Meat Loaf 'seriously ill with COVID-19' before death

[Rich Tea Wellin]

The vaccine IS stopping people getting Covid, that's why there are more cases amongst the unvaccinated. Obviously it's not 100 percent effective, but that's no reason to belittle it as useless, when it obviously isn't. No one needs to lose their job and livelihood unless they choose to by not taking the vaccine for no good reason

Define good reason

[Long slender neck]

How about you come up with a good reason? Id say maybe if theres a medical reason why you cant be jabbed would be acceptable.

It's like a firefighter insisting on turning up to work covered in petrol.

[Dunners]

Are we really risking losing valuable, hard working people who have probably seen some utterly horrible scenes in the last two years, and put the nhs under even more strain based on someone having two jabs 6 months ago that are no longer effective? Someone literally losing their job and livelihoods over something that isn’t stopping anyone get covid?

Nah, I've got to call you out on this.

1. We're not risking losing valuable, hard working people. The Venn diagram of anti-vaxers, and the kind of people most companies would actual love to get rid of is almost a complete circle. Think of the usual argumentative thickos who are always disruptive and/or lazy and/or toxic and/or f*cking too much hard work. It's very remarkable just how often they also happen to be the dinlows who refuse the vaccine because of "freedom".

And how do I know this? There’s loads of research on this, especially from the USA where private companies have been going down the vaccine mandate road for a while now. If even recently had this presented to me as my company is considering it's future vaccine policy.
This research is being widely shared by leadership teams across the world and we're rubbing our hands with glee that these f*ckwits are going to give us all our Christmases at once.

2. The vaccines are effective, just to varying degrees. But no matter, they're still more effective than NO F*CKING VACCINE!

3. And then there's this: "something that isn’t stopping anyone get covid." Wait, what? Why does this keep getting thrown out there as if it's some kind of valid counter argument? And why do the people that say this keep ignoring what they are told?

Being FULLY vaccinated helps reduce your risk of suffering from severe disease. That means two things. It reduces your risk of death. And it reduces the risk that you put the health services under avoidable pressure, which then puts other people at risk. Your freedom to not be vaccinated is you saying "f*ck you" to other people who may come to depend on health services.

Also, the vaccine does reduce the risk of you transmitting the virus to others. Multiplied over the population this can have an incredible accumulative effect. It will result in a lower rate of severe disease, death and undue pressure on health services.

Therefore, choosing to be unvaccinated, because freedom, means exactly the opposite. Across the population it means higher rates of severe disease. Higher rates of death. Higher demand on health services. Higher absenteeism. Higher f*cking everything.

So if sacking these c*nts puts the NHS under more pressure, then fine. Because, left to their own imbecilic devices, they and their ilk will do a lot worse.

[Max B Gold]

The vaccine IS stopping people getting Covid, that's why there are more cases amongst the unvaccinated. Obviously it's not 100 percent effective, but that's no reason to belittle it as useless, when it obviously isn't. No one needs to lose their job and livelihood unless they choose to by not taking the vaccine for no good reason

What if they fear an adverse reaction to the vaccine?

Is that a good reason? It's not undocumented in the medical publications.

[Dunners]

What if they fear an adverse reaction to the vaccine?

Then they're unpatriotic pus5ies who hate real freedom.

[tuffers#1]

And what about the personal freedom rights of those who are being prevented from getting hospital treatments for their own non Covid illnesses and diseases, held up by around the very high proportion of NHS ICU Covid patients who are not fully vaccinated against the Covid virus ? I wonder how many of these anti-vaxxers would refuse having the vaccine if they faced the prospect of non Covid treatment if they were proved to have refused the option of the vaccine ? Other countries are not such a ''Soft touch'' as the UK is. For just one instance, in Greece people over 60 years of age will soon have to start paying a 100 Euros a month fine if they have refused the vaccine, this is being enforced due to the large amount of un-vaccinated over 60s being admitted to hospital suffereing from Covid.

See below for just one example of this !

80% of patients admitted to Intensive Care Units in north east London in December not fully vaccinated'
https://northeastlondonccg.nhs.uk/news/ ... accinated/

Between 1 December and 31 December 2021, 124 patients with Covid-19 were admitted to intensive care units (ICU) across north east London (NEL). Of these, 80.6% (100) were not fully vaccinated (with 2 doses).

ICUs play an important role in hospitals, including looking after patients undergoing major surgery, for conditions such as cancer and heart disease.
Parjam Zolfaghari, a Consultant in Intensive Care Medicine and Anaesthesia at Barts Health NHS Trust said: “A considerable amount of resource is needed to treat patients in ICU, and those with Covid-19 are no exception. On average, a person with Covid-19 stays in an ICU bed for three times longer than ICU patients who are admitted with other conditions. The ongoing admission of patients with Covid-19 to critical care units is impacting on already stretched staff and, causing sustained pressure on services across north east London.”
He continues: “This clearly shows that getting two doses of a vaccine is the best way to reduce your chances of becoming seriously ill with Covid-19 and ending up in hospital. The individuals currently in our ICUs with Covid-19 are unlikely to have been admitted to intensive care if they had been fully vaccinated.”

