Dunners wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 2:51 pm
It was naive of him to go all defensive when making that statement. "Racism is bad, but..." is never a good look. And if he feels he needs to make the point alluded to in the penultimate paragraph... well, there's a time and a place. And this wasn't it.
Once again Jeremy demonstrates why he just was never savvy enough to cut it in the Premier League.
How can he respond to that without being defensive?
The point in his penultimate paragraph is absolutely what this is all about.
What did he really expect to achieve by saying that in the way that he did? Seriously? Was now the moment when he thought the scales would suddenly fall from everyone's eyes and the nation would realise he'd been right all along?
As a piece of public communication it's an absolute sh*t show. He's either been poorly advised throughout, or has ignored whatever advice he's been given - either way, once again, he's shown poor judgement.
And, assuming the point he is trying to make is wholly correct (I personally have no idea, although I certainly can see he's been stitched up to a certain degree), it's about knowing when and where to fight your battles. Once again, his judgement has been shown to be lacking. And this consistent demonstration of poor judgement erodes confidence in his other claims.
What else can he do?
Keep quiet - and have the media camped on his doorstep and Margaret Hodge trawl her arse around every tv studio demanding his resignation/imprisonment/death.
Put his hands up and say it's a fair cop - which it obviously isn't.
Or do what he's done, which is pretty much what he's done throughout, and respond honestly.
Bluecap wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:05 pm
Relax chaps you have got what you want
I definitely have not got what I want. I want a strong, decent Labour Party that can compete at general elections. What I’ve got is a shambles of a party that will take ages to become a serious option on Election Day.
I’m just glad the Corbyn nightmare is finally coming to an end.
You do remember labour had 2 parties to fight & the stories only had 1 .
Fadje & his brexit party made sure of that .
Hardly a free & air election to go on regardless of who led them
He's probably too old and not got the energy after the last bonkers 5 years, but he should do one and set up a new socialist party. He'd have 500,000 members by the middle of next week.
How can he respond to that without being defensive?
The point in his penultimate paragraph is absolutely what this is all about.
What did he really expect to achieve by saying that in the way that he did? Seriously? Was now the moment when he thought the scales would suddenly fall from everyone's eyes and the nation would realise he'd been right all along?
As a piece of public communication it's an absolute sh*t show. He's either been poorly advised throughout, or has ignored whatever advice he's been given - either way, once again, he's shown poor judgement.
And, assuming the point he is trying to make is wholly correct (I personally have no idea, although I certainly can see he's been stitched up to a certain degree), it's about knowing when and where to fight your battles. Once again, his judgement has been shown to be lacking. And this consistent demonstration of poor judgement erodes confidence in his other claims.
What else can he do?
Keep quiet - and have the media camped on his doorstep and Margaret Hodge trawl her arse around every tv studio demanding his resignation/imprisonment/death.
Put his hands up and say it's a fair cop - which it obviously isn't.
Or do what he's done, which is pretty much what he's done throughout, and respond honestly.
The alternative is to issue the statement, minus the penultimate paragraph, vowed to support the new Labour leader in all of his efforts, and then played the long game. To be fair to him, given his age and the mauling he's been through, I can understand why the prospect of the 'long game' would not be that attractive.
They've set a trap for him, which everybody could see, and he's just gone and stepped right into it.
How can he respond to that without being defensive?
The point in his penultimate paragraph is absolutely what this is all about.
What did he really expect to achieve by saying that in the way that he did? Seriously? Was now the moment when he thought the scales would suddenly fall from everyone's eyes and the nation would realise he'd been right all along?
As a piece of public communication it's an absolute sh*t show. He's either been poorly advised throughout, or has ignored whatever advice he's been given - either way, once again, he's shown poor judgement.
And, assuming the point he is trying to make is wholly correct (I personally have no idea, although I certainly can see he's been stitched up to a certain degree), it's about knowing when and where to fight your battles. Once again, his judgement has been shown to be lacking. And this consistent demonstration of poor judgement erodes confidence in his other claims.
Not everything is about managing the media Dunners. What he said is true. It's important to say it.
Point accepted. However, managing the media isn't unimportant either, unfortunately.
You want him to play the game but you can't when you haven't got any cards and they keep changing the rules. Anyways, this isn't about Jezza anymore, it's just about making sure no one else left of centre gets any silly ideas above their station.
Oh definitely. There's no way anyone other than a "safe pair of hands" is ever getting anywhere near the leadership of any mainstream political party in the UK ever again.
And by "they", I am referring to pretty much all other factions with the Labour party which are opposed to Corbyn and his supporters. Starmer was just waiting for an excuse to take this action.
My partner, has just cancelled her direct debit, and left the Labour party, after being a member for 52 years.
She's in floods of tears at this moment, after the disgusting treatment of Jeremy Corbyn.
What a f*cking stitch up this all is.
52 years all for nowt.
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:04 pm
My partner, has just cancelled her direct debit, and left the Labour party, after being a member for 52 years.
She's in floods of tears at this moment, after the disgusting treatment of Jeremy Corbyn.
What a f*cking stitch up this all is.
52 years all for nowt.
Thor wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:49 am
Whats funny is all the lefties on this board denying it all the way through. Maybe you're part of the problem as well?
Only the BNP has been found guilty previously lovely company to be keeping from a party founded against racism, how ironic.
RIP the Labour Party its now game over you bunch of nasty racists. I have racists more than most things.
Have you got proof of 'all the lefties denying it all the way through?'.
I hate liars too...
