Poppies vs Palestine

[Scuba Diver]

A weekend that celebrates armistice, I.e. peace seems like the perfect weekend for a March that is calling for peace. I don’t see the problem?

Of course, everyone wants peace, and (despite my post), the real sadness I have around this are for the civilian deaths on both sides.
They are of course just pawns in the game of war and ludicrous "religions".

However- it is arrogant in the extreme to think that a march on the other side of the world (UK) is going to change much in the immediate future.

They already marched.
And sat in railway stations.
It made no difference. They could march the weekend after Remembrance Sunday. ~

It's called respect for the UK's war dead. Let's see if there is any.

The war dead that gave their life in the name of peace. I’m sure they’d feel very respected if they knew like minded people, doing something for injustice were doing it on remembrance.
What are you doing to respect them?

The like minded people that have attacked Police, screamed for Jihad and displayed repulsive signs about death to the non-believers of their madness in our capital City?
I guess you mean them.

To answer your question. Not that I need to, but a damn sight more than you I guess. I put £20 in a collection box for a Poppy, and will attend the Cenotaph in the town where I live on the Sunday morning- as I always do. It's not much, I grant you.
My father fought in WW2 and watched his mates heads getting blown off, so I remember and respect.

[Long slender neck]

Scuba- i think you're tarring an entire religion with things that just arent true or apply only to a minority.

I would bet that a significant number protesting arent even muslims.

I think you should reconsider and edit your post, or I'll have no choice to hit the ban button.

[Dunners]

People have lost their minds. It feels like something has broken over these past couple of weeks. I recommend that everyone deletes Twitter and spends the next few weeks watching videos of kittens and puppies instead.

[Scuba Diver]

Scuba- i think you're tarring an entire religion with things that just arent true or apply only to a minority.

I would bet that a significant number protesting arent even muslims.

Fair enough fella. I've probably gone overboard.
A lady friend of mine from the gym recently got pushed around in town by some (Muslim) lads who were extremely disrespectful (verbally), giving her the white trash/worthless white meat routine.

It's left me a bit senstive and I saw red. She was and is extremely shaken, by this racist attack.

Whilst I stand by what I said about the nuances of the religion, I appreciate that it only applies to a minority. I do have Muslim friends and they don't roll like that.

I'm happy to retract the way I've applied what I've written about the whole religion. I get that many of those protesting likely aren't Muslims, and I too support what they are protesting for.

I can't edit the post as it's been quoted btw.

[Rich Tea Wellin]

Of course, everyone wants peace, and (despite my post), the real sadness I have around this are for the civilian deaths on both sides.
They are of course just pawns in the game of war and ludicrous "religions".

However- it is arrogant in the extreme to think that a march on the other side of the world (UK) is going to change much in the immediate future.

They already marched.
And sat in railway stations.
It made no difference. They could march the weekend after Remembrance Sunday. ~

It's called respect for the UK's war dead. Let's see if there is any.

The war dead that gave their life in the name of peace. I’m sure they’d feel very respected if they knew like minded people, doing something for injustice were doing it on remembrance.
What are you doing to respect them?

The like minded people that have attacked Police, screamed for Jihad and displayed repulsive signs about death to the non-believers of their madness in our capital City?
I guess you mean them.

To answer your question. Not that I need to, but a damn sight more than you I guess. I put £20 in a collection box for a Poppy, and will attend the Cenotaph in the town where I live on the Sunday morning- as I always do. It's not much, I grant you.
My father fought in WW2 and watched his mates heads getting blown off, so I remember and respect.

Good on you. I’m grateful for his mates sacrifice that allows us the freedom of protest against war

[StillSpike]

"The risk of violence and disorder linked to breakaway groups is growing."

Now, I normally pour scorn on conspiracy theorists, but I can't be the only one thinking we're foreshadowing a black flag action. (given the police have already - for some reason - laid the JSO protesters around the Cenotaph just long enough for the cameras.

[Long slender neck]

Could that have been just a convenient bit of space to move protesters to and its the media who have painted it as "hippies attack cenotaph"? Cant imagine it was planned.

[Neptune's Spear]

Of course they should be allowed to demonstrate, those poor Palestinian chappies have had a rough time of it lately

[StillSpike]

Yep, the place that's been front & centre of just about every radio phone in for days also doubles up as a convenient holding pool for other protesters. Right.

[faldO]

Whilst it's generally accepted now that the Just Stop Oil protesters didn't deliberately target the Cenotaph, there were a fair few of them walking down the middle of the road. There are plenty of pictures showing them lying down on both sides of the road, as well as next to the Cenotaph itself.

It did fool a lot of people and politicians at the time though, including Sadiq Khan, Yvette Cooper and Lee Anderson.

[ComeOnYouOs]

Just read that the President of Israel wants the ceasefire march banned, because according to him, remembrance day is a symbol of victory ????????????????

Usually what Israel wants, Israel gets.

A symbol of victory? They make it up as they go along

[E10EU]

Both events are really about the same thing: war and the murder of innocents, just some decades apart.
"Never again" it was said and here we are ....

[LittleMate]

Scuba- i think you're tarring an entire religion with things that just arent true or apply only to a minority.

I would bet that a significant number protesting arent even muslims.

I think you should reconsider and edit your post, or I'll have no choice to hit the ban button.

