Cameron- look what you have done

[ComeOnYouOs]

How dare Cameron let the British public make decisions about their future.

Democracy is about stopping people having choices and stopping them having any say in their future ....

IMO there should never be referendums in our Constitution because we have a representative democracy. That means we elect people to represent us in parliament. If we don't like how they represent us, we kick them out at the next election.
This referendum was a gimmick by Cameron to try to boost his standing in the country . He was worried Farage was going to take Tory votes away, and this was a way to stop that.
The effect this would have on the country was something Cameron probably never even considered.

Party before country has always been the Tory way.
Now às the OP Says, millions of uninformed thickos, have cast the country into turmoil.
Cameron will never be forgiven for this act of recklessness.

[Long slender neck]

The turmoil is caused by politicians who refuse to implement the result of the referendum, not thicko voters.

[Still's Carenae]

The turmoil is caused by politicians who refuse to implement the result of the referendum, not thicko voters.

Agree.

[Howling Mad Murdock]

How dare Cameron let the British public make decisions about their future.

Democracy is about stopping people having choices and stopping them having any say in their future ....

It’s a good point but when not many people had a clue and that is a fact what Brexit meant we should not have voted without the full facts being given to us all.
Maybe just me but I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families, but yeah let’s vote anyway f*** it, what’s the worst that could happen????

I take it the vote doesn't suit you,you seem quite upset.

[spen666]

How dare Cameron let the British public make decisions about their future.

Democracy is about stopping people having choices and stopping them having any say in their future ....

It’s a good point but when not many people had a clue and that is a fact what Brexit meant we should not have voted without the full facts being given to us all.
Maybe just me but I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families, but yeah let’s vote anyway f*** it, what’s the worst that could happen????

Speak for your self about being ignorant.

I knew what Brexit involved...indeed the leaflet the Government sent to every household advised people top make their decision on the basis there would be a no deal Brexit.

The facts were out there and its amazing how many people couldn't be bothered to read the information they were sent and not claim that no one knew what Brexit involved.


You do not know the full facts in any election or referendum. Parties do not say what they are going to do every day for the next 5 years in a manifesto, so lets not have elections?

The position is that for whatever reason the majority of those who voted chose to leave. It sets a dangerous precedent to ignore results you do not like. If you dont like the idea of Brexit, then the democratic thing to do is to campaign to rejoin the EU, not to prevent the will of the people being implemented.

For example after the next election, imaging if the tories refused to leave downing street as they claim the public hadn't been given the full facts and that they didn't know what they were voting about! That is adopting the same anti democratic principle as the remain camp.

Democracy means accepting the result and implementing it irrespective of what your personal views are

[ContrifibulatoryFred]

I think Spen’s analogy is a good one.

But I also blame Cameron for having the vote in the first place.

Imagine if there was a referendum on bringing back hanging? Or criminalising homosexuality? Some decisions should not be put to ugly populist votes as their implications for society as a whole could be extremely damaging. We empower politicians to take responsible decisions.
In the case of Brexit what Cameron has done is put a seismic rift through the population - and for what end? Whatever happens now roughly 50% of the population (either way) are going to feel cheated

[Chief crazy horse]

But he had no idea whatsoever he was going to cause all this, and neither did the vast majority of politicians?

[Mick McQuaid]

If there was a sensible reflection of the referendum vote, a soft brexit where we sucked up the fact that we'd still need to pay into to the EU and accept freedom of movement (we'd already agreed that we didn't have to pay unemployment benefits for people arriving), then there would have been grumbles but i think it would have been accepted by both sides. This is what would have happened if Theresa May hadn't run auch a disastrous election campaign. Instead she tried to pander to the ERG to get an withdrawal agreed, which in the end was like trying to sate a pool of piranhas with a handful of peanuts. Nothing short of legally turning the clock back to 1955 would be good enough for them.

If it was 52-48 the other way would all these crusaders for democracy be saying fait enough if the interpretation of the referendum was to join the euro, give back the rebate and sign over our armed forces to Claude Junker?

"In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long" Nigel Farage, May 2016.

[DuvB]

I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families,
==========================================

If we stay in the EU, you wont get a chance to make ANY decisions for your family's future.

The EU Commission will continue to be in charge of all law making as currently and the new MEPs will just sanction as usual.

[Thor]

I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families,
==========================================

If we stay in the EU, you wont get a chance to make ANY decisions for your family's future.

The EU Commission will continue to be in charge of all law making as currently and the new MEPs will just sanction as usual.

Correct.

[Thor]

Just want to correct on one minor error you made.

The economy is quite strong, is growing and performing better than our continental partners.

Not quite
Brexit has cost the British economy £66bn in just under three years....

Proof?

The old left wing socialists don’t like to provide proof, they just want to throw out there these outlandish claims not supported by facts.

I think you’ll be waiting a long time for an answer.

[Thor]

The Tories and especially Cameron will go down in history as the party that ruined this country.
Self serving scum that they are, so much for uniting their party.
He has the same standing now for me as Thatcher.

Not sure how you define ruined? We have one of the most proporous countries in the world, mainly built by Tory rule. They have done a lot of good for this country.

If you want to argue it could be better because of xyz then I’d probably agree with you, but to throw out your assertion that they’ve ruined the country is just plainly not true. Of course you could say labour has ruined the country cos every time they leave office they leave the economy and finances wrecked. Again that would be to ignore some of the good things they would have done whilst in office.

Think before posting.

[Max B Gold]

The Tories and especially Cameron will go down in history as the party that ruined this country.
Self serving scum that they are, so much for uniting their party.
He has the same standing now for me as Thatcher.

Not sure how you define ruined? We have one of the most proporous countries in the world, mainly built by Tory rule. They have done a lot of good for this country.

