I get a strong sense from my daily conversations with colleagues that the adjustments, as painful as it will be, is happening.
Thanks for that, good article indeed. Sums up my feelings as well - the chances of everyone going back to commuting in packed transport into packed office buildings are zero.
In the future, only those who, for whatever reason, can't work effectively from home compared to an office will commute full-time. Those who are just as productive at home will mainly (or completely) work from home. The logic is inevitable.
A lot of jobs were outsourced overseas, such as helpdesks for utilities companies. There's been a move to bring these jobs back, if the number of companies referring to 'UK call centres' as a selling point for their services is anything to go by. On personal experience, I get a UK helpdesk more often than overseas now.
The company I work for has overseas ‘partner’ staff, India mainly. Some helpdesks have been brought back onshore though due to customer feedback.
Working in IT, we saw many roles vanish to be replaced by Indian outsourcing company staff some years back. As a rule around 90% of those staff are offshore, and that’s where the savings come, albeit working offshore hours is not always ideal for the business and they still require some proper face to face contact. So having 10% onshore with permie staff still seems a must - the onshore Indians actually cost more per head than the permie staff.
Working from home has been on increasing creep up for a while, covid has just accelerated it. It’s better for many (not all) staff, I personally prefer it with significant time and cost savings, and the company pays less out in accommodation costs, they’ve been pushing this anyway, so feels like win-win. Whatever the government might say about returning to the offices, if companies and employees are happy with increased working from home it’s really nothing to do with the government, they cannot halt that tide, what they and councils need to do is to accept reality and help address the inevitable consequences of it.
Theres absolutely no way i'll ever go back to commuting for 4 hours a day, 5 days a week. I'm pretty confident i'll be allowed to WFH at least 3 days, possibly even 4-5 and only go in when necessary.
There is something to be said though for 'being able to do your job effectively from home' when everyone else is at home, but that sometimes changes if some people are in the office and you not. Ever been on a conference call at home when you can hear about 3 of the 25 people in the room? In that scenario, if half the people are in the office and half are at home, you'd probably want them all to go on a conference call so everyone is equal and everyone can hear and then that leads to the question, why is anyone in the office to dial into a call? I suspect that a lot of companies will not only allow WFH but encourage it and call back into the office when that brings value i.e. all day workshops or important meetings.
A Pedant wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:26 pm
A lot of jobs were outsourced overseas, such as helpdesks for utilities companies. There's been a move to bring these jobs back, if the number of companies referring to 'UK call centres' as a selling point for their services is anything to go by. On personal experience, I get a UK helpdesk more often than overseas now.
This is true. I prefered when you got a nice Indian to speak to, at least you could understand them.Nowadays you need to speak fluent Jock of Geordie to have a chance of making a complaint.
One of the aspects of working from home as a permanent move is that the company still has the same requirement to meet Health & Safety levels compatible with the office. This to include support measures as working from home can cause increased stress - no peer support, potentially juggling childcare with work, etc.
The company also needs to ensure that the employee has a suitable work area, work desk and all associated equipment - to include appropriate seats (specialist if needed) at the companies expense. Broadband costs shouldn't need to be solely borne by the employee as the bulk of usage is likely to be for company use. If they can get away with it many companies may be "backwards in coming forwards" when it comes to providing all the correct equipment and due expenses.
Actually going to put myself in that category. I'm not unfit, but I work long hours so use 8 miles of walk to the train station and back plus bike rides on the other side as a way of keeping the flabby wolves from the fat door. in lieu of ever going to the gym. Plus my back is a mess from working in bed more often than I should.
A Pedant wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:26 pm
A lot of jobs were outsourced overseas, such as helpdesks for utilities companies. There's been a move to bring these jobs back, if the number of companies referring to 'UK call centres' as a selling point for their services is anything to go by. On personal experience, I get a UK helpdesk more often than overseas now.
This is true. I prefered when you got a nice Indian to speak to, at least you could understand them.Nowadays you need to speak fluent Jock of Geordie to have a chance of making a complaint.
Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:14 pm
Wonder what the health implications wil be for some of the slobs refusing to return to the office?
If the commute was their only exercise and now they can just set an alarm for 08:55 and work from bed then their health will suffer
The same slobs who probably drove to the station, sat on a train, sat at a desk, then did the same thing at home? Lazy is lazy.
Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:14 pm
Wonder what the health implications wil be for some of the slobs refusing to return to the office?
If the commute was their only exercise and now they can just set an alarm for 08:55 and work from bed then their health will suffer
The same slobs who probably drove to the station, sat on a train, sat at a desk, then did the same thing at home? Lazy is lazy.
If you read my post, I wasn't referring to those people.
It's a good point, DCC. I've had to establish a bit of discipline and force myself to go on at least a 30 minute walk before I start work, during lunch, and after work too. I found that if I didn't do that, by the end of the day, my head felt like it was going to implode and my waist was going to explode.
Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:14 pm
Wonder what the health implications wil be for some of the slobs refusing to return to the office?
If the commute was their only exercise and now they can just set an alarm for 08:55 and work from bed then their health will suffer
The same slobs who probably drove to the station, sat on a train, sat at a desk, then did the same thing at home? Lazy is lazy.
If you read my post, I wasn't referring to those people.
Fair enough. its something to be mindful of but shouldn't have an impact on WFH culture in the future. Everyones responsible for their own exercise. Personally, I think it gives me the time to do more exercise than i did before. Definitely noticed more people running as well since lockdown started.
The same slobs who probably drove to the station, sat on a train, sat at a desk, then did the same thing at home? Lazy is lazy.
If you read my post, I wasn't referring to those people.
Fair enough. its something to be mindful of but shouldn't have an impact on WFH culture in the future. Everyones responsible for their own exercise. Personally, I think it gives me the time to do more exercise than i did before. Definitely noticed more people running as well since lockdown started.
I'd wager the definite uptick in visible runners is more a product of the gyms being closed and people being worried about what was assumed to be a respiratory disease than the fact people are WFH.
It's certainly a benefit for people that, as you say, can manage their fitness. Given the fact that pre-COVID the UK was one of the most sedentary countries in Europe already (36% of adults doing zero exercise) I fear things will get worse.
How refreshing to read a thread of largely intelligent conversation and debate. Must be all these white collar professionals finally finding something to bond over that also doesn't interest people who think Ross Embleton is a good manager.
I still think the "Death of the Office" thing is a touch overdone tbh, and the truest test of the productivity question will only come when we see some firms with a more assertive approach to being in the office measured against competitors who are more relaxed about it.
For me, the most interesting part of this is now the knock-on effects to the commercial property market, and how that could destabilise the existing order in other ways. For real change to happen in this country, it usually needs the middle classes to rebel - and we might be about to see some of that happening...
^ I pretty much agree with that. There will eventually be some bounce back to normality. It's just a question of; to what degree? Open market competition will undoubtedly be a significant factor in deciding that, but people will be reluctant to give up many of the gains that WFH has brought.
Had an email today from the big boss at my workplace (a university) downplaying the risks and telling us how important our presence is to students and the community. It's obvious what he would like to happen and I think the pressure will be ramped up over the remainder of 2020 with a return for most expected in 2021
What about the reverse situation - people who want to go back to the office but are told by their company that they cannot.
Some people don't want to work from home indefinitely (too many distractions, poor infrastructure, just find it difficult without the face to face interaction). I know of people who have been told they cannot go back to the office until at least 2021, despite wanting to.
I realise it's incumbent upon an employer to put in place the necessary health and safety measures before people can go back in numbers, but I expect some do so with more enthusiasm than others, especially given the potential cost savings on offer.
WickfordO wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:55 pm
It is all very well working from home but would the companies agree to pay for:-
Electricity
Heating
Computer hardware and maintenance
Software and its security and maintenance
Telephone line(s)/Internet
Part of the council tax
Cost of converting a room to an office so the employee can concentrate on their work, if they have the room to spare.
People should not just say "great I'd love to work at home", without asking for renumeration, so the company can cut its overheads and reap the benefits.
I also think that a lot of people wouldn't want to work from home mainly because you can get away from work at the end of the day whereas working from home they would feel "obliged" to carry on and work extra for nothing.
Heard someone went to renew his house insurance and added that filling out the form he came across the question” Do you use your property for business purposes which he said Yes because his company said he could work from home during Covid 19. The result was his insurance went up by around £100.. This raises the question for anybody now working at home whether your existing home insurance covers you or should your be covered on your employers insurance