Not all. I got attacked for using the word rife With regard to anti semitism in Labour. Today I’m happy to retract that word and replace it with normalised. The term used by the Jewish Labour Party. Expresses my views perhaps a little better.
But I’m not concerned with history, the dirty washing is out there for all to see. What matters is how the party moves on from that disaster called Jeremy Corbyn.
You were pulled on it because you tarred a whole party and it’s membership with that accusation.
Are you saying that the report today confirms that to be correct? Anti semitism is still rife?
Oh and feel free to review our exchanges on this subject - I was quite clear in my criticism of Corbyns leadership and inability to deal with this issue.
Oh and the likes of Margaret Hodge, Alistair Campbell, Ian Austin etc who are today filling the airwaves need to consider how the rejection of their politics enabled Corbyn to happen at all.
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:04 pm
My partner, has just cancelled her direct debit, and left the Labour party, after being a member for 52 years.
She's in floods of tears at this moment, after the disgusting treatment of Jeremy Corbyn.
What a f*cking stitch up this all is.
52 years all for nowt.
Why was she still in it?
Good question. I left the party 2 days after Starmer won the leadership. I could see where it was all going, after that grovelling letter Starmer write to the Board of Deputies.
She said... And I quote " I want to give him (Starmer) a chance."
Finally today she ran out of patience. Better late than never eh?
Corbyn was a disaster and I wound up quitting the labour party over its handling of anti-Semitism, but this feels like a move that's going to guarantee a civil war in the party for at best marginal electoral gain. Rightly or wrongly, the sense of injustice on the left of the party is going to lead to a concerted effort to take over as many party mechanisms as possible and see the more moderate MPs all as traitors in need of purging. If that happens, the party will be locked out of power indefinitely.
All that said, Corbyn is lucky he wasn't expelled in the past for some pretty inexcusable behaviour. Whilst he may not be an antisemite, he has a massive blindspot on this issue and doesn't seem to understand why his actions, words and gestures could cause hurt.
ComeOnYouOs wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:04 pm
My partner, has just cancelled her direct debit, and left the Labour party, after being a member for 52 years.
She's in floods of tears at this moment, after the disgusting treatment of Jeremy Corbyn.
What a f*cking stitch up this all is.
52 years all for nowt.
“Floods of tears”
I think you and your partner need to be less invested in other people’s lives. Very unhealthy to obsess over things you have no control over
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:37 am
Dont worry.Sir Kier will sort it !
Whats funny is that the wet lettuce that is kier sat on labours from bench for quite a while and never said anything, never challenged steptoe once. I’d say he’s complicit in it as well or at best a dam hypocrite.
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:37 am
Dont worry.Sir Kier will sort it !
Whats funny is that the wet lettuce that is kier sat on labours from bench for quite a while and never said anything, never challenged steptoe once. I’d say he’s complicit in it as well or at best a dam hypocrite.
Oh thory , that wet lettuce destroys the clown in number 10 every week
During pmq's .
As Corbyn wasnt personally named in the findings
He could & should of left any statement untill monday ..
after discussions with the party leadership now
Hence why he was suspended for denying parts of the report .
Therfore the Labour Party are putting there house in order .
No messing about with live interviews in Rose Garden by Civil Servants etc
Last edited by tuffers#1 on Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ronnie Hotdogs wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:02 pm
It’s good that Kier has responded to this report so promptly and in such strong terms.
He did no such thing, stop dreaming. He is not responsible for suspending corbyn that is the responsibility of the general secretary and the party. At least get your facts rights.
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:37 am
Dont worry.Sir Kier will sort it !
Whats funny is that the wet lettuce that is kier sat on labours from bench for quite a while and never said anything, never challenged steptoe once. I’d say he’s complicit in it as well or at best a dam hypocrite.
He did internally, the factions over how Labour handled the crisis are well known and they don't fall on left vs right lines. McDonnell wanted Corbyn to adopt the IHRA definition of antisemitism because he thought the furore around it was killing Labour's ability to sell its programme.
It's worth reiterating that the leader of the Tory party is on record over and over again making racist, homophobic and sexist comments. It's a depressing indictment of standards that ECHR aren't looking into Islamophobia in the Tory party, which is well established by this point. Seems incredibly fake to get wound up by Labour's issues and to turn a blind eye to the Tory party's (and vice versa).
tuffers#1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:37 am
Dont worry.Sir Kier will sort it !
Whats funny is that the wet lettuce that is kier sat on labours from bench for quite a while and never said anything, never challenged steptoe once. I’d say he’s complicit in it as well or at best a dam hypocrite.
He did internally, the factions over how Labour handled the crisis are well known and they don't fall on left vs right lines. McDonnell wanted Corbyn to adopt the IHRA definition of antisemitism because he thought the furore around it was killing Labour's ability to sell its programme.
It's worth reiterating that the leader of the Tory party is on record over and over again making racist, homophobic and sexist comments. It's a depressing indictment of standards that ECHR aren't looking into Islamophobia in the Tory party, which is well established by this point. Seems incredibly fake to get wound up by Labour's issues and to turn a blind eye to the Tory party's (and vice versa).
Bluecap wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:05 pm
Relax chaps you have got what you want
I definitely have not got what I want. I want a strong, decent Labour Party that can compete at general elections. What I’ve got is a shambles of a party that will take ages to become a serious option on Election Day.
I’m just glad the Corbyn nightmare is finally coming to an end.
You do remember labour had 2 parties to fight & the stories only had 1 .
Fadje & his brexit party made sure of that .
Hardly a free & air election to go on regardless of who led them