If you want to argue it could be better because of xyz then I’d probably agree with you, but to throw out your assertion that they’ve ruined the country is just plainly not true. Of course you could say labour has ruined the country cos every time they leave office they leave the economy and finances wrecked. Again that would be to ignore some of the good things they would have done whilst in office.

Think before posting.

Labour don't always leave the economy and finances wrecked. That is a Tory myth repeated by numbskulls like you who permanently talk poo poo.

[Thor]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f*cked, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

[ComeOnYouOs]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

At least get your facts right...... It was Heath's Tory government that had the three day we week, not Wilson's Labour government

[RedDwarf 1881]

I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families,
==========================================

If we stay in the EU, you wont get a chance to make ANY decisions for your family's future.

The EU Commission will continue to be in charge of all law making as currently and the new MEPs will just sanction as usual.

Exactly. Anyway if we stay in it won't matter who's in Government because both main parties will end up doing what Brussels tells them to do.

[Max B Gold]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

Looks like when you quote historical "facts" you talk even more sh*t. The Financial institutions broke the country under Browns govt not the Labour Party. In fact if it wasn't for the swift decisive action by Brown and Darling to bail out the banks things would have been so much worse.

As COYO's points out it was a failed Tory govt who gave us the three day week. The state of the UK economy in the 70's was the legacy of deindustrialisation which started at the turn of the 20th Century and was excacerbated by profit taking by the capitalist class instead of investing.

[Max B Gold]

I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families,
==========================================

If we stay in the EU, you wont get a chance to make ANY decisions for your family's future.

The EU Commission will continue to be in charge of all law making as currently and the new MEPs will just sanction as usual.

Exactly. Anyway if we stay in it won't matter who's in Government because both main parties will end up doing what Brussels tells them to do.

What Laws does the EU make for the UK?

Can you explain how it works please so that we can try to understand how much actual bollox you are talking.

[Thor]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

At least get your facts right...... It was Heath's Tory government that had the three day we week, not Wilson's Labour government

You are quite correct and I stand corrected. Got my timelines mixed up.

[Thor]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

Looks like when you quote historical "facts" you talk even more sh*t. The Financial institutions broke the country under Browns govt not the Labour Party. In fact if it wasn't for the swift decisive action by Brown and Darling to bail out the banks things would have been so much worse.

However, you fail to acknowledge that the labour government of that time failed to regulate the same financial institutions that they were calling on to be more heavily regulated under the tories. Two wrong don’t make a right. They screwed up and then had to bail them out.

[spen666]

Not quite
Brexit has cost the British economy £66bn in just under three years....

Proof?

The old left wing socialists don’t like to provide proof, they just want to throw out there these outlandish claims not supported by facts.

I think you’ll be waiting a long time for an answer.

I had noticed @frogger hadn't responded yet to the simple request

[Max B Gold]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

Looks like when you quote historical "facts" you talk even more sh*t. The Financial institutions broke the country under Browns govt not the Labour Party. In fact if it wasn't for the swift decisive action by Brown and Darling to bail out the banks things would have been so much worse.

However, you fail to acknowledge that the labour government of that time failed to regulate the same financial institutions that they were calling on to be more heavily regulated under the tories. Two wrong don’t make a right. They screwed up and then had to bail them out.

So is this how it goes then. Businesses like banks cry out and complain about over regulation making their businesses unprofitable and globally uncompetitive. The solution they say is for less government oversight and self regulation. One or two query the self regulation but the banks respond by saying they are responsible adults and will manage it effectively because they are definately against distorting markets and want to protect customers. The govt of the day take their word for it but as soon as their backs are turned they lie, cheat and distort every piece of business available to them and rob their customers.

Labour should never have bought into self regulation and the light hand on the Tiller poo poo but it was the crooks in the banks who wrecked the economy and they're still at it to this day.

[tuffers#1]

Proof?

The old left wing socialists don’t like to provide proof, they just want to throw out there these outlandish claims not supported by facts.

I think you’ll be waiting a long time for an answer.

I had noticed @frogger hadn't responded yet to the simple request

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.indepe ... html%3famp

Here is proof of the study that took place if that helps .

[DuvB]

I like to get the full picture and all sides before making a major decision on my future and my families,
==========================================

If we stay in the EU, you wont get a chance to make ANY decisions for your family's future.

The EU Commission will continue to be in charge of all law making as currently and the new MEPs will just sanction as usual.

Exactly. Anyway if we stay in it won't matter who's in Government because both main parties will end up doing what Brussels tells them to do.

What Laws does the EU make for the UK?

Can you explain how it works please so that we can try to understand how much actual bollox you are talking.

Do your own research.

[tuffers#1]

Really max.

Wilson government is generally accepted it failed, 3 day working week, union problems etc
Callaghan’s government left the country f***, I’ve never seen it worse than when he left.
Blair and Brown left the famous sorry there’s no money left

These are the labour governments in my lifetime and each one failed and left the country in a worse position than what it inherited. That’s not just my opinion, but a historical fact.

At least get your facts right...... It was Heath's Tory government that had the three day we week, not Wilson's Labour government

You are quite correct and I stand corrected. Got my timelines mixed up.

I have laughed so many times @ people who spout about the 3 day week being a Labour problem
So much so someone wanted to fight me when i kept laughing at him when we were in a pub one Friday night about 5 years ago.

"You think its effing funny that Labour meant we had power cuts & my family had to eat jam sandwiches 2 days a week because we had to cut money "

I then told another friend to show him who was in power during the 3 day week period
With Google .

He got even angrier at me laughing at him but knew he could do nothing about it as
he called me a C*nt . One of the best belly laugh moments id had in a long while .