Having been up there at 6.15pm on Saturday evening, I'd suggest that a significant number appeared to be muslims or of middle eastern origin. Saturday 6pm was pretty chaotic as protestors were being herded away from certain areas or roads. Crowd management was good, non-aggressive, but the sheer number of people about meant there was a recipe for something to happen.

I understand the current world situation and have a lot of sympathy for the plight of the citizens of Gaza, but if they cannot respect previous world events then at the very least they would lose my respect.

[FrankOFile]

They make it up as they go along

As you usually do with your posts.

Still waiting to see your evidence that 75% of the British people support the Palestinians.

[RedDwarf 1881]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/us/18322 ... zi-support

Birds of a feather .

[RedDwarf 1881]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/18322 ... ler-attack

Incapsulates the thread title

[faldO]

ComeOnYouOs says:

About 75% of the British population support the Palestinians

Survey says:

https://yougov.co.uk/international/arti ... e-conflict

[Proposition Joe]

Think COYOS could be getting mixed up with the % of people who support a ceasefire: https://yougov.co.uk/topics/travel/surv ... 19/e363e/1

[Long slender neck]

No march in this country is going to result in a ceasefire on the other side of the planet.

[Admin]

People have lost their minds. It feels like something has broken over these past couple of weeks. I recommend that everyone deletes Twitter and spends the next few weeks watching videos of kittens and puppies instead.

There's a certain amount of truth in this - I've started to give Twitter a miss recently as it's just relentless and I think damaging to your mental health. Far too many just intent on a split second gotcha moment and point scoring. The idea that you can find wrong on both sides of this conflict is just lost on so many.

Saturday is obviously going to be an awful battleground now - Suella and her ilk have created exactly what they wanted. Another divisive culture war that diverts attention away from the skip-fire government we're lumbered with.

But yes, something really does feel deeply broken. No idea if it'll ever get fixed.

[spen666]

People have lost their minds. It feels like something has broken over these past couple of weeks. I recommend that everyone deletes Twitter and spends the next few weeks watching videos of kittens and puppies instead.

There's a certain amount of truth in this - I've started to give Twitter a miss recently as it's just relentless and I think damaging to your mental health. Far too many just intent on a split second gotcha moment and point scoring. The idea that you can find wrong on both sides of this conflict is just lost on so many.

......

Interesting - I don't see any of this on my twitter feed.

I know it does happen and agree with you that its damaging to mental health, and also as we tend to follow people whose views we agree with, it reinforces our prejudices.

My twitter feed is 90% football related posts as I tend to only use twitter to get football news.

[faldO]

Saturday is obviously going to be an awful battleground now - Suella and her ilk have created exactly what they wanted. Another divisive culture war that diverts attention away from the skip-fire government we're lumbered with.

Dumping what may or may not happen on Saturday on "Suella and her ilk" is convenient but the issues run deeper than that. The marches may not be hate marches at Suella said but they are not altogether peace marches either.

The media and social media are littered with footage from the previous marches of antisemism, homophobia, and violence towards individuals and the police. This coming Saturday's march is at least in part organised by people associated with Hamas and those who drove through North London a couple of years ago hurling abuse at Jewish people. None of that can be laid on the government, and it is happening all over the world. Much of it comes from young people who seem to have a completely one-sided and myopic view of the world.

You're right that something is broken, and that the relentless barrage of news is distressing - see this article from The Guardian today.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... l-and-gaza

[Admin]

Saturday is obviously going to be an awful battleground now - Suella and her ilk have created exactly what they wanted. Another divisive culture war that diverts attention away from the skip-fire government we're lumbered with.

Dumping what may or may not happen on Saturday on "Suella and her ilk" is convenient but the issues run deeper than that. The marches may not be hate marches at Suella said but they are not altogether peace marches either.

The media and social media are littered with footage from the previous marches of antisemism, homophobia, and violence towards individuals and the police. This coming Saturday's march is at least in part organised by people associated with Hamas and those who drove through North London a couple of years ago hurling abuse at Jewish people. None of that can be laid on the government, and it is happening all over the world. Much of it comes from young people who seem to have a completely one-sided and myopic view of the world.

You're right that something is broken, and that the relentless barrage of news is distressing - see this article from The Guardian today.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... l-and-gaza

I don't really have the energy for an argument but it's very difficult to put another perspective upon what Braverman etc are doing - everything about this government over the last few years has been driven by a need to create division as a diversion. All of the rhetoric around this weekend's events which inevitably will be turned into a battleground has come from the government and sadly some of the shadow cabinet.

All marches attract idiots - that doesn't mean we should do away with the right to protest and banning this weekends march would be the thin end of the wedge. As someone else said this week, we don't ban football crowds because a minority engage in violence or racism. And whilst you may not support the reasons behind this weekend's marches, there may come a day when you'll need to protest about something only to find that right has been removed from you.

[faldO]

I don't really have the energy for an argument...

Who's arguing? I've present a few opinions, a few facts, and agreed with you on a couple of points.

As someone else said this week, we don't ban football crowds because a minority engage in violence or racism.

Yes we do, that is why teams are sometimes required to play matches behind closed doors.

I'm not advocating banning marches completely, though I do think the one this weekend should be given serious consideration, both because of the timing and because of what has gone on over the past 4 weekends.

[ComeOnYouOs]

It's all irrelevant now, the march is going ahead, and that's the end of it.
The only way it could be stopped is if the government declared it a threat to national security, which it obviously isn't.