You know there are 70000 nhs staff unvaccinated dont you Sid ?

Not doubting you Tuffers but that's crazy. I'd like to know the reasons why these NHS staff have chosen not to be vaccinated. Perhaps targeted education could then help to convince many to get the jab.

Its 3 % of the total nhs. Staff .

I couldnt give you a reason ,

I have heard on different phone ins 1 or 2 saying they are living 24/7 in care homes & are in contact with no one outside ( hard to believe really unless it was during full lockdowns ) also a few who have had covid & then have to wait before the vaccine can be administered, some will have health reasons .

As for the rest, your guess is as good as mine .

Cut off date is looming for the threatened sackings .

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck ... y-vaccines

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

We all know covid is more dangerous when you have other health issues.

We all know Covid is more dangerous when you aren’t vaccinated too.

[Rich Tea Wellin]

Are we really risking losing valuable, hard working people who have probably seen some utterly horrible scenes in the last two years, and put the nhs under even more strain based on someone having two jabs 6 months ago that are no longer effective? Someone literally losing their job and livelihoods over something that isn’t stopping anyone get covid?

Nah, I've got to call you out on this.

1. We're not risking losing valuable, hard working people. The Venn diagram of anti-vaxers, and the kind of people most companies would actual love to get rid of is almost a complete circle. Think of the usual argumentative thickos who are always disruptive and/or lazy and/or toxic and/or f*cking too much hard work. It's very remarkable just how often they also happen to be the dinlows who refuse the vaccine because of "freedom".

And how do I know this? There’s loads of research on this, especially from the USA where private companies have been going down the vaccine mandate road for a while now. If even recently had this presented to me as my company is considering it's future vaccine policy.
This research is being widely shared by leadership teams across the world and we're rubbing our hands with glee that these f*ckwits are going to give us all our Christmases at once.

2. The vaccines are effective, just to varying degrees. But no matter, they're still more effective than NO F*CKING VACCINE!

3. And then there's this: "something that isn’t stopping anyone get covid." Wait, what? Why does this keep getting thrown out there as if it's some kind of valid counter argument? And why do the people that say this keep ignoring what they are told?

Being FULLY vaccinated helps reduce your risk of suffering from severe disease. That means two things. It reduces your risk of death. And it reduces the risk that you put the health services under avoidable pressure, which then puts other people at risk. Your freedom to not be vaccinated is you saying "f*ck you" to other people who may come to depend on health services.

Also, the vaccine does reduce the risk of you transmitting the virus to others. Multiplied over the population this can have an incredible accumulative effect. It will result in a lower rate of severe disease, death and undue pressure on health services.

Therefore, choosing to be unvaccinated, because freedom, means exactly the opposite. Across the population it means higher rates of severe disease. Higher rates of death. Higher demand on health services. Higher absenteeism. Higher f*cking everything.

So if sacking these c*nts puts the NHS under more pressure, then fine. Because, left to their own imbecilic devices, they and their ilk will do a lot worse.

All fair points, some indisputable. I therefore take back what I said about there being no point to being double jabbed. However, being double jabbed does mean waining protection and I wonder where the law will stand in say 2 years time? Still can’t work for the nhs if you didn’t get two jabs 18 months before? Who knows.

In just incredibly uneasy about medical decisions being a prerequisite of a job. And even if there are valid reasons, it opens the doors for employers to have a legal right to your medical history, and societal pressure to make choices about your body.

On a separate point, it does make me laugh (not referring to you) how all of a sudden all these selfish righty idiots, who wouldn’t piss on their neighbour if they were on fire are spouting the “if you don’t get jabbed you are selfish”. The whole good of society thing is spot on, and is why I got jabbed personally, but for many it’s just a cover for them looking after themselves. They want the person next to them to be selfless, for their own good.

Either way, it’s interesting what history will make of this time and thanks for calling me out in a constructive way.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

As I’ve mentioned before, my ex is the clinical manager of the biggest ICU in London (and she’s a nurse, not an office type. She runs the place while on the ward, wearing scrubs like everyone else). Her rule is that everyone on her unit has to be double vaccinated and boosted. No exceptions. If you’re not, you don’t even come into the unit. That includes relatives, porters, cleaners, doctors and consultants.

Is it legal? I don’t know. But it’s her rule. She’s had literally hundreds of patients die over the last two years, and several staff, and she takes personal responsibility for each and every one. I make her right.

It’s obviously not legal.

If she was more interested in keeping her ward covid free, she’d be better insisting on a negative LFT before allowing admission rather than this symbolic Vaxxers Only rule.

[Stowaway]

As I’ve mentioned before, my ex is the clinical manager of the biggest ICU in London (and she’s a nurse, not an office type. She runs the place while on the ward, wearing scrubs like everyone else). Her rule is that everyone on her unit has to be double vaccinated and boosted. No exceptions. If you’re not, you don’t even come into the unit. That includes relatives, porters, cleaners, doctors and consultants.

Is it legal? I don’t know. But it’s her rule. She’s had literally hundreds of patients die over the last two years, and several staff, and she takes personal responsibility for each and every one. I make her right.

