am not one who knocks Sam ling because of his family connection and he has put in some decent games lately but ogie is and will be a much much better defender in every aspect than ling. He is stronger , quicker, more energetic, better in the air , and actually tackles rather than backing off , it’s just a pity that he is a left back rather than right sided.

I think the problem is that Embleton is too emotional and this causes him to lash out unfairly. It's nothing against Ogie. If he can't make and learn from mistakes in a league trophy game then where can he? It says more about Embleton's inability to speak with a clear mind.

[Red_Army]

August to December last season was a pretty productive period, wasn't it. Stepped in whenever Ling or Widdowson were injured, played either flank well, then as soon as either of them were half fit he was bombed out again.

The same period where you said we were carrying both central midfielders and that Clay wasn't good enough? Why can it be that a team performance is made of 11 players when we're talking about players you like, but not when it is players you don't like?

Of course.

But I don't think we were carrying Myles at all during that period. I thought he was good.

I think we just have to accept we're never going to agree on this one. I think our treatment of Myles has been pretty shabby and that pre-dates Ross. I can't see Ling going anywhere so think it's for his best that he moves on to fulfil his potential, because I can't see it happening here which is a real shame.

I think Myles Judd is being treated how most 20 year old full backs would be treated at most clubs. The problem is that he was artificially thrown in as a 16/17 year old under the previous regime, and did okay, so Orient fans have an inflated opinion of him. Normally, he would have had 10-15 appearances by this stage of his career.