Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
LSN did you bother doing some research about this poor lady, that I highlighted in the original posting? Or is it too much for your brain ( if it exists )? You posting on here are totally off target. Focus, man!
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
No it does not
it might provide evidence that makes people believe today they are guilty. There are innumerable cases of people convicted beyond all reasonable doubt on scientific evidence said to prove their guilt that is later proved to be unreliable.
The Maguire Seven
Barry Bulsara
Stefan Kisko
to name a few
Even the so called DNA evidence is not as infallible as you are lead to believe.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
You're just inventing things now.
Lets come up with an example of something '100% proven' something there's video evidence, forensic evidence of. You'd think the death penalty inappropriate still?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Her case has been referred to the Criminal Cases Review commission, it is too early to say she is set to be exoneratedFriend or faux wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 10:13 pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-64879662
Wrongly hanged woman set to be exonerated for her alleged crimes.,,,,
Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
What do you think “I am against the death penalty” means?
But I love the idea that you consider “video evidence” to be a key factor.
But I love the idea that you consider “video evidence” to be a key factor.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Had an argument with a colleague about this once, and I thought I'd persuade her with 'innocent people will inevitably end up being executed', and she replied 'as long as 9 out of 10 are guilty, I think that's OK'. Had to just leave it.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
It could be, depends on the case doesnt it?
You have to admit that there's plenty of cases that are as provable as anything can be.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Spen 69:-Her case has been referred to the Criminal Cases Review commission, it is too early to say she is set to be exonerated
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You obviously have not researched this mis-carriage either; or you wouldn't have given such a crass response.
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You obviously have not researched this mis-carriage either; or you wouldn't have given such a crass response.
Last edited by Friend or fart on Wed Mar 08, 2023 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
You accused me of moving goalposts and yet you’ve gone from “100% proven” to “as provable as anything can be” (while also focusing on the probability and ignoring other factors you’d mentioned earlier such as severity of crime, potential for rehabilitation)Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 11:26 amIt could be, depends on the case doesnt it?
You have to admit that there's plenty of cases that are as provable as anything can be.
You’ve also not yet mentioned how it’d be workable to introduce tiers of guilt.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
In fairness to spedant, he's just making a factual distinction here. The story is that the case has been referred for review, not that a favourable decision will necessarily be made. I don't see how that's crass.Friend or faux wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 11:28 am Spen 69:-Her case has been referred to the Criminal Cases Review commission, it is too early to say she is set to be exonerated
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You obviously have researched this mis-carriage either; or you wouldn't have given such a crass response.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
So you admit that there's plenty of cases that are as provable as anything can be?
Every case is unique, are there no criminals in British history you'd give your approval to execute?
Every case is unique, are there no criminals in British history you'd give your approval to execute?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
With the improvements in deep fake tech you couldn't even rely on video evidence, nowadays.
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Since nothing can be proven according to ceb, then is it ethical to even lock people up?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Clearly. Because you can lock someone up because a case has been proven "beyond reasonable doubt" (which isn't 100%), secure in the knowledge that if you've got it wrong, you can open the cell door and make amends.Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:05 pm Since nothing can be proven according to ceb, then is it ethical to even lock people up?
How many jurors would be less inclined to convict, with even the tiniest bit of doubt, if they knew a guilty verdict would lead to execution? Do you want monsters roaming the streets?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
You cant give that person the time back though.StillSpike wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:07 pmClearly. Because you can lock someone up because a case has been proven "beyond reasonable doubt" (which isn't 100%), secure in the knowledge that if you've got it wrong, you can open the cell door and make amends.Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:05 pm Since nothing can be proven according to ceb, then is it ethical to even lock people up?
How many jurors would be less inclined to convict, with even the tiniest bit of doubt, if they knew a guilty verdict would lead to execution? Do you want monsters roaming the streets?
Do countries that have the death penalty have a problem with convicting 'monsters'?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/re ... -doubt.asp
In a criminal case, it is the job of the prosecution to convince the jury that the defendant is guilty of the crime with which he has been charged and, therefore, should be convicted. The phrase "beyond a reasonable doubt"
99% isnt really Guilty is it
Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
“You can’t give that person the time back”Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:16 pmYou cant give that person the time back though.StillSpike wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:07 pmClearly. Because you can lock someone up because a case has been proven "beyond reasonable doubt" (which isn't 100%), secure in the knowledge that if you've got it wrong, you can open the cell door and make amends.Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:05 pm Since nothing can be proven according to ceb, then is it ethical to even lock people up?
How many jurors would be less inclined to convict, with even the tiniest bit of doubt, if they knew a guilty verdict would lead to execution? Do you want monsters roaming the streets?
Do countries that have the death penalty have a problem with convicting 'monsters'?
…therefore, kill them?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Me, stuck in a Post Office queue: "well, guess I'll never get this time back, may as well end it all".
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
What is crass about stating a perfectly correct factual point.Friend or faux wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 11:28 am Spen 69:-Her case has been referred to the Criminal Cases Review commission, it is too early to say she is set to be exonerated
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You obviously have researched this mis-carriage either; or you wouldn't have given such a crass response.
The case has been referred to the Criminal Cases Review Commission.
They have to investigate the matter, then decide whether they believe there was a miscarriage of justice, THEN the Court of Appeal have to make a decision.
As I said it is too early to say she is set to be exonerated.
I am not saying anything about the outcome of the CCRC investigation, or if it goes that far, and application to the Court of Appeal
Looking at the CCRC's own figures, since it was set up in 1997, it has had 29,569 cases referred to it of those 809 were referred after investigation to the Court of Appeal and 548 of those appeals resulted in the convictions being overturned - 219 cases had convictions upheld. Some referrals still await determination by the Court of Appeal
So out of 29,569 cases referred to the CCRC, only 548 have resulted in convictions being overturned. That is around 1.8% of cases referred to the CCRC resulting in convictions being overturned.
I think the statistics say it is too early to say her conviction is set to be overturned.
https://ccrc.gov.uk/facts-figures/
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
CEB- Nope.
So are you in favour of imprisoning the potentially innocent?
So are you in favour of imprisoning the potentially innocent?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Are there revolving doors ?You might enjoy that .Proposition Joe wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:37 pm Me, stuck in a Post Office queue: "well, guess I'll never get this time back, may as well end it all".
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Can't recall seeing a Post Office with revolving doors but yes, that would be fun.
Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Yes.Long slender neck wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:39 pm CEB- Nope.
So are you in favour of imprisoning the potentially innocent?
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Re: Well, That Will Give Her Some Relief!
Obviously before your timeProposition Joe wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 12:53 pm Can't recall seeing a Post Office with revolving doors but yes, that would be fun.