It’s obviously not legal.

If she was more interested in keeping her ward covid free, she’d be better insisting on a negative LFT before allowing admission rather than this symbolic Vaxxers Only rule.

You may well think that. But she’s a healthcare professional with almost 40 years experience, and you’re not. So I know whose opinion I’d rather trust.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

If you think she’s that great, you should marry her.

40 years of wiping arses and taking temperatures does not make you more qualified than anyone else in anything other than wiping arses and taking temperatures.

[tuffers#1]

If you think she’s that great, you should marry her.

40 years of wiping arses and taking temperatures does not make you more qualified than anyone else in anything other than wiping arses and taking temperatures.

if you think thats all that is done then what are those in pink uniforms doing on the wards ?

[tuffers#1]

The vaccine IS stopping people getting Covid, that's why there are more cases amongst the unvaccinated. Obviously it's not 100 percent effective, but that's no reason to belittle it as useless, when it obviously isn't. No one needs to lose their job and livelihood unless they choose to by not taking the vaccine for no good reason

What if they fear an adverse reaction to the vaccine?

Is that a good reason? It's not undocumented in the medical publications.

It is strange how this is overlooked.

There is a risk of illness or death from taking the vaccine.

But less risk of dying if you caught covid .

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

Depends on your age and which vaccine you’re talking about.

[Rich Tea Wellin]

Who’s this Ronnie Thordog?

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

I’m not a full on conspiraloon anti vaxxer like you and thorgey, I’m just not comfortable with people being told they have to get vaccinated or they’ll get sacked.

[Rich Tea Wellin]

It also doesn't make much sense considering the Tory's are abandoning all of the rules the make the strain on the NHS less. You have to be consistent.

[Chelmsford Swimmer]

Depends on your age and which vaccine you’re talking about.

I don't disagree that the vaccine may not be a 100% percent safe, there are a few examples when it hasn't been, but please quote one example, age and vaccine, when the vaccine is more dangerous than catching Covid.

[BoniO]

It also doesn't make much sense considering the Tory's are abandoning all of the rules the make the strain on the NHS less. You have to be consistent.

This government can't even spell consistent.

[Rich Tea Wellin]

Depends on your age and which vaccine you’re talking about.

I don't disagree that the vaccine may not be a 100% percent safe, there are a few examples when it hasn't been, but please quote one example, age and vaccine, when the vaccine is more dangerous than catching Covid.

Anyone who’s died after getting the vaccine?

A more interesting question will be around omi, it’s severity and anyone under the age of 30 where the risk is tiny of dying from covid.

[Long slender neck]

How many people have died from vaccination? Evidence please.

And your evidence must show people died 'from' vaccination, not just with vaccination. Also, anyone with an underlying health condition doesn't count.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

If you think she’s that great, you should marry her.

40 years of wiping arses and taking temperatures does not make you more qualified than anyone else in anything other than wiping arses and taking temperatures.

My apologies stowy if you, or anyone else, thought this was too far.

It’s obviously very much tongue in cheek, no offence meant.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

Depends on your age and which vaccine you’re talking about.

I don't disagree that the vaccine may not be a 100% percent safe, there are a few examples when it hasn't been, but please quote one example, age and vaccine, when the vaccine is more dangerous than catching Covid.

The dead people.

Of course the percentages are minute, but if you’re the 0.01% or whatever it is, that’s scant consolation. It’s 100% to you.

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

How many people have died from vaccination? Evidence please.

And your evidence must show people died 'from' vaccination, not just with vaccination. Also, anyone with an underlying health condition doesn't count.

Do you even read the information that is given to you every time you get jabbed?

Do you even understand and the big sums the scientists do to decide whether to roll out a vaccine or not, and to whom it should be rolled out to?

[BoniO]

Depends on your age and which vaccine you’re talking about.

I don't disagree that the vaccine may not be a 100% percent safe, there are a few examples when it hasn't been, but please quote one example, age and vaccine, when the vaccine is more dangerous than catching Covid.

The dead people.

Of course the percentages are minute, but if you’re the 0.01% or whatever it is, that’s scant consolation. It’s 100% to you.

I agree that it should be 100% up to the individual whether or not they get vaccinated. However, given that a personal decision not to have the vaccination does affect others, there need to be consequences for not having the jab. If you won't have a jab you should not have the same access to places where people are in close proximity to each other (compared to people who are fully jabbed). That seems logical to me.

This topic has all been discussed many times before but comes round again as night follows day. It's undeniable that having the jab protects you and others around you (we all know it's not 100% effective but even 1% effective is better than nothing ad it's a whole lot better than that).

However, I personally feel that if we were going to enforce laws which will most certainly result in people losing jobs then this should have already been done when we were in the worst throes of the pandemic. We're 2 years in and hopefully (early days I know) beginning to see the light at the end of the tunnel. The NHS is still under extreme pressure though. Given this, it seems bonkers to threaten the livelihoods of, mainly, the lower paid workers within the NHS. Especially when every NHS worker is desperately needed. The government needs to rethink this policy.